Another run across America underway - is it legit? Boots currently on the ground

In my Strava logs I do observe stretches where my heart rate gets "locked" to some "unnatural" value for some time. and this "some time" can be anything from one mile to half of the run or more. I guess the watch lost signal or had poor signal. It typically happens when I run fast, but sometimes also when I am jogging; it also seems to happen more often when the sun shines. Maybe in this particular instance it is because of fraud, I don't know, but in a court of law, I would not feel confident claiming "guilty" based solely on this data. The fact that the data looked better once you pointed out the discrepancy may also be explained by them taking extra care to make sure the heart rate monitor was working during the run.

40 miles in 8 hours Pete.

This is what Dan hit for his 8 hour tranches at Jogle:

52 44 46 42 44 39 43 39 45 37 45 27 42 41 41 38 36 15 34 32

So 39.1 to be precise. And this guy is at 37 off 7 on day 16. A total unknown.

I think it's ludicrous of numerous people to say "well he's going less far so of course he can keep up with world class multidayers..."

I get this argument a lot and it makes my blood boil.

Say you have a 13 minute 5k man and an 18 minute 5k man. You start them in a race, but the 18 minute man only has to do 5k. The 13 minute man has to do 10k. Who will be the first to 5k?

Well, we know the 5k man will get there in 18 and the 10 k man will pass through in about 13:48.

That's the quality of argument I've been wrestling with. That this unknown Instagram influencer is keeping up with the likes of Lawson and Rakonczay [who are doing way shorter races] because he's going less far of a day.

Sorry, no chance.

Multiday running isn’t 5ks and 10ks. It’s about time off feet. Dan had very little time off feet, this guy would have over 2x, which is why he would be able to maintain 50 miles. In the time it seems you’ve invested in this you could just do what we did with RY and go in person lol.

pete, you're right that the thread title is hyperbolic and that the paces/distances are plausible, but saying "...if someone was faking strava data, they wouldn’t select ridiculous heart rate numbers" is to assume goodge has really thought this through. for all that he's done some long runs, he seems naive and clearly didn't expect his runs to be scrutinised.

tbh will c's confidence that he's a fraud seems a bit strong but your confidence that all is well seems unfounded too.

all that's certain is that the entertainment value of these plonkers screaming bloody murder at will c is great.

Agreed. At the end of the day, finding up people that can show up and run with him is the best way to verify the run. I am planning to do so, when he'll be near my town.

Given the damning data, both heart rate and speed/distance covered, you would think Goodge and his team would take every opportunity, spare no expense, to use other sensor systems, use more than one, use chest straps, etc., to make sure to settle this issue.

But I don't see that that has happened.

Hi Folks. If you want more people on LetsRun putting eyes on this, you need to change the thread title to something simpler and more descriptive. The current thread title doesn’t communicate what is going on here and 99% of LetsRun is not clicking.

Contact Rojo and tell him to change thread title to, “Another fake run across America underway right now? (William Goodge - looking very suspect)”

I might be able to get out there next week. What's the gofundme for gas money look like??

This thread has been riveting. I'll chip in $20.

Imagine how awkward that will be.

"Errrrr...hi Will. Can I...like...run with you?"

"Do you think I'm full of s**t or for real"

You'd definitely say for real if you wanted to avoid long awkward silences. I'd join at the end of the day for the beer.

P.s. I wonder what the code of conduct is? I'm not being an ass here.

Don't run too fast? Stick at WG's pace?

Or...

Don't be reporting back.

Fascinating stuff, whichever way it goes...

who else thinks petekostelnick isnt?

Just to say, the International who ran with WG has sent me his watch. His HR was 133-169 and he found the whole thing brutal. Said they got fried.

After their 9 miles and he left, the pace was maintained by WG, at you guessed it, 110s.

But PK says I am being laughable to read anything into that.

What can I do?

True. Dan was turning out 83 mile days to Will's 52. I also agree that this is being made out to be a bigger deal than it is. It is not even actually the British record. A guy called John Lees walked it in 1972 in 54 days. Not many people have run 50+ miles a day, mainly because not many try, but with decent training, most runners could. I think wrist heart rate is not a strong enough case on its own. Your own strava for the transcon doesn't show hr - I don't know if it is recorded elsewhere. The difference, though, is experience and previous form. People knew you and your capabilities so didn't doubt it was legit. John Lees, too, was a well-known race walker who represented his country. WG has come out of nowhere with minimal training (1500 miles in a year) and an arrogant attitude. His camp have responded to questions with sweary aggression. He may well be doing it all legitimately, but there is a lot that is reminiscent of previous runs that have turned out to be anything but.

I was thinking the same thing. I ignored the title many days.

Lets run lives for stuff like this but it isn't obvious what this thread is all about.

This. I read most of the posts and I’m still not sure what is happening. Is this in the US? Is Goodge his name or the name of a place/event. Where is information on his route and his current position? This thread is 90% talking about splits and hr data with almost zero context.

Looking at yesterday's run (day 17) you can see that for the last stage of the run, he was walking constantly from approx. mile 32 until the end, and his HR during this walk was 110-125 for the most part excluding breaks. Note that a big chunk of this was walking downhill too. Contrast that to day 10, when he ran+walked uphill for 6 hours with a range of 105-120 mostly. I was doubtful at the first but after seeing this there is no doubt something fishy is going on.

I do have some possible theories as to what could be happening behind the scenes here that I've been thinking about:

1) Assuming the data he puts on Strava is genuine (not manufactured or edited) he could be getting separate sources for heart rate and GPS data. For example, he could be running with some type of chest strap which measures heart rate and cadence for him, while someone else (or the car) has the watch and records the GPS track. This would open many possibilities for him: e.g. riding a bike, treadmill inside the van, etc. (Perhaps this is what is being done, and out of fear from accusations he decided to "run" day 17 with clean data and no cheating)

2) Also assuming data is accurate, he could simply be passing around the watch to other runners and "taking turns". However, this is unlikely since the data from runs where he was accompanied by someone else is also not 100% clean, and he wouldn't be able to pull this off with them seeing this (unless they've been paid to not tell - but this makes no sense on his end)

3) Then there is also the possibility that everything that is on Strava is completely manufactured, and is simply the result of overlaying the GPS tracks that the team did throughout the day, with cadence and heart rate measurements. Again for this, I also find it quite hard to believe, since it's a lot of effort and besides, if they are doing this, why not just post "believable" HR data?

All in all, I think something weird is going on, but the evidence against him needs to be more concrete. It's not robust enough to blame him for inconsistent HR data, so there needs to be a more systematic way to prove the inaccuracies and unclean data. It may well have to be video evidence after all that will do it, like in the previous cases we've seen commented here.

unless i'm missing something, he seems to have started the day a fair chunk up the road from where he finished the previous day on a number of occasions. seems a bizarre way to discredit yourself as it's so obvious and i'm happy to be put right if i'm misreading the situation. surely you need to start the next run where you finished the last one though?

I thought the last 13 miles yesterday had an oddity. His pace shows he was walking for most of it. 14+ minute miles. But he does have some stretches where the pace picks up a bit. Maybe from faster walking or slight shuffling. But his cadence shows very little change. Stays under about 135.

I too am looking forward to seeing Goodge come apart like a cheap suit, but I respectfully disagree with your assessment of Robert Young. What he did, in terms of fabricating a backstory, writing a self-aggrandizing "autobiography" that belongs in the fiction section, gulling sponsors into backing him and various media outlets to promote him, meticulously planning a cross-country route (and the methods to cheat), and assembling a support crew to aid and abet his fraud was certainly not the work of someone who is "just a bit of an idiot." That all took a lot of time, thought, and effort, and reeks of calculated, sociopathic malice aforethought.

Like all good con artists, Young succeeded in charming the gullible into thinking that "such a nice guy" couldn't possibly be capable of a money drop scam, deed theft, door-to-door grifting...or a fake transcon run. And there's nothing "harmless" about such heinous individuals.