Another run across America underway - is it legit? Boots currently on the ground

I'm looking for precedent... something... anything, that could possibly point to that 8K streak being true. So far all we have is by far and away the best Transconner in history coming close; and not a particularly fair comparison as he's reducing his norm by around 10%, but this is by 30%. When has this happened before?

What Goodge and Balenger are doing in most facets of their running is unique, yet I get blasted for pointing it out. Who returns 10% clean data over 10,000k over a period of 4+ years and at very specific events and up to six different watches? Who negative splits three enormous multidays in a row? Who runs 45 mins for 8k very deep into a multiday, and after 60k of the day - espcecially when their norm is 60+ mins?

I don't see why the word history is so taboo... There are infinite examples in sport where it's fine to say it... "No-one in history did this, or did that..." and they're instantly accepted. If you give me precedent for any of the above three issues, I am happy to withdraw the hoopla and downgrade to 'fantastically rare'.

Apart from the crazy odds, which I can't do the math on, this is very, very suspicious, right?

Also, an excellent point.

I had to get my son to help me who does further maths. But yes, who the heck - in history [boooo, baaaahh, string me up] - has returned such a sequence for an 8k stretch? Having just done a clearly top class one [52 mins] literally the one before and then follows it up with a couple of 6:30s!

Just to defend it as poor pacing is a cop out. You've got to be able to do it in the first place! Sub 6s at multiday are pretty excruciating, and incredibly rare, and sub 5.15s... yikes.

But I guess it'll come down to the same old b/s by the supporters: "Meh, we can all run 45 for 8k."

Except you are missing the point that all of this started on WillC questioning the very low heart rates. And 90% of this run seems to be very low heart rate. And the heart rate hasn’t changed when people have run with him. There is no consistent explanation of what could be going on. Has he actually got the low hr and the mules are the ones with higher ones? Or is this all about data creation in which case, could they not find a techie who could put up some believable hr along with the rest of the data. And why did they throw in that 45 that WillC is getting all exercised about? What is your theory for what is happening?

I gave you a great example from history, but your response - that's too history :)

Ok, so for this comparison. How far would someone need to run daily for it to count? Would someone running 50 km a day for over two weeks and maintaining a 6.30 km pace be comparable?

How can you establish that the runner's watch recorded accurate data? This can easily be attributable to a watch error.

GPS watch data, in and of itself, is not reliable enough to discredit what this guy is doing.

My response was that it was a head to head track marathon on the last day in front of 10,000, very akin to the famous climax of Flanagan's Run. All a world removed from this situation.

Ah, ok, the Coros is now ballsing up both the pace AND the HR... even though the little Strava tracker moves perfectly along the course, matching the time to the place.

But ok, tech fail - it's more believable than - 'he felt amazing and had a really good spell'.

But of course GPS watch data is not the only thing wrong with this. We all know that. Never fatiguing... endless perfect days... negative splits galore... performance totally out of whack with his ability, three negative splits in a row for them for two transcons and a Jogle. Averaging far, far better times when the watch doesn't work to when it does, etc, etc. Ie for the 48/30, clean data was a 5:06 avg marathon and unclean was 4:41.

50k is dreadfully skinny, no?

Just checking back to see if anyone has proven that this guy is cheating. Or has the attempt ended?

What's the skinny?

And no, heart rate data doesn't prove anything.

The problem is not with the word "history", the problem is another, much misunderstood word "falsifiability". You are making unfalsifiable claims because we don't have a searchable database of the splits for every multi day event in the history of the world. So when someone says "Kipchoge has run the fastest marathon in history" that is a positive, falsifiable claim against the extant records. Nobody can claim with certainty that nobody in the history of the world ran the same distance faster, but with what we know it is a safe claim. Note how I don't make up bogus odds about how likely it is.

And how about the 58 mile day three days previously when Salo ran 9:09, or 9:26 min mile elasped pace for the whole day)?
And dismissing the last day as' just a track marathon' when he was running 7:35 pace to Goodge's 9 minute mile that you are getting so excited about, is just ridiculous.

Ok, I accept the thrust of your argument, but some things can be stated pretty confidently regardless of searchable databases! Yes, I use big language, but these boys are making huge claims. If you wish, I I will dumb down to "I am enormously confident that no-one in history has improved their recognized pace by 30% in a race, or run massive negative splits at huge multidays so regularly, or returned 10% clean data for 4 years at very specific events for a distance of some 10,000kms, when they return clean elsewhere. If so, whom?"

Now your claims look much more credible. There is a law of diminishing returns with hyperbolic claims as any shrewd observer knows that if one has sound evidence, one doesn't need hype.

Out of curiosity I just checked some of Hellah Sidibe's transcon two years back. He is a 3 hour marathoner and has run for 5 years every single day. Safe to say he has a strong aerobic base.

His data looks normal. 13-14 pace per mile. Only averaged about 40 miles per day. But his heart rate was 130-145. And he gave a summation of each day where he spoke about the difficulties, pain and setbacks.

I guess Will is just a super human runner with much less mileage. And/or NuCalm is a freekin miracle!

Was obviously a momentous occasion, but it is still just a marathon. WG has gone ballistic after 71k. It all sounds pretty epic, but also very odd... the crossing was 75 days... it was regimented stages not overall time, ie the winner is 525 hours not 1800. Sounds like there were plenty of rest days [perhaps 15 to 20] and really low mileage days etc. The comparison is simply too obscure.

I know a book was finally written, and Roger's review is great, I got an email from him last week; but the whole thing sounds nuts with nobody getting their prizemoney, endless cheating, the organizer a fraud, it being run through the mud for a lot of it. It hear what you're saying, sounds like these guys were beasts, but at the same time, I know exactly what people were doing in the 1920s as I researched it for my marathon book, and it's just very dangerous to compare this to that. We simply don't have the specific details and this was all long forgotten about before being revived.

Thank you maestro. Of course I am not perfect and this has been a hell of a mission. But so many are upset about what's gone on here, and we really need to protect the integrity of our sport at all costs; and ensure the social media influencers with very little talent can't just waltz into running, turn pro, and claim world record after world record, and national records before they've even bloody done it!!