That said from the very little content you did describe, sounds like Princeton did break the rules if say they all jogged an 8k in well over 30 minutes for example.
Once again: WHAT rule in a non-NCAA championship meet did they break?
Unfortunately correct. It’s up to us on this thread to continue this conversation and make sure athletes know what they are getting into committing to and running for Princeton. Current athletes will keep running, but if the narrative around the program changes, they will struggle recruiting.
That is unless something bad comes for Vig first…………….
This thread is so stupid and pointless. There are like maybe 20 people posting on here, most of the haters will never make it to the competitive D1 level. Princeton has made it to Nationals pretty consistently in the recent years, which is more than most Ivy League school can say. Nobody cares besides you miserable kids.
Academics are more demanding, and to be honest these kids place academics at the top of their priority list, that’s why they’re at Princeton.
A few years ago so many people hated on Harvard for wearing super shoes at XC regionals when they were on the road, they felt like the rich cheated their way to the big dance. They ended up taking 15th and all the haters, once again like always, stayed mediocre and mad. Those guys are now either
a) making 150-300k a year
b) running at a elite level
c) going to grad school to continue their privileged generational wealth.
And the haters stay mad and mediocre on this message board. I’m now rooting for Princeton to make it to nationals :) if it will make others piss their pants that will never be on the starting line at NCAA D1 XC nats.
This is an all-time idiotic rant.
Fans of college cross country can't show their displeasure with coaches sandbagging competitions because the student-athletes from the schools involved typically go on to get graduate degrees and earn a lot of money?
Would the carping be justified if the the sandbagging school had crappy academics? And how does it help the kids' academics by running 4min/km rather than a full effort?
The meet was on a Saturday afternoon. No class or school obligations need have been missed. Do you object to all the meets held on Fridays?
Ooooo someone finally knows something and is deflecting!
But actually I hit some of those requirements laid out for Ivy guys: mid to upper tier D1 (granted 10 years ago) and in the 150-300k range for salary.
Princeton will make nationals and my guess is perform really well. I think they have a nice team there. But facts are facts and we can’t ignore what’s happening over there
I have a quick question. How slow is too slow? If they all ran a minute faster, still too slow? What if they decided to beat one kid? At what point are the other coaches and athletes allowed to feel disrespected? It’s already been explained that Harvard wasn’t running their A team, but no one seems to think that’s disrespectful. But some people think purposefully running slower as a pack is disrespectful. Where do you snowflakes want to draw the line?
Great question and if that was part of the debate, it would have a million posts and be a heated debate right now. What Princeton did isn’t even close to that line for anyone so it not in the conversation.
For anyone? Because there’s a few people here for which they didn’t even cross the line so that’s just incorrect. Personally, I don’t think they did anything wrong. I love the sport as much as anyone (probably more) but I don’t get all uppity about the sanctity of it. If a team wants to flub a race, it only affects them. It couldn’t matter any less and yet people here are actually offended by it. It’s ridiculous.
Unfortunately correct. It’s up to us on this thread to continue this conversation and make sure athletes know what they are getting into committing to and running for Princeton. Current athletes will keep running, but if the narrative around the program changes, they will struggle recruiting.
That is unless something bad comes for Vig first…………….
This thread is so stupid and pointless. There are like maybe 20 people posting on here, most of the haters will never make it to the competitive D1 level. Princeton has made it to Nationals pretty consistently in the recent years, which is more than most Ivy League school can say. Nobody cares besides you miserable kids.
Academics are more demanding, and to be honest these kids place academics at the top of their priority list, that’s why they’re at Princeton.
A few years ago so many people hated on Harvard for wearing super shoes at XC regionals when they were on the road, they felt like the rich cheated their way to the big dance. They ended up taking 15th and all the haters, once again like always, stayed mediocre and mad. Those guys are now either
a) making 150-300k a year
b) running at a elite level
c) going to grad school to continue their privileged generational wealth.
And the haters stay mad and mediocre on this message board. I’m now rooting for Princeton to make it to nationals :) if it will make others piss their pants that will never be on the starting line at NCAA D1 XC nats.
This is by far one of the most cringy and insecure things I have ever read on Letsrun. No one here is saying Princeton is a bad school. People are complaining that these 800 guys jogged a meet at 6:30 pace. People were rightfully disappointed that they entered a meet and made a joke about it. This is like if a football team had an early season game and they just stood there and let the other team score over and over again. Your post screams insecurity. I’m assuming you’re either one of these kids or an alumni of the team. Ivy League school or not something in your life is missing and you’re compensating by bragging about how great your school is.
This thread is so stupid and pointless. There are like maybe 20 people posting on here, most of the haters will never make it to the competitive D1 level. Princeton has made it to Nationals pretty consistently in the recent years, which is more than most Ivy League school can say. Nobody cares besides you miserable kids.
Academics are more demanding, and to be honest these kids place academics at the top of their priority list, that’s why they’re at Princeton.
A few years ago so many people hated on Harvard for wearing super shoes at XC regionals when they were on the road, they felt like the rich cheated their way to the big dance. They ended up taking 15th and all the haters, once again like always, stayed mediocre and mad. Those guys are now either
a) making 150-300k a year
b) running at a elite level
c) going to grad school to continue their privileged generational wealth.
And the haters stay mad and mediocre on this message board. I’m now rooting for Princeton to make it to nationals :) if it will make others piss their pants that will never be on the starting line at NCAA D1 XC nats.
This is by far one of the most cringy and insecure things I have ever read on Letsrun. No one here is saying Princeton is a bad school. People are complaining that these 800 guys jogged a meet at 6:30 pace. People were rightfully disappointed that they entered a meet and made a joke about it. This is like if a football team had an early season game and they just stood there and let the other team score over and over again. Your post screams insecurity. I’m assuming you’re either one of these kids or an alumni of the team. Ivy League school or not something in your life is missing and you’re compensating by bragging about how great your school is.
Stay mad and slow.
Everybody posting on this thread and cringey and insecure bud. They feel entitled to be mad about a meet in the beginning of September, something is obviously missing in your and the others life to be mad about a cross country meet and Princeton for not meeting your “fantasy” expectations.
There’s a clear line between fans and insecure haters who come here to post and gossip about anything that doesn’t suit their expectations.
I’m rooting for Princeton to compete at the big stage, the stage you and others on this thread were never good enough to compete in :)
Maybe they’ll wear the bright beanies like they did the year I raced them, while you watch and get mad at a team who recruits fast people but can’t perform at a high level you expect them to.
No other NCAA sport would tolerate the type of obvious tanking that took place today at HYP.
Princeton and their coaches should be embarrassed. If you don’t want to race, just pay the fine and move on. Princeton alum should be embarrassed.
I’m on the Princeton women’s team and just want to say that you don’t know what you’re talking about. We have a plan for the season and we’re going to stick to that plan.
Also, I think this entire thread is outrageous and insulting to such an institution as ours.
My partner is on the men’s team and I know from first-hand experience how much character, poise, and tenacity the men’s team has. And quite frankly, that Princeton University has. Which is more than could be said about any of you.
My take on this is basically that yeah it's kinda scummy to do this as it's against the spirit of the sport, but the takes like this are even more wild. Former Vig athletes such as Robby Andrews and Leo Manzano are some of the nicest people in the sport despite being poisoned by their coach who made his athletes mail in a race once lol.
Why does every Ivy Leaguer feel the need to tell Letsrun that they went to an Ivy? This whole thread is a bunch of 50 year old men who went to Cornell decades ago complaining about the purity of the sport. You guys don’t look smart when you do this.
Hey hey. As someone who is close' to that age and loves Cornell and went to Princeton and considers himself a friend of both the Princeton and Harvard coaches, I'm offended by your comment.
I have a hot take on this one but want to sleep on it before I go on an epic Rojo Rant. For the record, I believe Wejo was at the meet as I got a video of him from it.
I'm going to filter myself for the time being. Let all my opening day NFL beers clear the system before I rant, if i do.
But can someone make sure I have all the facts? Based on weldon's video, Princeton clearly ran a c team who didn't even try and was laughing about it. But what about Harvard? Was this a B team that tried? Or a C team? How many eligible, healthy guys sat out? And did all of the guys who ran give 100% effort?
I guess succintly what I'm asking is this - Tell me what # on the team were the guys that ran for both Princeton and Harvard and if they gave 100% effort. Same thing for Yale.
No offense to my all my yale buddies - I once said I had two dream jobs in life - Texas basketball caoch or Yale xc coach - but i have a real hard time believing yale is better than harvard or princeton at anything related to running.
I'm still waiting for Rojo's followup post/rant...
I think everyone may want to ask the runners on the team how they feel about Vig and the program. The HYP meet used to be later in the season, but with NCAA Regionals and the way teams qualify for it based on results after Oct 1, it’s a useless meet.
Let’s have the season unfold and see what the Princeton, Harvard and Yale teams do at Heps, Region and Nationals.
Harvard based on their excellent up front talent and depth should have a great year. Princeton will field a very competitive team and will make Nationals. Best of luck to Yale with their young team.
I think everyone may want to ask the runners on the team how they feel about Vig and the program. The HYP meet used to be later in the season, but with NCAA Regionals and the way teams qualify for it based on results after Oct 1, it’s a useless meet.
Let’s have the season unfold and see what the Princeton, Harvard and Yale teams do at Heps, Region and Nationals.
Harvard based on their excellent up front talent and depth should have a great year. Princeton will field a very competitive team and will make Nationals. Best of luck to Yale with their young team.
The other teams are formidable, as is their institutions, but make no mistake that Princeton is coming for the titles this year. That’s what we expect of ourselves, because we are winners. Winners is what the future generation needs. We’re up against a lot: climate change, white supremacism heterodox, tech-based autocrats, the military industrial complex, normalized racism. But we’re ready for it
I’m on the Princeton women’s team and just want to say that you don’t know what you’re talking about. We have a plan for the season and we’re going to stick to that plan.
Also, I think this entire thread is outrageous and insulting to such an institution as ours.
My partner is on the men’s team and I know from first-hand experience how much character, poise, and tenacity the men’s team has. And quite frankly, that Princeton University has. Which is more than could be said about any of you.
Well the plan for the men's team is to skirt the rules around racing in a bad faith effort with seemingly no reasonable explanation.
No one here is attacking the athletes on the team, we assume they were instructed to do this and the ones who didn't race had no choice. I am sure many of them are upset by what they saw this weekend but are following the coaches plan.
I would challenge the character part of the team with Vig as coach... Glass houses and all.
NCAA D1 XC should institute a time cut for counting meets towards minimum contest requirements.
If a runner finishes more than 15% behind the overall 5th place finisher they receive a no contest mark. If a team can't get 5 runners under that mark, the meet doesn't count for that team.
In an 8k race where 5th place is 24:00 that results in a time cut mark of 27:36. Any team that can't get 5 runners under that mark doesn't deserve to run at D1 regionals or carry scholarships. Personally, I'd be fine with a 10% standard that would result in a 26:24 time cut standard for the same race.
In the 6k race at issue, there would have been a time cut somewhere around 21:00 with a 15% standard. Princeton's group finished 2 minutes behind that. That's embarrassing. It's not unreasonable to require D1 teams to get 5 guys to run sub 5:30 pace for 6-8k 3 times before the conference meet.
