We've closed this thread to new posts. Please discuss this topic in a new thread given the fact she just won the race outright in 2023. Does that mean that the 2022 cheating allegations definitely have no merit?
The home of the competitive runner, LetsRun.com provides news, opinion, and a world-famous discussion forum for the sport of running and track and field.
She changed her shoes a few times during race (was seen on her Instagram story yesterday), so that is why her look alike didn't need to wear same ones.
Who happens to also be a female and also with almost the exact same build and height.
The similarities are striking. Same singlet. Same shorts. Same skin tone. Same build. Same visor. Same headlamp around the waist. Same white watch on the left wrist, both rotated the same way, with the watch face inward. Same green light on the same (left) side of the singlet. Essentially identical in appearance if seen from afar, or in the dark.
Different shoes. Would be interesting to see photos throughout.
The similarities are striking. Same singlet. Same shorts. Same skin tone. Same build. Same visor. Same headlamp around the waist. Same white watch on the left wrist, both rotated the same way, with the watch face inward. Same green light on the same (left) side of the singlet. Essentially identical in appearance if seen from afar, or in the dark.
Different shoes. Would be interesting to see photos throughout.
I looked already. Admittedly didn't look thru ALL the photos since they don't label them by specific runner.
All the ones I saw were definitely 100% of Ashley running. Can't miss the hair, the shorts and in one picture her doppelganger is actually behind her as her pacer.
Now I know the experts on LetsRun are going to say "oh maybe she knew where the photographers were" insinuating she hopped out of the van right before that for the photo. I seriously doubt that one. That would require someone on her crew to almost always be scanning the course with binoculars AND Badwater has their Course Marshalls always driving up and the down the course.
This is very disappointing. There needs to be a system in place to make this fair.
Do they test at any ultras? Western States or UTMB?
Western States 100 miler does drug test the top 5 (or more) athletes, both men and women. Legit race. However, they seem to be one of the very few that I can find that do drug testing.
Long races like Badwater 135 and even most short ultras like JFK 50 miler have no form of on-site drug testing, which is a shame. Regardless, drug testing won’t catch course cutters.
Can someone act on this please? Is there anyone who is pressing her on it, or are we just going to let this one go? This is a mockery of really outstanding runners who have worked really hard on that course to run legitimate times.
See what I said earlier in this thread. Chris Kostman, the RD, isn't going to do sh*t.
He didn't have the balls to DQ the LetsRun favorite Parvaneh Moayedi from her "finish" at Badwater, despite overwhelming evidence she didn't complete the whole race.
He black-balled a certain runner who had proof from multiple crew members from multiple teams that a well known, author of a best-selling ultramarathon book and previous Badwater winner cheated and hopped in a van to get ahead of said runner while on the Portal Road.
He's not going to make the tough decision. He would rather "protect the brand". Now, I would argue (as would most) that protecting the brand would mean looking into this, but he will do everything he can NOT to make this a deal at all and risk someone not thinking of his races/organization as "holier than thou".
The old "If I avoid it, it will go away" mentality.
This is LR, can you please give the story behind these incidents and stop alluding to "certain runner[s]" and "well known author[s]" (though I'm sure I know who that is) - your insinuations would be much more interesting if you could lay out and/or link to a full story of what actually happened each time.
It is totally possible to cheat or cut course at these events. I was at a famous mountain 100 and watched a woman cheat... cut through 5 checkpoints. I didn't understand how they gave her an award/podium. Then a friend of mine explained how they can easily manipulate the data log. I am an idiot athlete, but the tech is very easy to manipulate for strava or a gps log (who knew??). He even showed me how to do it and how she did it. I asked the RD, and he said there was nothing he could do since she presented her data. She was about 100 lbs bigger than the woman who finished behind her... lost all respect for the sport.
See what I said earlier in this thread. Chris Kostman, the RD, isn't going to do sh*t.
He didn't have the balls to DQ the LetsRun favorite Parvaneh Moayedi from her "finish" at Badwater, despite overwhelming evidence she didn't complete the whole race.
He black-balled a certain runner who had proof from multiple crew members from multiple teams that a well known, author of a best-selling ultramarathon book and previous Badwater winner cheated and hopped in a van to get ahead of said runner while on the Portal Road.
He's not going to make the tough decision. He would rather "protect the brand". Now, I would argue (as would most) that protecting the brand would mean looking into this, but he will do everything he can NOT to make this a deal at all and risk someone not thinking of his races/organization as "holier than thou".
The old "If I avoid it, it will go away" mentality.
This is LR, can you please give the story behind these incidents and stop alluding to "certain runner[s]" and "well known author[s]" (though I'm sure I know who that is) - your insinuations would be much more interesting if you could lay out and/or link to a full story of what actually happened each time.
Someone posted the blog link a page or so ago. I thought it had been taken down. If you look in the comments, you'll see who it was. I think the original blog post was edited after this exchange because it originally contained more details from the blogger (and crew) perspective.
For 99%+ of participants, the sport is more about one's own limitations, and not the overall finishing order. Nevertheless, it'd be just another East African dominated distance running platform if the sport actually offered decent prize money. With more money would come more oversight.
agree 100%. I have done my fair share of low key races, just for the sake of enjoying the mountains and being fed along the way. But a lot of bs happens out there on those trails. Too bad, it is really fun. But RDs can't really do much to enforce compliance.
I'm not advocating to go back the old days of closed-group, in-house boys club sports, but let's take a moment to reflect.
Without a visible course or cameras following the race, it has always been challenging to marshal long races (bike, run, swim, horse, car, anything). The reward for winning these races has always been gaining notoriety and therefore sponsorship money. Up until 10ish years ago, the way you got sponsors was largely dictated by WHO you knew. Results were necessary, but a reputation as a fair racer was determined by the tight, largely closed group at the top. Cheating your way into that group would get a stink on you that's hard to remove. So no sponsorships, no money, no motivation to cut courses.
Fast forward to social media days, and the way you generate income now is through your social media. Win a race, everyone follows your account, monetize it with ads, profit. No gatekeepers, no self-policing of the group. Cut the course to win->gain followers->block anyone who calls you out->sell ads on your newly grown userbase.
This is very disappointing. There needs to be a system in place to make this fair.
Do they test at any ultras? Western States or UTMB?
Western States 100 miler does drug test the top 5 (or more) athletes, both men and women. Legit race. However, they seem to be one of the very few that I can find that do drug testing.
Long races like Badwater 135 and even most short ultras like JFK 50 miler have no form of on-site drug testing, which is a shame. Regardless, drug testing won’t catch course cutters.
Yes and some fast woman that won a Golden Ticket(runs with a baby yoda in her pack or something?) can’t even actually enter States because of past transgressions.
Note: Ashley’s result has been thoroughly analyzed and no evidence was found to support cheating allegations. To support Marathon Investigation, you can make a contribution by clicking on the bottom of the page, or by going t...
Different shoes. Would be interesting to see photos throughout.
You guys know a good portion of the race happens at night right? It would be just as easy to ride in the support vehicle as it would to have a doppelgänger relay.
