Another run across America underway - is it legit? Boots currently on the ground

The donations for these things are never linear in my experience. A huge amount will flood in in the final few days and when he finishes. Nedd Brockman for example didn't look great donations wise during his run, but then ended up with 2.5M AUD as the hype and media came when he was finished, or just about to.

Dude. No. It's not like Rossi or Meza at all.

Questions were raised with Rossi and Meza because their times didn't seem to align with the the their capabilities. Upon further inquiry, physical evidence was gathered to discredit both runners, which included past DQs, consistent missed timing mats, lack of race photographs, etc. Both runners came completely undone when challenged to race under supervision.

In the instant matter, accusers have yet to establish that what the runner is doing is actually even that physically impressive. The guy is slowly "running" and "walking" long distances with a full support crew, hotel and food budget, and ample equipment. Is this feat impressive with all of the support and the paces he's doing it in? Maybe. Maybe not. It's similar to Dean Karnazes running 50 marathons in 50 states in 50 days. As Rojo/Wejo pointed out back then, under the totality of the circumstances, the endeavor really wasn't as noteworthy as advertised.

Next, accusers are effectively placing all of their eggs in the basket of really really poor circumstantial evidence. The guys feet don't look beat up enough. The heart rate data isn't right but we can't explain it. He looks too "fresh." No. Just stop. The reliance on crap circumstantial evidence is like the people relying on noises in the woods to establish the existence of big foot.

This guy is still out there running. Gather legitimate evidence that he's faking it. Video. Pictures. Eye witness accounts of cheating.

I’m basically in the same boat as you. I’ve qualified and run in 2 Olympic Trials marathons, top 40 in Boston and New York, multiple 100ks under 8 hrs (haven’t done 100 miles yet). The pedestrian pace and moderate distances this guy was plodding along at until the last few days really isn’t that impressive to me. But it’s maddening that he’s acting like it’s easy when it doesn’t matter how slow you’re going, that amount of time on your feet, day after day, is never easy. Then he’s simultaneously acting like he’s one of the worlds greatest athletes and hawking his snake oil to fools who don’t know otherwise. And on top of all that the lack of transparency with the tracker and HR discrepancies, and acting like a douche bag when someone calls him out on it.

What is the legitimate evidence that he’s doing all of it? Has his skilled video team recorded one whole day’s run that they could share?

Their focus on selling a probably-bogus product calls into question the evidence they have shared (Strava and some fancy influencer vids).

Recruiter, you ran with the guy - what’s their setup like? Are they recording much running? If no, why not? Had you pre-arranged the run or did you just join in along the way? was he out there by himself when you joined up?

The setup is impressive. He has a van that serves mostly as his bed/recovery area, a tiny RV for the crew and a sag wagon to get the necessities along the way (that truck was on laundry duty when I got there). They are filming a ton! The crew goes 6 miles ahead each time he leaves them. They are filming for many minutes as he is coming to them, while he is there, and when he leaves. As to filming him in between those 6 miles, I can't answer that because I didn't witness it. One thing I can say about the film crew is one of them is an Emmy award winning videographer. He would be ruined if he was documenting a sham. Why on earth would he risk his career of this?

Yes, I did communicate which day I was coming but they did not know which segment mid day I would be joining. There was another guy on the crew that ran in with him to meet up with me and he went out with us for my 6 miles. Nice guy who was dealing with some hip flexor issues during our run.

It's clear you are part of the team or similar. Ever heard of Race Across America, the cycling race? Well it generally goes down SR. 56 or Rt 22 in Ohio. They encourage people to cheer and post exactly when riders will be going by.

My very first time going watching, from a parking lot on Rt 56 this instance, was right before Timestop 44. Jure Robic was leading the race but suffering badly (RIP by the way, he was killed training years later in Slovenia). The rumor was he was going to drop out at TS44. Well here I am, this random guy in the middle of nowhere cheering for him. I knew his name, cheered for him, and he ended up NOT dropping out and winning the race.

Now I am not suggesting I am the reason, but I like to think I lifted his spirts in the slightest.

Now do you find it odd that a guy that seems to live for attention and social media wants not cheering whatsoever?

And I'm a cyclist, I would literally ride right by. I pay the taxes here, not him. He has ZERO right to ask people to stay away, only that we do not put him in danger, which of course I do not want to do. I want to see who is actually running at a random check.

So yea, if I can, I'm popping in.

Any cyclist that rides by could be me. Enjoy your run. And to be clear, I am not threatening or anything. Just want to see with my own eyes, and if that's an issue,it is 100% you're cheating.

To clarify one thing, I live in the "triangle" formed by SR 22, Rt56, and SR 33. If the route goes through there, you're in my back yard. I'm not going out of my way for this because I actually do not care about this like I used to. I don't even run anymore. But I hate cheaters in any endeavor.

How is it clear he is part of the team? There has been no request for people to stay away. Madonna’s son, Rocco just did 26 miles with him. Check his Insta. Is he on the team too? Unfortunately it doesn’t look like he’s on Strava.

Okay, I'm thoroughly confused how your posts about Race Across America has anything to do with me? "It's clear you are part of the team"?? HUH? I'm a dude out of St. Louis, MO who's been following this journey and was inspired enough to want to run a segment with him. Nothing more. Any thoughts otherwise are ridiculous? Check out my Strava (posted on page 57 I think), I run every single day mostly right from here in the STL. It's a bit disgusting that you would claim that I'm on the team just because I'm supporting him and and questioning the fraud claims.
To your point, yes you can ride your bike any where you darned please to. We're in the land of the free! Based on his tracker you can clearly see where he is running. I hope you do go by for a very long period of time so you can see this is real. But, I hope you do it with a thread of objectivity. And, when you see that it is legit, that you come back on here and share it.
To your following post, thanks for sharing some random roads that I have no clue where they are. But, if you are close enough, I hope you do. I drove an hour away to run a segment with him. But, please stop to inferring that I'm on the team/crew. Do some due diligence Boots.

Is that who that was? That's pretty cool.

You don't think NuCalm can pay celebrity nepo kids to shill a product? That's like the only thing those kids can do.

Need Rocco's strava data. He can run 26 miles, he must have strava. What's his LRC username? Sneakers on the Ground?

You are probably right and that is what makes this so frustrating. Someone getting all the fawning for doing something which, in multiday terms, is not that big a deal, while people like Dan who covered 83 miles a day in his JOGLE fkt gets barely a mention.

Will Cockerell is still not apologizing and in fact, on his Jogle Facebook ground is doubling down saying he is still right accusing Goodge and Ballinger of cheating and has something "incoming" to retaliate against the latest "boots on the ground" that actually went to run with Goodge.

Advice to Will Cockerell: Take off your underwear and wave it up in the air!

Hi, I'm Steve Pope- I ran across America in 2011 with Chris Finill. The following are just my opinions, nothing more. I have no connection with William Goodge, any of his crew or William C. I've never met or spoken to any of them. I'll number my thoughts just to make it easier for you to reply.
1) What he has been doing so far is good but not amazing. He is running slowly and walking through 50 miles each day averaging less than 5mph. He has a crew to look after his every need. He can simply concentrate 100% on moving forward. He's picked an ideal time of year to do it, running conditions have been very good most of the time. (This isn't a criticism, it's a compliment on their organisational skills).
However the apparent new plan to increase the daily mileage past 60 will make a huge change. Less time to recover each day combined with a much higher chance of injury. Very few people could manage this for more than a week. Beyond 70 miles, only Pete K has done this on a Trans America run. (It has been done in extended races on smaller more controlled circuits)
2) This whole heart rate thing is a red herring. I can show you a 6 mile, 12 mins per mile run I did last week at HR of 110 wearing a rucksack, the day after a big 16 hour run. So could lots of other people. Yes there are strange variations in his heart rate on Strava, but I cannot come up with any explanation to account for them, other than an unusual physiology or a failure of the watch to pick up the correct heart rate due to his skin, shape of wrist, sunscreen, size or depth of veins below skin. There's probably other things that could effect it that I can't think of. The important thing is that these anomalies also occurred whilst he was being watched.
3) Negative splits in the second half of a daily run aren't surprising. It Isn't a race where you aim to drain yourself completely by the finish line and sometimes overcook it. In a multiday you are always holding a bit back. Every morning you are tired and your legs are very stiff and sore. I always struggled for the first hour or two and dreaded the thought of the endless miles ahead. Later in the day, my legs are working smoothly again and I felt good knowing that the day's aim would be achieved. Our pace was always quicker and I often felt that I was running really well and could keep going forever. Then we'd have to stop and the whole cycle would start again!
4) Why haven't they addressed the doubters and the issues they have raised in a calm and sensible manner? Did they not realise that someone claiming something way beyond their previously demonstrated abilities would attract suspicion? Why didn't he run some Ultras beforehand to get credibility? Why isn't he carrying a tracker (they aren't heavy) and why doesn't he just take some pictures of his watch showing a low heart rate and a pace of 10 minutes per mile? I really don't understand this attitude of sticking two fingers up at naysayers. What is his explanation for the apparent difference between at least one start and previous day's finish points?
5) He looks suspiciously well all the time- but don't forget, we only see what they want us to see. The condition of his feet is another red herring- mine looked fine after 3000 miles. I never considered doing any sprinting at any point though. (Maybe just personality differences). I never looked like I was sweating either in photos or film.
6) We may have underestimated William G's running ability. He has no race CV to mention, just a few stunt runs. However, if his 48 marathons in 30 days is genuine, we know that he ran 3.08 at London as the final one. I'm pretty certain I couldn't have run 3.08 the day after running 1000 miles and I was a 2:41 marathon runner when I did my crossing.
7) After a read up on Nu Calm, it does seem like classic Snake Oil (A disc which you have to replace every so often, genuine chemical names of neurotransmitters mixed in with implausible claims of how the disc affects them). 'FDA approved' just means it's demonstrated that its benefits outweigh its health risks, which isn't really that great. From their website:
'The discs are embedded with the electromagnetic frequencies specific to natural elements within our bodies' and even better: 'once it touches your skin, your body begins pulling frequencies from it.' This is absolute gobbledygook, however I slept terribly waking up every 20 minutes or so during the night for the first few weeks. Better sleep would definitely have helped my recovery each day. Even if this thing just has a placebo effect, it might be helping him. (I'm speculating wildly here).
Another thing- is he wearing the new supershoes? Anything that can reduce the stresses on your upper legs might make a significant difference. I've not seen any mention of what he's running in but Strava says Vaporflies. I've not tried these type of shoes, but I'd be really interested to hear from anyone who has used them in an ultra or multiday.
8) Isn't it crazy how they didn't even make the effort to find out who really was the fastest Englishman to run across America? John Lees is a famous race walker who represented GB and did 53 days in 1972, an English runner in the 1992 race did 64 days and Bruce Tulloh did 65 in 1969. Having a sign on your vehicle claiming to be the fastest Englishman before you've actually done it is not a great look. (Or is that just me?)
9) The distance LA City Hall to New York City hall is around 2880-2900 miles. Why are they claiming 3175? Surely you'd make sure you were doing the shortest possible route?
It is impossible to ever prove a run like this 100% (Filming the whole thing isn't possible- a vehicle travelling that slowly across America would be pulled over by the Police). Maybe a cyclist could do it, but it would be hard work persuading one to ride at 5mph all day.
The emphasis is always firmly on the person claiming the achievement to prove it to the best of their ability using the resources of the era. The current gold standard is a GPS watch on each arm (in case one fails) and the data uploaded to Strava as soon as phone reception is available. An independant tracker (SPOT or equivalent) carried on the person is essential as it demonstrates that you are happy to give your position in real time. Filming and witness statements help. Publishing your route in advance and welcoming observation is a major thing too.
It's not a case of 'thinking the best of people'; we've seen countless examples of cheating in the past. At the end of the day, our level of belief is a sum of evidence plus credibility. Nobody ever doubted Pete K, Marshall Ulrich or Frank Giannino because they recorded to the highest standards available and their performances were in line with what we had already seen that they could do in races.
I think that as Goodge gets further East, more people will be able to just turn up without warning and independently check up on what's going on.
10) Finally, he need to prove his credentials in a proper race (as Chris Finill said at the start). If he claims a 53 day crossing, I personally think he needs to demonstrate around 500 miles in a 6 day race. If he did this then I would be first in the queue to congratulate him.
Sorry for such a long post.

Please make the effort to observe him even if he’s not in your backyard. You’ve cared enough to read this thread and comment on it, haven’t you? I implore you (as someone who lives on the west coast): If not for yourself, do it for the letsrun community!

Great post. I agree with all the points, just a small clarification on NuCalm as I took some time to research it out of curiosity.

NuCalm started as a 3000 bucks medical grade device that sent electric impulses to your brain while at the same time they applied GABA cream on you and played some binaural beats through the headphones. This is what got FDA approved. Not sure if they were actually selling the device or the services only. Obviously, at least GABA and binaural beats have some actual benefits. But then they decided to go full scam mode.

New NuCalm is just a subscription based app, needs no FDA approval obviously. But of course they would bend the truth and say their "technology" is FDA approved. This new NuCalm is still playing binaural beats (on top of some music that can be copyrighted and called their property I guess). Binaural beats provide some very minor benefits above placebo level in some studies, so not a complete snake oil. But you can go to YouTube and search for binaural beats and get plenty for free (do some research on which frequencies are best for sleep, etc). And their "optional" discs that supposedly replace GABA cream are complete and utter pseudoscience. They are applied to accupuncture point (!) of pericard meridian (!) to somehow stimulate GABA production by resonating with frequencies of GABA, whatever that means. Funny how you need to replace them regularily despite the fact they have no power source or anything to run out of. Obviously a total scam.

Unfortunately, if you get a pretty boy influencer doing something big like this with legions of followers who don't know jack about running but just see the distances and think it's never been done and suddenly it's the holy grail.

Hi all, a special guest appearance from me. The thread is starting to grow... This posted to the Jogle FB page:

WVLC Transcon newsletter.

Hi all,

Loads going on as the team muse on whether to adjust the 64 target to the 53 one mid-race. Either way, it remains a farce they're in this mess of calling WG the fastest Englishman of all time on his bus, and in the media and let’s not forget his key sponsor, who still have up in lights on their website:

"With NuCalm’s help Will Goodge is about to set the record for the fastest Englishman to run across America."

And then go on to say:

If this seems like a superhuman level of performance, it is. NuCalm has powered Will and his crew chief Robbie Balenger through an incredible range of extreme endurance challenges, giving them the power to recover and perform on demand with nothing more than the NuCalm Mobile App and a pair of high quality headphones.
--------------------
Steve Pope’s detailed post on LR is good, but of course I take issue with him saying that HRs are a red herring, just because he posts some odd ones too. I reiterate to Steve and others late to the party: These HRs are very specific, of high and normal, but then flatlining, crashing somewhere during the day, with no change in pace. They have occurred for nearly 10,000kms now, over more than four years, up to six watches and ONLY at these multiday fundraisers.

I will take the theme of Barack Obama in this newsletter who refuted the conspiracy theorists that the Navy Seals had not taken out bin Laden with this great line: “that’s fine to think that, but the truth is you won’t see him prowling the earth anymore…”

Here are some home truths about this event:

1) The truth is that no other athletes in history have returned clean heart rate data of just 10%, over such a long period of time, over specific events. If so, who? I don’t believe there is anyone under 80%. People try sending me stuff that they say is unclean but it’s 95% fine. I had one person point me to Goodge doing a mile in a race at 110bpm. I looked it up, the mile was 19:35!

2) The truth is that no other athletes in history have so consistently negative, or even- splitted days, often by a large margin at multiday events. Yesterday was over 20 minutes. If so, who?

3) This Transcon will be a very large negative split. The truth is no athletes in history have negative splitted at huge multiday day events like Balenger and Goodge. If so, who? [Balenger negative splitted his Transcondid 2524K for his first 37 days and 2656 for his next 37; Goodge negative splitted at Jogle by 1.4 days as a novice].

4) The truth is that Goodge’s 45 minute split for kms 71-78 on 12 May is the “best” piece of multiday running of all time, and most particularly for the second half of a race, and second-half of a day. No-one in history has run 8k at minuted splits so late and deep into a race of 5 4 5 5 5 5 5 5. If so, who?

If we take three random examples: Kostelnick Ks 71-78 of day 41 of his Transcon: 5 8 5 5 8 6 6 10. Or Lawson 71-78 on day 7 of Jogle: 66666666. And day 8: 77777777. Goodness the consistency is a marvel – but 5s they ain’t!

Or let’s take all six of Gabor Rakonczay’s 71-78 splits when winning the world trophy:

66655575
77678777
77799 10 87
9 10 986666
767 10 8898
8 19 20 12 9887

This sample alone shows us how difficult 5-minute K’s are to find in a multiday. This lot have found 7 in 72 attempts. It’s a very tough proposition and is roughly 9 minute miling. Not only has Goodge found them every time, he’s even dipped into the 4s. 9.7% to the power of 8 is over 100 million to one.

If we take someone of Goodge’s perceived level, say Balenger, his 71-78km on day 41 were:
9 10 11 9 10 9 8 8.

This throws up two questions: how has WG managed such a ferocious pace so late in the day – all off a heart rate which has risen, but only a tiny bit, to circa 125, when the mark should be 170+?

And more pertinently WHY? What’s the point of really smashing yourself late in the day for the fastest piece of multiday running in history that could invite a breakdown, and is totally and utterly removed from anything you’ve ever produced in your career? Is it so that you can finish the day at 7.15pm and not 7:30?

None of the footage put out by the crew, and certainly absolutely nothing I witnessed, suggests Goodge could even dream of running at such a pace at such a moment in the challenge.

----------------

Quite soon though, there will be a day of reckoning. WG was apparently laughing when Chris Heinz asked for his HR and said 105, almost as if he’s trying to get us to believe it’s true. But 105s for 10 minute miling in a multiday is physiologically impossible. Anyone in running knows that. The WG Transcon team are going to have to commit and commit soon: either their data is at it is because WG is a freak of nature who runs at 130-190bpm OUTSIDE of these events, but 90-120 within them; OR he and Balenger have had a catastrophic tech fail for circa 9,000km, with up to 6 watches on two continents and four events, but they never fail on the opening days, or when they race during an event, or when I write them tough letters, and are over 90% clean when I observe.

There are loads of reasons why some low data cropped up when I was there. He was running with Balenger for one, maybe they did a switch. I caught Balenger watch-sharing at his Transcon in two seconds flat.

This story is becoming ever more complex, tawdry and sordid by the day, and as noted is becoming one of the largest LR threads of all time. It is the story of two unknowns, falling in love with running, deciding to turning pro with little to no ability, putting on lots of multiday stunts to attract attention, often lying in their literature [like saying world record holders and fastest Englishman], never getting into difficulty after shocking early days, attracting up to 8-10 sponsors and paid partnerships, and thinking never fatiguing is impressive, when to real runners it’s anything but, we just wonder why. However their sponsors adore them for it: “if you use our products, you too will never get tired in running or ever have a bad day, or even session.”

And if it rains? Oh then this superhuman, physiological freak will just walk through the day as for some reason he can’t run in the rain.

WG and RB clearly have hundreds of thousands of dollars behind them now with all their sponsors and are clearly making some serious loot. To burn through 10 pairs of incredibly expensive shoes a little over half way shows how little money is an factor. Running shoes last 500+ miles not under 200. They are looking to raise half a million GBP for their Go Fund Me.

We can but wait and see how this all develops, but yes, I for one remain convinced that something is off here.

You never left. You are very likely trolling this thread with multiple anonymous handles. How else do you explain the consistent stupidity in this thread despite me trying to teach you? I would have had better luck teaching that rock you alleged Goodge threw at you despite you not providing proof. You need to provide the video recording and heart rate data from your watch showing a spike in your heart rate at the exact moment you alleged all this happened. Anything less and you are lieing according to the same standards you judge Goodge by.