Bernard Lagat's monday training run after a day off - 11mi @ 5:12 pace

However he has done 7:29. The hardest race of your life has nothing to do with potential. Are you drunk again?

If Lagat trained properly as a 5k runner at 26-28, 12:40. As easy as that could be.

SMJO wrote:However he has done 7:29

which is rubbish

an ~ 3'29-mid guy of the '00s ran 7'25-flat off a crap 5'01+ split

The hardest race of your life has nothing to do with potential

idiot

it tells us he was never going to put in enough hard work for 5k when in 3'26 shape, a race he got balked on on final curve by hicham, clipping his foot, even if a billy-club was hovered over his head

Are you drunk again?

idiot

are you just stoopid ?

go see my current shape here

3/27 : 3:07pm post :

If Lagat trained properly as a 5k runner at 26-28, 12:40. As easy as that could be

drivel

he coudn't contemplate such pain ~ '00

it was never a possibility

Sure it was. Just common sense. He would have never moved up unless he thought he could contend with the 5k crowd which was replete with 12:40 ish guys that he beat consistently.

clueless

the 5k back in early '00s was just as good as now

guys like cherono/songok/chebbii were all good for 12'40 - 12'45 in early '00's - '05s++

chreono when he whupped hicham in ostrava looked good for 12'40 & if canova his coach says different, i'll leave

the paris '12 race illuminated what i said for years

12'50 is a crap barrier for elites

If it's as good now as it was then it seems you have confirmed my point. Lagat is beating virtually everyone now too.

If he can do it now at 39 he coulda definitely done it then.

I wouldn't quite say that 12:50 was a crap barrier but I will say that in 2011 both Lagat and Mo Farah were in shape to run well under 12:50 in Monaco 2011. That was the plan; as it turns out there were too many of the top guys in the race (from memory 13 of top 16) and the pacing got messed up (the guy who was meant to do the all-important 4th km decided with his agent that he could push hard and still finish. Of course it didn't happen like that and 4km they lost all momentum). Interesting that when neither Farah or Lagat were in the Paris 2012 race there are all of a sudden guys willing to push hard. It's inevitable that if they were in the race those guys would have had less courage to do so in middle stages. That's just the way it goes......

SMJO wrote:If it's as good now as it was then it seems you have confirmed my point

drivel

he was a 3'29 guy in '06, probably more like 3'28 on evidence of 12'59 with 51.5

his speed was crap by '07+ drifting out to 3'32+

get a clue

Lagat is beating virtually everyone now too

caleb looks in 3'27+ shape, so bernie running him close is no disgrace, but maybe bernie has got back some speed

rupp spending race at back is disgrace

If he can do it now at 39 he coulda definitely done it then

no

drivel

he was never ever going to put in 5k work in his 3'26 shape

he said 3k was already

"toughest"

None of that has anything to do with his intrinsic capability of running 12:40.

He hasn't, but all the tools were there.

He maya never been gonna do the 5k work when he was 3:26 capable but that doesn't mean he couldna.

Templeton wrote:I wouldn't quite say that 12:50 was a crap barrier but I will say that in 2011 both Lagat and Mo Farah were in shape to run well under 12:50 in Monaco 2011. That was the plan; as it turns out there were too many of the top guys in the race (from memory 13 of top 16) and the pacing got messed up (the guy who was meant to do the all-important 4th km decided with his agent that he could push hard and still finish. Of course it didn't happen like that and 4km they lost all momentum). Interesting that when neither Farah or Lagat were in the Paris 2012 race there are all of a sudden guys willing to push hard. It's inevitable that if they were in the race those guys would have had less courage to do so in middle stages. That's just the way it goes......

& i'm only guy on planet who called

mo-3'28 :

using :

let me give some advice ( yes you heard all sh!t )

if our kenyan gets fit, he needs to go the Pretoria or Canberra or Salazar camp to maximise

your boy was at least 5 pounds underweight in 1'40.91

that is 5 pounds which shouda been propulsive ->

1'40.5-mid

SMJO wrote:None of that has anything to do with his intrinsic capability of running 12:40.

He hasn't, but all the tools were there.

He maya never been gonna do the 5k work when he was 3:26 capable but that doesn't mean he couldna.

you're deluded

there was never a chance in hell bernie couda run 12'40 even if training for it in '01

you mighta extended this drivel to a 26'30 or a 2"03 back then as well

Nope, just the 5k. Bernie doesn't do the miles for anything over that. Bernie is probably doing 12:35 age graded right now.

Do you even run?

lagat's 51x per mile at altitude is the probably the same as 5 minutes a mile over undulating terrain.

so that is good work.

in contrast to a flat 530 per mile run which is a bit of work and a bit of play for the elites.

the interesting thing about lagat is his longevity and really the biggest flaw in training programs is insufficient recovery. lagat rests up, and when he trains he's focused probably better than anyone else.

i remember looking at lagat's training logs with amazement and agreement. he did a lot of quality work without doing crazy amounts of fast intervals.

he did a lot of stuff at race speed for the 1500, rather than 22 second 200m stuff.

so recovery and running a lot of your quality work at the speed you intend to race is the key to success, in combination with a tremendous aerobic base.

along the way, to win the champs you need to bring a sub 13 100 m in the final stretch for the gold.

Ventolin, you never called 3:28. You threw out a large range and said 3:28 was possible. Anyone can do that, calculator or not.

How was his speed crap in '07 if he could mow down both the 1500 and 5000 fields?

It seems unlikely that the rest of the World got really slow that year just for him.

does lagat bother with the epo now at all?

or has he quit?

SMJO wrote:Nope, just the 5k. Bernie doesn't do the miles for anything over that. Bernie is probably doing 12:35 age graded right now

you really are clueless

hicham was faster over 1500 & put in more mileage than bernie & still coudn't crack 12'50 in a race where he got crushed in home straight

so where does your numbskull come up with 12'40+ for bernie ???

Do you even run?

do you ever think ?

guerrouj could crack 12-50

no problem

ventolin^3 wrote:

SMJO wrote:Nope, just the 5k. Bernie doesn't do the miles for anything over that. Bernie is probably doing 12:35 age graded right now

you really are clueless

hicham was faster over 1500 & put in more mileage than bernie & still coudn't crack 12'50 in a race where he got crushed in home straight

so where does your numbskull come up with 12'40+ for bernie ???

Do you even run?

do you ever think ?

Mileage has nothing to do with correct 5k training. Hicham was barely figuring the event out when he retired. He coulda went much faster if he focused earlier as well.

Gotta give guys more a than a coupla attempts before making a definitive statement as to ultimate ability.

Both Lagat and El G were also aiming for a double which requires a bit of sacrifice for the 5k

Do you even run? It seems like you don't.

at the risk of stating the obvious, ventolin is the worst poster ever.

He thinks everyone and his sister could crack 7:25 given the right race, but El G and Lagat couldn't handle sub 12:50 if they had been training for that event and took several "time trial" shots at it. Absurd. I don't know about 12:40, but certainly both had 12:45 capabilities. Absolutely no doubt about it.