I made the comparison to Remco Evenepoel earlier being overcooked this year and Allie having the same pattern this year from trying to play catch up in fitness, and that showing up in all her races, both mountain and track. Chris Horner has a good video on Remco with a lot of wisdom on what your body should feel like after good workouts; having a too deeply discharged "battery" that drops too much after a race; and taking a long enough break to reset things:
This isn't rocket science. Trying to play catchup by doing more VO2 max type efforts is the polar opposite of modern training methods (see the "Norwegian Method" and similar). How do I know she was going too hard? Because she was afraid of a lot of those track workouts. Those of you who have had great coaching throughout your lives as athletes might not have experienced any of this.
Temperature isn't as big of a factor in the steeple as with the longer races - 89 and low humidity isn't that daunting.
I've never posted in the Roche thread - don't care about it/him as a general matter.
What makes me sure he isn't that good of a coach for the steeple? Putting aside that he wasn't a steepler himself and never ran competitive track in school, and even ignoring her running trail races instead of track races leading up to Nationals, having her do VO2 Max work a few days before the big race says it all.
What evidence is there that she could run faster than 9:21? She ran 9:26 in 2021 - 5 years later, she's only 5 secs better despite being in her prime running years of mid to late 20's? You tell me.
Not going to go through all this stuff line by line, but 3k is far enough in 89F that it's going to be a few seconds slower than good weather for pretty much anyone. But the point was that you made it sound like she had some huge drop off from her last race, when 5 secs can be most logically explained by temp and illness.
Do you run? Coach? You clearly don't at a high level because I just re-looked and she ran 6 x 300 at 3k race pace with 1 min rest FOUR days before the meet. If you think that's way too hard, I don't know what to tell you. That's nothing for even a decent high school runner. 1800m of 300s at 3k race pace is pre-race turnover work, not some big vo2max session.
But what pisses me off in an Allie O thread is that you can't think of any reason why she hasn't improved much from 2021. Hmm, what could have been happening to her mentally and physically during that time period? My god, it's a complete mystery. (yes, that's sarcastic). Roche wasn't coaching for almost that entire period too, genius.
I'm a fan of Allie O's, and don't really care about Roche, but I'm glad she is at a healthy weight and has resurrected her running. Let's just leave it at that and now grind your axe on sh-t you know nothing about.
Temperature isn't as big of a factor in the steeple as with the longer races - 89 and low humidity isn't that daunting.
I've never posted in the Roche thread - don't care about it/him as a general matter.
What makes me sure he isn't that good of a coach for the steeple? Putting aside that he wasn't a steepler himself and never ran competitive track in school, and even ignoring her running trail races instead of track races leading up to Nationals, having her do VO2 Max work a few days before the big race says it all.
What evidence is there that she could run faster than 9:21? She ran 9:26 in 2021 - 5 years later, she's only 5 secs better despite being in her prime running years of mid to late 20's? You tell me.
Not going to go through all this stuff line by line, but 3k is far enough in 89F that it's going to be a few seconds slower than good weather for pretty much anyone. But the point was that you made it sound like she had some huge drop off from her last race, when 5 secs can be most logically explained by temp and illness.
Do you run? Coach? You clearly don't at a high level because I just re-looked and she ran 6 x 300 at 3k race pace with 1 min rest FOUR days before the meet. If you think that's way too hard, I don't know what to tell you. That's nothing for even a decent high school runner. 1800m of 300s at 3k race pace is pre-race turnover work, not some big vo2max session.
But what pisses me off in an Allie O thread is that you can't think of any reason why she hasn't improved much from 2021. Hmm, what could have been happening to her mentally and physically during that time period? My god, it's a complete mystery. (yes, that's sarcastic). Roche wasn't coaching for almost that entire period too, genius.
I'm a fan of Allie O's, and don't really care about Roche, but I'm glad she is at a healthy weight and has resurrected her running. Let's just leave it at that and now grind your axe on sh-t you know nothing about.
You have to go back a little farther to see where she was likely well beyond 'functional overreach'. A term Roche probably threw out there to convince her she'd be OK, instead of listening to her or following her gut.
Barely got through the semifinal then DNS for the final. Hopefully she is alright.
She had a rough year with injuries and setbacks. Her build, she acknowledged, was awful. Not her year; just making the start line and qualifying for the final was an accomplishment.
Progress and performance are not linear curves in running except for a very, very few special and lucky folks. Even those folks get setbacks.
She will be fine. Her performances have improved under Roche, and she's been a lot healthier.
I was disappointed in not seeing her start, but I was not surprised.
Plus, I'm pretty sure she had some rough landings on the jumps, and that may have aggravated some of the injuries she's been nursing. Or worse. And she knew she hadn't had the build and jumps practices she'd prefer. Just that kind of season. Happens. Next one will be better, I reckon.
Temperature isn't as big of a factor in the steeple as with the longer races - 89 and low humidity isn't that daunting.
I've never posted in the Roche thread - don't care about it/him as a general matter.
What makes me sure he isn't that good of a coach for the steeple? Putting aside that he wasn't a steepler himself and never ran competitive track in school, and even ignoring her running trail races instead of track races leading up to Nationals, having her do VO2 Max work a few days before the big race says it all.
What evidence is there that she could run faster than 9:21? She ran 9:26 in 2021 - 5 years later, she's only 5 secs better despite being in her prime running years of mid to late 20's? You tell me.
Not going to go through all this stuff line by line, but 3k is far enough in 89F that it's going to be a few seconds slower than good weather for pretty much anyone. But the point was that you made it sound like she had some huge drop off from her last race, when 5 secs can be most logically explained by temp and illness.
Do you run? Coach? You clearly don't at a high level because I just re-looked and she ran 6 x 300 at 3k race pace with 1 min rest FOUR days before the meet. If you think that's way too hard, I don't know what to tell you. That's nothing for even a decent high school runner. 1800m of 300s at 3k race pace is pre-race turnover work, not some big vo2max session.
But what pisses me off in an Allie O thread is that you can't think of any reason why she hasn't improved much from 2021. Hmm, what could have been happening to her mentally and physically during that time period? My god, it's a complete mystery. (yes, that's sarcastic). Roche wasn't coaching for almost that entire period too, genius.
I'm a fan of Allie O's, and don't really care about Roche, but I'm glad she is at a healthy weight and has resurrected her running. Let's just leave it at that and now grind your axe on sh-t you know nothing about.
You're really dense, or deceptive, because I said twice before I was referencing the 2024 Trials build-up, yet you persist in citing the 2025 Nationals workout, which I never mentioned. Since you refuse to meaningfully respond, or to address the five secs in five years stat, which you tellingly chose to ignore, I'm finished.
Sad she wasn't able to start the final. I wonder what happened...anyone on the ground there hear anything? What a tough grind this sport has been for her. Hope she's okay. I agree a coaching change would be important if she is to try and be competitive in track.
How long on this coach? Because she has come back from dead bottom. It wasn't long ago we were all amazed how far she came back to be competitive to an extent in SC. Words team in XC. She was left for dead. So Im not sure if it was all her or this coach??
Sad she wasn't able to start the final. I wonder what happened...anyone on the ground there hear anything? What a tough grind this sport has been for her. Hope she's okay. I agree a coaching change would be important if she is to try and be competitive in track.
She will never be competitive on the track. There are just too many American women who are faster and younger. The trail thing didn't work out either. The only thing left is to move to the roads full time, if she can manage to stay healthy.
I genuinely think someone of her caliber was using the Trails not as a career but as training method on her comeback. She's very injury prone. I think it worked. You don't go from trailrunner to international track hopes. The trail was just low impact training.
It’s her job. You want her to find another funding source for running full-time, like maybe a corporate job or something?
I think we are seeing in real time the effects of social media overuse in her training and racing. She has attached her value as a runner to engagement and "likes". Saying it's "her job" is just an excuse. It's not like it's the only way to support yourself. She has a degree, no one is stopping her from using it besides herself. I would argue the structure of a more traditional job would benefit her training and general mental health. I think most people a getting sick of the influencer genre.
I have to say this whole social media excuse is BS. She doesn't have a full time job and 3 kids like some of us. She has plenty of time to put out a video every week and ...run. Maybe only 10 extra hours in the day for social media after training. Social media isn't the issue. And BTW, it was only 12 months ago she was running way faster than college. So she hasn't just gone downhill the whole time like everyone is saying. She is a very elite US runner that is way better than any of us, but the field has massively gotten better for sure. We see it every week on these boards, everyone else got better faster than her and with less setbacks. She would have been a top 3 ish finisher in SC at one point. Her PR would be 2 sec behind Coburn and Frierichs about 5 years ago at USATF. I love her pluck, run the heck out of trails, pull up the bootstraps and make a world team for XC when everyone else was country clubbin it at home. She is putting it all out there. My assumption (?) is that she has limitations as far as hammering 3000m specialist training regimen on the track. Lots of trail and cross training in her vids.
I do hope she didn't just bolt for the final, that would be disappointing to be sure.
Temperature isn't as big of a factor in the steeple as with the longer races - 89 and low humidity isn't that daunting.
I've never posted in the Roche thread - don't care about it/him as a general matter.
What makes me sure he isn't that good of a coach for the steeple? Putting aside that he wasn't a steepler himself and never ran competitive track in school, and even ignoring her running trail races instead of track races leading up to Nationals, having her do VO2 Max work a few days before the big race says it all.
What evidence is there that she could run faster than 9:21? She ran 9:26 in 2021 - 5 years later, she's only 5 secs better despite being in her prime running years of mid to late 20's? You tell me.
Agree that Roche isn't the coach for her if she wants to stay in the steeple, however even though you're trying to sound reasonable your last sentence misses the mark altogether.
Her 9:21 last was pretty remarkable in its own right. She had been pretty much written off. She did not improve in those intervening years because she had an eating disorder and a string of injuries.
She doesn't talk about the female competitor (#15) she took a spot from, nor does the giggle fest throughout suggest anything about being emotionally empty. 100k subs tho lol
She got to the cape quick and they fly Frontier. Wonder where that last shot was even taken.
She also rushed to get that drop out, as one can expect, for her 100k subs. She even had the wrong date of the finals (9/2/2025).
She doesn't talk about the female competitor (#15) she took a spot from, nor does the giggle fest throughout suggest anything about being emotionally empty. 100k subs tho lol
She got to the cape quick and they fly Frontier. Wonder where that last shot was even taken.
She also rushed to get that drop out, as one can expect, for her 100k subs. She even had the wrong date of the finals (9/2/2025).
#15 was 14 seconds behind Allie's time in the Prelims. If she wanted to run in the final, she should have run faster.
She doesn't talk about the female competitor (#15) she took a spot from, nor does the giggle fest throughout suggest anything about being emotionally empty. 100k subs tho lol
She got to the cape quick and they fly Frontier. Wonder where that last shot was even taken.
She also rushed to get that drop out, as one can expect, for her 100k subs. She even had the wrong date of the finals (9/2/2025).
#15 ran 9:54 in a 9:30 race, whereas Allie O ran 9:40 in a 9:37 race. She has a PB of 9:44 from 6-7 weeks ago. I don't think #15 was robbed of a finals spot. And ahe would surely DFL that race. Where's your hate for all the other DNSs in this meet? Also, if she DNSed, #15 might have had her chance to alter, but maybe opted-out. We don't know, and it doesn't really matter.
Allie shared what happened yesterday. No major injury, but, it sounds like she just wasn't feeling it to compete. She didn't feel excitement or nervousness, so she took that as a sign not to run. As much as I sincerely wish her well, I don't understand this. Easy for me to say I guess, as I am not a pro or elite runner...
I was a big fan of Allie O but after this pathetic excuse to not race I feel like I've been duped for the past 5+ years. She is a CLOWN just doing everything for clicks.
It's the final of the NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIPS and she is a pro runner. Put your spikes on and try to win!
What type of lesson does this teach to younger runners? To run away if you are scared? Quitting is ok?
She doesn't talk about the female competitor (#15) she took a spot from, nor does the giggle fest throughout suggest anything about being emotionally empty. 100k subs tho lol
She got to the cape quick and they fly Frontier. Wonder where that last shot was even taken.
She also rushed to get that drop out, as one can expect, for her 100k subs. She even had the wrong date of the finals (9/2/2025).
#15 was 14 seconds behind Allie's time in the Prelims. If she wanted to run in the final, she should have run faster.
Maybe #15 was feeling in the prelim's like Alllie like for the finals....but ran
Old school mentality here. If you make a USATF final, and you are capable of completing the event, it's not a stretch to expect one should absolutely run. There are people who would be thrilled for a USATF final even as a lane filler.
Any chance Spencer had a park run this morning she didn’t want to miss?
There was a local 5k in Alton Baker Park Saturday, but sadly Spencer didn't run it. Looked like the winner ran ~21 from what I saw. Could've been a good one for a "Can I Spot the Field 5 minutes and still win?' video.
Any chance Spencer had a park run this morning she didn’t want to miss?
There was a local 5k in Alton Baker Park Saturday, but sadly Spencer didn't run it. Looked like the winner ran ~21 from what I saw. Could've been a good one for a "Can I Spot the Field 5 minutes and still win?' video.
So now she gets hate based on what her fiancé's videos?