He doesn't say that. Anywhere. You just make garbage up.
He doesn't have to say it. Anyone who knows anything about training (this excludes you, of course) understands that an athlete training for the 1500m will not be at his best for the half marathon. This is only garbage to you because you are ignorant.
Then you could tell him that, because he doesn't appear to know it.
I don't know how familiar you are with Jakob's periodization. He had spent the last months working mostly on his speed as he tried for the 1500m, 1 Mile, 2000m, 3000m, 2 Mile records.
He obviously also trained in his summer season for the 5000m, that he ran in 3 different champs this year. And he has stressed that schedule is the only reason why he doesn’t run 10000m in the champs. And it has also been very important to him to tell that he never thins down his training that much in the track season. So what was his 10k shape in Copenhagen? -Do you really find it that peculiar that some of us feel an urge to point out a discrepancy between Jakob’s talking by words and his talking by his legs..!?
I don't know how familiar you are with Jakob's periodization. He had spent the last months working mostly on his speed as he tried for the 1500m, 1 Mile, 2000m, 3000m, 2 Mile records.
He obviously also trained in his summer season for the 5000m, that he ran in 3 different champs this year. And he has stressed that schedule is the only reason why he doesn’t run 10000m in the champs. And it has also been very important to him to tell that he never thins down his training that much in the track season. So what was his 10k shape in Copenhagen? -Do you really find it that peculiar that some of us feel an urge to point out a discrepancy between Jakob’s talking by words and his talking by his legs..!?
They are also very selective in referring to what he says, ignoring what is inconvenient or even trying to say he meant something else.
So if Kejelcha (who trains for 3000m and above) compared to Jakob (who trains for 1500m and above)had run his HM in Copenhagen September 15. instead of October 27., what time do you think he could have managed? 57 high? 58 low? 58 high?
I don't know how familiar you are with Jakob's periodization. He had spent the last months working mostly on his speed as he tried for the 1500m, 1 Mile, 2000m, 3000m, 2 Mile records.
Mostly working on his speed? He needs to have his maximum possible strength to compete in the 1500m. How did he win the 5000m if he was focusing on speed?
He doesn't have to say it. Anyone who knows anything about training (this excludes you, of course) understands that an athlete training for the 1500m will not be at his best for the half marathon. This is only garbage to you because you are ignorant.
Then you could tell him that, because he doesn't appear to know it.
You profess to know something, anything, that Jacob doesn't know? That's a joke.
Yes, for now it is just talk about plans for the future.
You know that isn't what he means - but that is how you lie all the time, by changing the meaning of the words used. He is saying that Ingebrigtsen has shown nothing that demonstrates he is world-class beyond 5k. He is correct. There are no "plans for the future" that show otherwise. More empty talk.
I agreed with him. How did I change the meaning of any words? There is nothing that says your plans for the future are limited to what you have shown in the past.
The statements he made just days before the Copenhagen half-marathon were made in the context of the Copenhagen half-marathon. The statements he made back in March, eight months ago, were not.
The statements on both occasions were made about the same distance. Has he at any stage said he was mistaken about claiming the HM is his "best distance"? Were the statements that you have exclusively relied on intended to show he is either an empty blowhard or an idiot - because if you take them as definitive of his views that's what it makes him appear? Perhaps the idiocy is yours, in choosing to believe he entered a high profile event that he has previously described as his best distance that he thinks he is in fact so ill-suited he would be lucky to simply finish, and in a pedestrian time. Has he said he is proud of his 63 minute effort and that it was above his expectations because he actually finished?
But only one was about Copenhagen 2024. They are not contradictory statements. Perhaps the idiocy is all yours for failing to understand the sport you are so critical of.
You profess to know something, anything, that Jacob doesn't know? That's a joke.
It’s not a joke. -Jakob has obviously extremely good insight in training for the track events (apart from the 10000m and possibly a time trail 5000m). And after Copenhagen he might even have gotten some new ideas when it comes to distance training. But we don’t know that -we have to refer to what he has said, and he hasn’t given any revision of his earlier claims, for now…
Jakob himself has said that he can’t calculate (because he doesn’t do all out training) what he can do in an event based on his training result, lactate levels, and so on. But in his primary track events he has so much all out experience in the races, so his estimates will never be very far off (but he miscalculated his own expectations in the 3000m, f.x).
The above means the following, IMO: In the distance events Jakob has to pretty much guess his own capability. -He has little racing and all out experience here, and hasn’t even run a long run above 20k, and probably not a fast run substantially above 3k in training (and never a really fast race in the 5000m)…
So yeah, based on Copenhagen I would say that Armstronglivs clearly has some right in what he is saying, and Jakob wrong…
So yeah, based on Copenhagen I would say that Armstronglivs clearly has some right in what he is saying, and Jakob wrong…
"Some right"? lol He knows nothing about training, about periodization, about season goals, he didn't even watch the half marathon... He gets nothing right.
So yeah, based on Copenhagen I would say that Armstronglivs clearly has some right in what he is saying, and Jakob wrong…
This is not rocket science. He raced 1500m to 5000m for 3 months but mostly 3000 and below. Then on a whim at the last moment tries a HM. Goes out at 27:30, gets tired, jogs it in. Not hard to figure out.
I'd be willing to bet the next time the circumstances, and the result, will be much different.
"Some right"? lol He knows nothing about training, about periodization, about season goals, he didn't even watch the half marathon... He gets nothing right.
It’s obvious that Jakob didn’t prioritise the HM in the track season or in mid September. And I also think it’s clear that his preparations weren’t ideal for a HM debut. And yes, season goals and periodisation matters. And maybe also Jakob’s injury winter gave a tougher consequence in the HM than in f.x the 3000m…
But the thing is this: Jakob didn’t only run a really bad 21k in this race, he also disappointed grossly at the 10k mark. And despite losing quite a lot to his finish time because of the too fast opening it’s very hard to define this race as anything else than a complete disaster and a traumatic experience, IMO. And Jakob said afterwards that this was the worst race in his career. -This from a guy that in other races has been so fatigued that he hasn’t been able to speak for an hour, and then he has tried to sit with his back against a wall just has kept on gliding down on the floor. And he has had races there he literally has crawled over the finish line…
Copenhagen was so bad for Jakob that it reminds traumatic even if we give him some slack for everything that weren’t ideal (and by the way: a lot was in fact ideal; the weather, pacing).
I think Jakob needs to adjust his thinking, talking and training when it comes to the distances. And as a fan I really hope he does. But I might of course be wrong -maybe it’s perfectly OK that a range Goat pretender runs slower than the women in his best event because of some periodisation and season goals… I respect that you disagree with me; I only hope you can see that some may view this a little differently than you, and that you don’t get your sleep ruined because of that.
This is not rocket science. He raced 1500m to 5000m for 3 months but mostly 3000 and below. Then on a whim at the last moment tries a HM. Goes out at 27:30, gets tired, jogs it in. Not hard to figure out.
I'd be willing to bet the next time the circumstances, and the result, will be much different.
I too think it will be different next time. But he was too bad both at the 10k and the finish line to link this only to some thinning of the training in the track season. -We know he keeps up his mileage / strength work even in the season. And 27.27 should have been easy peasy for him, with that excellent drafting. And he planned and ran the 5000m as a double in three champs that season -of course he didn’t forget his strength work…
And he didn’t jog it in. -He dragged himself through hell, all the way. -Just rewatch and hear what he says about it… But the most important is what he has kept repeating in the years and months before the race: HM as his sweet spot, based on the current over all training, and that he is (clearly permanently) so good distance trained that he could have run the 10000m in the champs, in addition to 1500/5000m (clearly without a change in the training/preparations) if it wasn’t for the colliding schedule. -This from an athlete that runs a 10k one minute slower than he should with that kind of fatigue!
This is not rocket science. He raced 1500m to 5000m for 3 months but mostly 3000 and below. Then on a whim at the last moment tries a HM. Goes out at 27:30, gets tired, jogs it in. Not hard to figure out.
I'd be willing to bet the next time the circumstances, and the result, will be much different.
I too think it will be different next time. But he was too bad both at the 10k and the finish line to link this only to some thinning of the training in the track season. -We know he keeps up his mileage / strength work even in the season. And 27.27 should have been easy peasy for him, with that excellent drafting. And he planned and ran the 5000m as a double in three champs that season -of course he didn’t forget his strength work…
And he didn’t jog it in. -He dragged himself through hell, all the way. -Just rewatch and hear what he says about it… But the most important is what he has kept repeating in the years and months before the race: HM as his sweet spot, based on the current over all training, and that he is (clearly permanently) so good distance trained that he could have run the 10000m in the champs, in addition to 1500/5000m (clearly without a change in the training/preparations) if it wasn’t for the colliding schedule. -This from an athlete that runs a 10k one minute slower than he should with that kind of fatigue!
WTH are you talking about? He ran a half-marathon with no specific preparation, at the end of a long season focused on running 1500m/5000m. This alone should temper all expectations.
Jakob's expectations were tempered. He didn't say he was in peak shape and ready to set world records in Copenhagen 2024, but that this was a first time test to see if he could even reach the finish.
He ran a national 10K road record, and you think this is "too bad" and he "dissappointed grossly". Then he still closed the last 11.1K, running alone, at faster than 3:15 pace, including all the walking, and you say this wasn't even jogging, but dragging himself through hell.
Arguing that he should be dissappointed because he didn't do something he never said he would at Copenhagen, is head-scratching to say the least.
WTH are you talking about? He ran a half-marathon with no specific preparation, at the end of a long season focused on running 1500m/5000m. This alone should temper all expectations.
Jakob's expectations were tempered. He didn't say he was in peak shape and ready to set world records in Copenhagen 2024, but that this was a first time test to see if he could even reach the finish.
He ran a national 10K road record, and you think this is "too bad" and he "dissappointed grossly". Then he still closed the last 11.1K, running alone, at faster than 3:15 pace, including all the walking, and you say this wasn't even jogging, but dragging himself through hell.
Arguing that he should be dissappointed because he didn't do something he never said he would at Copenhagen, is head-scratching to say the least.
You are just going around all my arguments by not confronting them, and only clinging to your narrative, that is your interpretation that Jakob was satisfied by his performance, despite him saying that it was the worst running experience of his life… And his only positive saying about the race starts with the wording: “At least..” (“I got the NR in the 10k”)..!
You could maybe have gotten away with your reasoning (at least some of it) if Jakob only had run a HM, and that was it. But it wasn’t -Jakob pretty much ran a well paced, all out 10k, in a very bad time; 27.27. And for a guy who pretty much alludes to himself as a gold contender in the 10000m in any championship, clearly without much preparations, that is catastrophic! And the NR -give me a break -it was weak, just like the European record, that he was far behind. It’s pretty much like saying that Jakob was a world beater in the 3000m if he ran 7.39 (that was under the NR before Jakob came along)…
I’m not the only one that got some thoughts after Jakob’s HM -In the Norwegian pod cast “Breaking marathon limits” (by among others 13.11 guy Sindre Buraas; now converting to a “long guy”, and well knowledgeable about the milieu around Jakob) there were agreement in Jakob being a guy with probably the 3000m as his sweet spot, despite also a clear consensus of him being able to break the 5000m WR. But they went that far to ask if Jakob really is built for the HM..!
You are just going around all my arguments by not confronting them, and only clinging to your narrative, that is your interpretation that Jakob was satisfied by his performance, despite him saying that it was the worst running experience of his life… And his only positive saying about the race starts with the wording: “At least..” (“I got the NR in the 10k”)..!
You could maybe have gotten away with your reasoning (at least some of it) if Jakob only had run a HM, and that was it. But it wasn’t -Jakob pretty much ran a well paced, all out 10k, in a very bad time; 27.27. And for a guy who pretty much alludes to himself as a gold contender in the 10000m in any championship, clearly without much preparations, that is catastrophic! And the NR -give me a break -it was weak, just like the European record, that he was far behind. It’s pretty much like saying that Jakob was a world beater in the 3000m if he ran 7.39 (that was under the NR before Jakob came along)…
I’m not the only one that got some thoughts after Jakob’s HM -In the Norwegian pod cast “Breaking marathon limits” (by among others 13.11 guy Sindre Buraas; now converting to a “long guy”, and well knowledgeable about the milieu around Jakob) there were agreement in Jakob being a guy with probably the 3000m as his sweet spot, despite also a clear consensus of him being able to break the 5000m WR. But they went that far to ask if Jakob really is built for the HM..!
You start out with non-sensical assumptions and create false expectations, only to draw nonsense conclusions based on not meeting false expectations.
The only possible narratives are the ones that consider that he didn't train for 10K or the half-marathon, and that this was a last minute addition to a long season focused on 1500m/5000m. This is true, regardless of what Jakob said then and now. But he did tell us the same thing now. This is not the way to enter a race for running your 10K and half-marathon personal bests, so we should stop pretending that was ever the right benchmark.
27:27 is not a very bad time under these conditions, for 10km en route to a half-marathon finish. For reference, he set a national record -- not too bad. 63 minutes was not optimal, but it is still not a bad time, under these conditions. There is no doubt that training and peaking and getting into races with the right conditions and pacers will produce faster times, but none of that is applicable here.
Whether or not anyone thinks he is better built for the HM than 1500m/3000m, the Copenhagen race should change nothing.
Right! Copenhagen was merely an experiment. When running your first half marathon or marathon it's always best to run it as an experiment.... not take it seriously.
This post was edited 4 minutes after it was posted.
Reason provided:
Adding a thought.
Then you could tell him that, because he doesn't appear to know it.
You profess to know something, anything, that Jacob doesn't know? That's a joke.
I'm not professing to tell him something he doesn't know; the poster I was responding to did. They said anyone should know training needs to be specific to the event. Jakob showed he didn't apply that, to going from racing a 1500 to a HM a couple of days later.
So yeah, based on Copenhagen I would say that Armstronglivs clearly has some right in what he is saying, and Jakob wrong…
"Some right"? lol He knows nothing about training, about periodization, about season goals, he didn't even watch the half marathon... He gets nothing right.
63 minutes reduced to a walk before half way. Tell me how "periodization" and "season goals" helped that. And if I had watched the race how would it have been any different?
So yeah, based on Copenhagen I would say that Armstronglivs clearly has some right in what he is saying, and Jakob wrong…
This is not rocket science. He raced 1500m to 5000m for 3 months but mostly 3000 and below. Then on a whim at the last moment tries a HM. Goes out at 27:30, gets tired, jogs it in. Not hard to figure out.
I'd be willing to bet the next time the circumstances, and the result, will be much different.
He ran it slower than Kerr's effort over a HM and Kerr doesn't claim to be a "distance runner" and hasn't also said the HM is his "best distance". By Ingebrigtsen's own estimation of his abilities he failed dismally. Running with the leaders till 10k and then blowing up showed how badly he estimated his ability over the distance.
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