"Everyone in my unit used to run 7 miles at 6 minute pace"

The army does a two-mile test. The Air Force does a 1.5 mile test. I don't know what the other services do, but probably not a 6-mile test so I don't see a forum where they would have even been tested at 6-miles.

I did 2-mile Army PT test in just over 11 minutes if I remember right and once did 113 pushups in a 2-minute test (took 3-rd place in pushup contest). 1000+ pushups a day is probably a big exaggeration for most units but a couple of hundred wouldn't be.

I have yet to read every follow-on post as of yet, but this really is very typical of the military...and I am still in the military.

I can remember back when I was in my MOS school, and I was no spring chicken at the time either, going for a run in which the first mile stretch took us straight out to the beach. The instructor swore that we all ran that mile in 6:40, as if that was fast. The instructor had a massive gut, and we didn't break 7:20 if I remember correctly.

Even when we had a combined inter-service olympic games only 2 of 6 guys who raced, hit 6 min/mi or faster for a 3 mile run. I had to talk to a Marine once who told me that in his unit, the "rabbits" were the 19:30 guys (this is for 3 miles mind you).

I can show up in average shape, run a 1.5 mile timed run right in about 9 minutes and still beat almost everyone in any unit I've been in.

About the "SEAL" comment, the first reply. That dude needs to look up to see what the passing times for a 4 mile timed run in BUD/S Third Phase...it's 28 minutes. That is in boots (actually I think they are moving into shoes now in Third Phase), UDT shorts, and maybe a brown-shirt (t-shirt), and still typically on hard packed sand. Even then, there are many, many BUD/S students that struggle to hit the passing times. Why? Well really, after BUD/S, the operational demands simply don't require a person who is a great distance runner, and not everyone that goes to BUD/S is really that great of a runner. It's not bashing anyone, it's just the truth. SEALs, Special Forces, Pararescue, once they are through their respective selections, they don't need Galen Rupps, they need Cael Sanderson types (and, though Cael is no lightweight, wrestlers historically do really, really well at BUD/S).

wddxx wrote:

No, I said that she'd be about half a mile back. 2:30 minutes at 16:00 pace is about half a mile. I'm right, you're wrong.

To me, a girl who runs 18:30 is certainly not better than pretty good. To me, there are only two classes above pretty good. Those are great and exceptional. 18:30 is neither.

this proves how clueless you are. YOU'RE saying the 16min girl would run another half mile before the 18:30 girl finishes 5k. thats NOT the same as "being a half mile back." the 3min difference is spot on... when the 18:30 girl is 2.6 miles into the race, the clock will read about 15:30. this is the time someone would need to run to beat her by "about a half mile."

i'm right, you're wrong.

I am ex-Army, and one year was asked to enter a team into the Fort Knox Cross Country Championships from our battalion (I was a 1LT at the time). The race was 10K around the streets of Fort Knox, pretty flat and USATF-certified (Google Earth later showed it to be accurate as well). I identified the best runners in the battalion and got the commander to allow me to hold separate PT sessions with them for about 6 weeks leading up to the race. These guys weren't Special Forces or SEALS, just regular guys who joined the Army. The team of 12 included three officers and nine enlisted.

We finished 2nd out of 20 teams, just missing first place by a few spots. The overall winner ran about 32:30, our top guy was 3rd in 33:40, our 2nd guy was about 38:45, and I was our 3rd guy in 39:09 (25th place overall). The rest of our team was strung out between 40:10 and about 44 flat. I think that is a pretty good indication of the running ability of military guys in general. There is a great deal of exaggeration that military people tend to spew forth, but I ran in many military races and I would say that there are very few regular soldiers who can break 40 in a 10K, less than 1% for sure. This race featured the best runners at Fort Know at the time, most of the other guys in my unit had trouble breaking 7:00 for a mile, and quite a few couldn't break 8:00.

I agree that the 6:00 pace mentioned by the OP was probably in kilometers, that would make sense based on my knowledge of military running. A lot of soldiers are dumb enough that they don't know or care about the differences between miles and kilometers, and they will believe anything their sergeant tells them.

wddxx wrote:

A girl running 18min is ok, but it is not pretty good. She's almost half a mile behind the average top-ranked high school girl.

Have you ever coached or watched high school girls XC before?

Team results of active duty men from the army 10 miler. There are a number of teams that averaged well under 60 minutes per man. By percentage, there aren't a lot of fast guys in the army, but there are a few dozen that are quite fast (not counting the all-army team, who are OT qualifiers) It has to be kept in mind, these guys have bigger fish to fry than being great distance runners. Especially if they have been or will recently be deployed.

https://www.armytenmiler.com/results/default.aspx?event=5368&r=3900

1) I've heard this kind of thing from military people before...one guy I know said they all ran 2 miles in under 10:10. I just said, "that's pretty fast". He seemed happy with that answer. No need to argue with him...he either really thinks they all did that (short course or bad memory) or he wants to impress with a lie, and he won't back down from a lie that is intended to impress.2) Non-runners just have no idea what fast is. That male nurse has never run 7 miles at 6 minute pace in his life. I can believe that a FAT guy used to be able to (because I've certainly been fat at times, and I've run WAY faster than that pace for that distance), but when he says that 'everyone' in his unit did that, then that's just BS.3) Don't ever discount older fat guys though...there are LOTS of guys who stop running and get fat who used to be fast once upon a time. I could mention world-class runners who are now fat (but that would be bad form so I won't).To the OP though, if I were in your shoes, since it is about a co-worker's daughter, I would have defended that time as you did. Mid 18s for 5k for a high school girl is a very solid time and in fact WINS some small and even mediums sized school state championships (here in Ohio in 2011, 18:27 won it for DIII, and no girl at any school size broke 18:00 at the state meet). You probably can't convince him that it's a good time though, so any further attempts by you will probably fall on deaf ears, but if HE brings it up again, you should just say, "she finished 12th (or whatever it was) of 237 of the best runners in the whole state)!"

more than you think wrote:

To answer your question, I'd say both times are pretty good.

Too funny - the guy was training with borderline elites, states six minute miles definitely weren't everyday run pace, and you tell him they easily could have been? Thanks for straightening him out, lol.

You can't read. He said that they didn't do long runs at 6 minute pace. But he said that they did tempos at 5:15 pace. Last time i checked, 5:15 is faster than 6. So, yes, they could in fact have done 6minutes for 7 mile runs about everyday.

armand?

UPDATE:

Saw the nurse again today. Last night he called his army buddies who verified that they were all running 6 minute pace back then.

I just responded with how impressed I am that the army is able to get their recruits into such great shape.

He then told me how their commanding officer once made them enter a 5k after a hard night of drinking. His friend won, he got second.

I asked where the 5k was. He changed it to a 6k and said it was in Virginia somewhere. He wasn't really sure.

Now I have something fun to talk with this guy about.

Mainly I was irritated because this guy was lying to insult a coworkers daughter, who finishes in the top 10 at most races. ("pretty fast" - that can be debated)

not a poster follow up report wrote:

UPDATE:

Saw the nurse again today. Last night he called his army buddies who verified that they were all running 6 minute pace back then.

I just responded with how impressed I am that the army is able to get their recruits into such great shape.

He then told me how their commanding officer once made them enter a 5k after a hard night of drinking. His friend won, he got second.

I asked where the 5k was. He changed it to a 6k and said it was in Virginia somewhere. He wasn't really sure.

Now I have something fun to talk with this guy about.

Mainly I was irritated because this guy was lying to insult a coworkers daughter, who finishes in the top 10 at most races. ("pretty fast" - that can be debated)

The military does have sub 4 milers. So did you ever consider the fact that maybe this guy isn't lying? Maybe he wasn't a sub 4 guy, but maybe he was a sub 4:30 guy.

Also, you should figure out what he means by 6 minute pace. He might think 6:59 is 6 minute pace.

Lastly, stop being so defensive and negative. Maybe he just doesn't remember correctly. That is not the same thing as lying.

In general most of the population is generally very ignorant on what it takes to maintain fast paces.

My favorite story was my sophomore year in high school where we were about to do the mile run and I overheard a conversation emanating from two older students.

"What are you going to try to do in the mile today?"

"I don't know man, I think I'm going to go for the world record."

We ran the mile and I finished in about 5:50 and when I finished a different guy walked up to me:

"Damn that was fast! What's the world record? 5:30?"

It didn't really hit me at the time, but most of the population is just in general very uneducated about the speed that elite miler maintain. Excusing the elitist attitude, they don't realize that being a miler involves running at an average-persons sprint pace. It's not some skip through the park type of run.

obviously wddxx is, in fact, the fat nurse of the OP

Do you not see where you've gone wrong here, oh wise one? She (the one who is supposedly half a mile behind) is not running 16.00 pace, she's running 18.30 pace. Therefore half a mile is much closer to 3.00 than 2.30, as such the winner WOULD be running 15.30ish. He was right, you were wrong

asdgfh wrote:

Oh, come on. He wasn't claiming his daughter was going to be on the USA team in Rio. A mid 18 5K for a high school girl is a good time. She certainly won't be qualifying for Footlocker, but do you have to be national caliber to be "pretty good"?

A college teammate of mine had a daughter who ran mid 18's for 5K in cross country and she got scholarship money at a Division I school.

There are always girls in the mid 18s who qualify for Footlocker.

Harry Hill wrote:

Do you not see where you've gone wrong here, oh wise one? She (the one who is supposedly half a mile behind) is not running 16.00 pace, she's running 18.30 pace. Therefore half a mile is much closer to 3.00 than 2.30, as such the winner WOULD be running 15.30ish. He was right, you were wrong

I'm not talking about the 18:30 girl. I'm talking about the 16:00 time. For 16:00 pace, 2:30 is about half a mile. I'm not wrong at all. I said about, and that is about half a mile. Again, I am right and you are wrong for calling me wrong. Unless you think for 16:00 pace that half a mile is not about 2:30.

wddxx wrote:

pretty good

You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

So in your opinion 18's for 5000 meters at 5000 ft for female D2 ALL AMERICAN Runners is not good? Even the mens race was BARELY won in under 15 minutes by guys that had run low 14's if not in the high 13's. Don't look up state results for Colorado High School Cross Country then because you are in for a rude awakening as we don't have the sea level option here!

not a poster follow up report wrote:

UPDATE:

Saw the nurse again today. Last night he called his army buddies who verified that they were all running 6 minute pace back then.

)

I forgot to tell you this also.