malmo wrote:
That was my main point all along -- that you need to be in 3:30/12:40 shape at the same time (or within a couple of months) if you are going to get that 3000 record.
Even though his season's best for 1500m in 1996 was 3:34?
malmo wrote:
That was my main point all along -- that you need to be in 3:30/12:40 shape at the same time (or within a couple of months) if you are going to get that 3000 record.
Even though his season's best for 1500m in 1996 was 3:34?
Just fyi that race went:
El Guerroudj 3:33.45
William Tanui 3:33.62
Komen 3:34.17
which was a PR for him at the time.
I don't know how it played out as far as pace and tactics.
He split 3:55.0 for one mile en route to 7:20, so I think it's safe to assume he was worth better than 3:34 in 1996.
Komen was neither in 3:30 or 12:40 shape for his 7:20. His bests that year were in 3:34 and 12:45.
See no reason why ElG wouldn't be on top of this record if he took the attempts as seriously as Komen did.
Gilberto wrote:
Even though his season's best for 1500m in 1996 was 3:34?
Yes.
"that you need to be in 3:30/12:40 shape "
07/08 12:51.60 1 Stockholm
07/14 8:03.54 1 Lappeenranta
08/10 7:25.16 1 Monaco
08/14 12:45.09 1 Zürich
08/16 3:34.17 3 Köln
08/23 7:25.87 1 Bruxelles
08/30 13:02.62 1 Berlin
09/01 7:20.67 WR 1 Rieti
09/07 12:52.38 1 Milano
09/09 3:35.16 2 Sarajevo
time flies wrote:
Komen was neither in 3:30 or 12:40 shape for his 7:20. His bests that year were in 3:34 and 12:45.
Sure he was.
Lorenzo the Magnificent wrote:
Just fyi that race went:
El Guerroudj 3:33.45
William Tanui 3:33.62
Komen 3:34.17
which was a PR for him at the time.
I don't know how it played out as far as pace and tactics.
Komen warmed up with a 12:45 5000 48 hours before.
iirc the wr at the time was geb's 12'44 & they were on schedule to break it at 4k
geb wasn't happy at prospect of this ( he'd been wasted by atlanta 10k & not ready for komen ( it's possible he may never have been ) ) & to deny komen he took the lead & slowed it down so wr was not possible
komen was partly at fault for not just ignoring geb & going around him & just charging on, but i assumed he respected the man & allowed him to turn it into a tactical affair
if komen had ignored geb's desperate attempt to cling onto his wr & carried on instead, i have little doubt he wouda gone many secs faster than the 12'45 he won with
12'40 was certainly on
( is this on youtube ?
my memories a bit hazy of the race, but that's what i generally recall )
cologne was a double-edge sword type of meet
it was actually my favorite meet & you had more chance of breaking a wr there than rieti ( if you look upto the date it defuncted, i do believe more wrs were run there than rieti in the previous 30y )
however, no one denies it was a 2nd tier meet in terms of publicity/prestige/etc
it usually went 2 ways :
either you ran a spectacular time or you ran something mediocre - there wasn't usually much in-between
it's pretty obvious that a 1500 with hicham only winning in 3'33 represented the latter...
malmo wrote:
time flies wrote:Komen was neither in 3:30 or 12:40 shape for his 7:20. His bests that year were in 3:34 and 12:45.
Sure he was.
Prove it.
7:20 for 3000m ain't jogging, mofos. Let me tell you, no one's gonna touch 58.5 seconds per lap
ventolin^3 wrote:
iirc the wr at the time was geb's 12'44 & they were on schedule to break it at 4k
geb wasn't happy at prospect of this ( he'd been wasted by atlanta 10k & not ready for komen ( it's possible he may never have been ) ) & to deny komen he took the lead & slowed it down so wr was not possible
komen was partly at fault for not just ignoring geb & going around him & just charging on, but i assumed he respected the man & allowed him to turn it into a tactical affair
if komen had ignored geb's desperate attempt to cling onto his wr & carried on instead, i have little doubt he wouda gone many secs faster than the 12'45 he won with
12'40 was certainly on
( is this on youtube ?
my memories a bit hazy of the race, but that's what i generally recall )
It used to be on youtube. The strange thing is that Komen and Gebrsellassie were dead even with 120 meters to go then Geb just started jogging. The entire difference 12:45 to 12:52 was the last straight home, and Komen wasn't running any faster.
In 1996 Komen ran 12:45.1 at Zurich then ran his 7:20 two weeks later.
In 1997 Komen ran 12:44.9 at Zurich then ran his 12:39 a week later.
that was fractionally funny by the 10th time you posted it 5y ago...
malmo wrote:In 1997 Komen ran 12:44.9 at Zurich then ran his 12:39 a week later.
12:44.90 - 13.08.1997
3:29.46 - 16.08.1997
12:39.74 - 22.08.1997
3:46.38 - 26.08.1997
This is an absolute criminal record of activity, akin to a South-East Asia sweatshop.
Either he/or manager were greedy or idiots to run all these within 13 days !
A current WR-calibre guy would probably pick just one race to run in a 2 week period to maximise his effort & get his manager to arrange the best possible pacing.
Looking dispassionately at those, a maximal effort in just one race in 2/52 span would have to be a discussable
~ 12'35/12'37
3'28.0/3'28.5
I'll have to jack-up my estimation of Komen's 1500/5k ability
ventolin^3 wrote:
12:44.90 - 13.08.1997
3:29.46 - 16.08.1997
12:39.74 - 22.08.1997
3:46.38 - 26.08.1997
This is an absolute criminal record of activity, akin to a South-East Asia sweatshop.
Either he/or manager were greedy or idiots to run all these within 13 days !
ventolin, a professional runner makes money when he is running. August in Europe is showtime.
There is probably more money to be gained from a WR than 3 or 4 near misses - current money & with fact there hasn't been a 1500 - 10k WR for 5y, I'm sure a manager could negotiate a 100k+ payout, considering Bolt gets ?250k for a 100m race each time.
Besides, Bekele used to race fairly sparingly until committed to Golden/Diamond league & Geb wasn't a frequent racer - maybe Hermens did negotiate better deals than the guys who manage the Kenyans
Just stumbled across this article on Komen. Not really related to the discussion, but gives some background on Komen and what he's up to these days.
Wait is that legit that he wants to run the NYC marathon in November?
That article is great, thank you. His naivety in running must have helped. Anyone going through 1k in a 3000m race in 2:25 would panic, no matter how fit, talented or even how relaxed they might have felt. The reaction of Cram + Hutchings illustrate that perfectly.... they had a pre-concieved idea that 2:25 was too fast where's Komen didn't know it was too fast, so he just ran it and carried on. He may have only burned brightly for a short period but the guy was off the charts.
I'd love to see that 5000m where he reduces Geb to a jog. Machine.
As for running NYC. It's probably legit if he says he wants to run. But it seems clear he was motivated by money and wealth.... he has both of those now and has announced comebacks before. He's such a freak he could probably train like crazy from now till NY and still run a super fast time but the motivation needs to be there. He did turn up as a pace maker in a big city marathon a few years ago though.