USAIN BOLT emergence and the Jamaicans unseen sprint domination, your thoughts?

unlikely wrote:

All right, I've tried to be civil, but its clear now you are an idiot, a troll, or a 3rd grader.

If you concur that West African descendants in the US and West African descendants in Jamaica are genetically the same, and therefore in any random sprint event the probability for the top finishers is like drawing names out of hat, THEN YOU HAVE TO CONSIDER THAT THE HAT HAS 41 MILLION AMERICAN NAMES AND 2.8 MILLION JAMAICAN NAMES.

In what magical probability space-time continuum do YOU live in that says the chances are exactly the same of 3 consecutive Jamaican names as 3 consecutive American names in this pool? How can you not see that isn't the case?

What happens in a random sprint event? This is just confused. There is no hat with 41 million names in it. You seem to have forgotten the fact that each country has 3 representatives therefore if the final result is decided by drawing names out of a hat the probability of a 1-2-3 from either country is the same. Please stop talking about probability, you're making no sense. Dumbass.

You could say healthiest or most vigorous, whatever, but in those terms strongest and fastest are parallel tracks. Take a look at the builds of the guys lining up for the 100 and that is evident.

Its not my theory, but it does fit with the fact that few actual West Africans have had great success when the majority of genetically West African people live in West Africa, so its worth mentioning.

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West Africans/west African decendents, no matter where they live, are not " healthiest, vigerous, stronger, faster, whatever". They have one of the greatest proportions of fast twitch muscle, therefore they are faster at sprinting. No doubt they would make terrible distance runners or even weight lifters? The muscular builds are because they are sprinters

Living in a west african country is not great for developing track talent. little things like Wars, lack of basic medical care tend to interupt training. But regardless Nigeria has produced some very good sprinters

Track in Jamaica gets huge participation

It's not required to bring up hertiage everytime there is a discussion concerning sprints and distance running. The fact that the ancestors are from a particular region of the world has no bearing if A PARTICUALR sprinter or distance runner is using performance enhancing drugs. The past success of his or her countrymen two decades before them has no bearing!! In fact the only factors is the individual athletes themselves, their coaching, and how honest/moral they are as a person and athlete.

Outliers wrote:Many Jamaicans get serious exposure to track at an early age with their

prep school champs where rival schools compete against each other to be acclaimed the fastest in the country. That event has a 100 year history -

don't understimate the influence of programs like these in giving kids a head start.

& that school champs has not got any more important in recent years than it was 20 or 30y ago & all jama used to produce was 1 gold-calibre athlete in maybe every 5y :

- before bolt there was only safa & before then last jama to win a global was cameron in 400 in '83 !

- on women's side, only trecia smith in tj won a global gold in 12y since deon in 400h in atlanta

this school conveyor belt had been around all this time & it was producing shit

now all of a sudden in 1y from osaka to peking, they go from 0 golds to 6 golds ( & wouda been 7 if they'd got women's 4x100 around )

this stuff about schools champs/early exposure/etc is hogwash - you don't go from zero to hero in 1y as a country without some nefarious factors involved

Outliers wrote:Many Jamaicans get serious exposure to track at an early age with their

prep school champs where rival schools compete against each other to be acclaimed the fastest in the country. That event has a 100 year history -

don't understimate the influence of programs like these in giving kids a head start.

& that school champs has not got any more important in recent years than it was 20 or 30y ago & all jama used to produce was 1 gold-calibre athlete in maybe every 5y :

- before bolt there was only safa & before then last jama to win a global was cameron in 400 in '83 !

- on women's side, only trecia smith in tj won a global gold in 12y since deon in 400h in atlanta

this school conveyor belt had been around all this time & it was producing shit

now all of a sudden in 1y from osaka to peking, they go from 0 golds to 6 golds ( & wouda been 7 if they'd got women's 4x100 around )

this stuff about schools champs/early exposure/etc is hogwash - you don't go from zero to hero in 1y as a country without some nefarious factors involved

Everything points at state-run or organized doping program.

Maybe some of the 5 will be off the hook due to technicalities. Either way, they are the sacrificial lamb

and it seems like a good way to divert the attention from.

justthefacts wrote:Incidentally, you ignore West Africa itself in your analysis. What does it mean than the US has produced more sprint champions from it's West African descended sprinters than West Africa itself? The pool is West Africa is so much bigger than the US' 41 million, right? Does that make you highly suspicious of US sprinters, or do you have a neat explanation in that case? Let's have a little consistency please.

i come into contact with more nigerians than most here thru work & i'm astounded by some of them

more likely than not i see 6'4/210 bespectacled guys with about as much fat on them as a hummingbird & i used to exclaim

"wow, are you an athlete - basketball or soccer maybe"

& i'd get the indignant response

"no !

i am an accountant !!!"

the women are little different - 5'10 ( but they are usually fat as their culture seems to like fat women - similar to america ) housewives

the talent pool available for sprinting in west africa is absolutely unlimited - with my experienced eye, any of these guys woud been 10-flat no problem, but the ultimate aim in their culture is to be a professional - doctor, lawyer, engineer, accountant, etc & not a sportsman - former guarantees a living in the 3rd world - latter doesn't

The below poster is so full of himself, saying..."with my eye any of these guys would be 10 flat no problem". So many posters trying to sound intelligent and bring in the West Africa and hertiage and numbers crap but it all boils down to if any of the Jamicians and their big improvements and their countrymen's positive drugs results are as guilty and without morals as the ones that tested positive recently from Jamaica.

"before bolt there was only safa & before then last jama to win a global was cameron in 400 in '83!" (quote)

Absolute nonsense.

A certain Linford Christie representing Britain won the 100mt gold at Barcelona in 92 and a certain Donovan Bailey representing Canada won the 100mt gold at Atlanta in 96.

Are you so ignorant about the sport that you’re unaware that both of these were born in Jamaica?

In fact, three quarters of the Canadian 4 by 100 team that beat the US at Atlanta were of Jamaican origin.

The other runner was also Caribbean.

Jamaica has a population the size of St Louis - just check how many sprint medals a nation that size has won at the Olympics since the War.

err...

when did they play the jama national anthem at the medal ceremony ???

as for those guys, linford was doped & so was bailey - a 10.36 nobody who goes to 9.91 & a WC in 2y !

it's really funny that there are still people that think bolt and his buddies are clean!

Bernard Lagat could break 10 in the 100 with proper training.

Bekele couldn't break 27 min. in the 10000 if not depending on wabbits.

The below poster is so full of himself, saying..."with my eye any of these guys would be 10 flat no problem". So many posters trying to sound intelligent and bring in the West Africa and hertiage and numbers crap but it all boils down to if any of the Jamicians and their big improvements and their countrymen's positive drugs results are as guilty and without morals as the ones that tested positive recently from Jamaica.

Wow...at least the poster you refer to produced an understandable statement. What the hell is your thing trying to say?

Let me guess. You think Maggie Vessey and Nick Symmonds are clean. You probably think Jenny Barringer, Shalane Flanagan and Kara Goucher are clean too. How did these American distance women all of a sudden become competitive on the world scene? How naive you are.

Usian Bolt won the World Junior Title at the age of 15 I think and then went in hibernation in regards to winning another international title until 2008. So for over 5 years the talented Usain Bolt couldn't win an international title after his days as a junior. Usain Bolt is a great talented; however, being a great talent doesn't eliminate you from becoming a drug user to become a consistent winner, world record holder, and legendary in the sport!

naivete wrote:

Let me guess. You think Maggie Vessey and Nick Symmonds are clean. You probably think Jenny Barringer, Shalane Flanagan and Kara Goucher are clean too. How did these American distance women all of a sudden become competitive on the world scene? How naive you are.

uhhhh...no?

what did I say that would make you assume any of that.

you know what they say about assuming!

Very nice points about sudden improvement even from a talented athlete! Usain Bolt and his Jamician counterparts could very well be cleaned; however, least we forget that many talented athletes have gone years without a positive test and a few retired- only to be implicated later.

spot on!

Whatever happens in the future, it was only the incredibly charismatic presence of that athletic superstar in every sense of the word, Usain Bolt, that saved athletics at the Beijing Olympics from being remembered as one of the most boring and mediocre in history.

Oh, (yawn) Bekele predictably won the 5 and 10K - easily.

I can’t even remember who won the 800 or the steeplechase - and one we always knew was dirty, Ramzi, won the 1500.

Athletics is supposed to be the centrepiece of the Games.

Up to Bolts appearance - all the publicity was for Phelps.

Right now, Bolt is the greatest ambassador and image for athletics one could possibly hope for.