I remember many, many years ago a little known Tanzanian runner lined up for the 1500m at the 1974 Commonwealth Games against the great John Walker and proceeded to win a loaded 1500m race , front running a world record time and the next year in 1975, he did the same against the best of America such as Marty Liquori and again won a front running world record for the mile. It is possible a person can come from obscurity in Africa and crush it. It would be intriguing if he could break the world record. No one owes it to wait for Jakob or anyone else to someday break it. It's time for those records to go. Now if whomever breaks it and we find out down the road that he was cheating, that would be a real bummer. But just because they are young doesn't mean they can't be great. Kipchoge in the World Champ 5,000 as an 18 year old, Ismael Karui world champ 5,000 as an 18 year old just beating another 18 year old at the time Haile Gebrselassie. With regard to cheating, so many Kenyans have been busted and that could indicate a vigorous testing program that could act as a deterrent or not! To answer the original question this 1500/mile record needs to go and I don't care if the young Kenyan does it! We can't just keep waiting for Jakob!
Why would I care? Whoever breaks the record breaks the record. I am not going to be racist about it. You don’t run 3:26 or 7:17 without a little help from the pharmacy.
Jakob Ingebrigsten has run those times, So It can be done, great if Phanuel Koech runs 3:25 or faster, until someone has been caught and convicted in a court either by a Judge or a Jury of 12 Peers who have to believe the person is guilty beyond a shadow of a doubt (or maybe a Reasonable Doubt, I am not sure which one) the person has to be considered INNOCENT, That is the rule, The founding Fathers made.
this might be the law of the land in the legal system in the US of A but this isn't at all how it works in world athletics
To me it would be much less satisfying than seeing someone like Jakob get it. It’s not that I dislike Koech, but I wouldn’t feel like I could trust the record any more than I already do as it stands with El Guerrouj. If Jakob broke it, then I feel like I would appreciate that he has been a trusted athlete in the sport for a while now and that it’s possible the record is clean
and no, this has nothing to do with race as one poster alluded.
Lance Armstrong was “a trusted athlete in the sport” for quite some time. This means nothing.
wut?? No he wasn't... aside from the US media everyone that followed the sport even casually knew he was juiced to the max
I remember many, many years ago a little known Tanzanian runner lined up for the 1500m at the 1974 Commonwealth Games against the great John Walker and proceeded to win a loaded 1500m race , front running a world record time and the next year in 1975, he did the same against the best of America such as Marty Liquori and again won a front running world record for the mile. It is possible a person can come from obscurity in Africa and crush it. It would be intriguing if he could break the world record. No one owes it to wait for Jakob or anyone else to someday break it. It's time for those records to go. Now if whomever breaks it and we find out down the road that he was cheating, that would be a real bummer. But just because they are young doesn't mean they can't be great. Kipchoge in the World Champ 5,000 as an 18 year old, Ismael Karui world champ 5,000 as an 18 year old just beating another 18 year old at the time Haile Gebrselassie. With regard to cheating, so many Kenyans have been busted and that could indicate a vigorous testing program that could act as a deterrent or not! To answer the original question this 1500/mile record needs to go and I don't care if the young Kenyan does it! We can't just keep waiting for Jakob!
F & G bs to run cover for drug abusers. Bayi was well known as he had lit ip the European circuit in ‘73 with fast paces that revitalized the 1500/mile after Ryun had put the records far out of reach for awhile. Bayi was very well known and expected to challenge the record. This latest fake teen shows up and posts an all-time clocking literally out of nowhere, dropping from 3:33 to 3:27. Yeah, it rightfully raises eyebrows.
I remember many, many years ago a little known Tanzanian runner lined up for the 1500m at the 1974 Commonwealth Games against the great John Walker and proceeded to win a loaded 1500m race , front running a world record time and the next year in 1975, he did the same against the best of America such as Marty Liquori and again won a front running world record for the mile. It is possible a person can come from obscurity in Africa and crush it. It would be intriguing if he could break the world record. No one owes it to wait for Jakob or anyone else to someday break it. It's time for those records to go. Now if whomever breaks it and we find out down the road that he was cheating, that would be a real bummer. But just because they are young doesn't mean they can't be great. Kipchoge in the World Champ 5,000 as an 18 year old, Ismael Karui world champ 5,000 as an 18 year old just beating another 18 year old at the time Haile Gebrselassie. With regard to cheating, so many Kenyans have been busted and that could indicate a vigorous testing program that could act as a deterrent or not! To answer the original question this 1500/mile record needs to go and I don't care if the young Kenyan does it! We can't just keep waiting for Jakob!
Bayi was a GOAT type, with a front run 332 waaaaayyyy back in the day erratic pace
he had malaria on top which curtailed his career.
ran 145 flat 800 that meet and Walker with PR of 144.9
both could run a lot faster, as all 1500 men can, but the training wasn't for that.
in Tanzania there was no drug culture, no peds, no nothing.
i suppose there could have been amphetamines in theory, but there is no sniff of nothing after all the years.
Bayi dragged the field to immense PRs, that is the kind of race you chop at least 2 seconds off your PR...
I think it would feel a little unsatisfying. But to be clear he didn’t even win the race in which he ran 3:27. So there’s a long way to go. Though 1500 running has changed and breaking 3:28 is more like 3:29 of the past, it’s not like the NCAA 1500m record…yet.
To me it would be much less satisfying than seeing someone like Jakob get it. It’s not that I dislike Koech, but I wouldn’t feel like I could trust the record any more than I already do as it stands with El Guerrouj. If Jakob broke it, then I feel like I would appreciate that he has been a trusted athlete in the sport for a while now and that it’s possible the record is clean
and no, this has nothing to do with race as one poster alluded.
Your post is ironic. You imply Jakob is clean and El Guerrouj was dirty, when comparing Koech to both of them.
Yet I'd say Jakob and El G are far more similar in terms of progression than Koech is to either of them.
To clarify, you need to give El G the same benefit of the doubt that you have given to Jakob.
This post was edited 29 seconds after it was posted.
I remember many, many years ago a little known Tanzanian runner lined up for the 1500m at the 1974 Commonwealth Games against the great John Walker and proceeded to win a loaded 1500m race , front running a world record time and the next year in 1975, he did the same against the best of America such as Marty Liquori and again won a front running world record for the mile. It is possible a person can come from obscurity in Africa and crush it. It would be intriguing if he could break the world record. No one owes it to wait for Jakob or anyone else to someday break it. It's time for those records to go. Now if whomever breaks it and we find out down the road that he was cheating, that would be a real bummer. But just because they are young doesn't mean they can't be great. Kipchoge in the World Champ 5,000 as an 18 year old, Ismael Karui world champ 5,000 as an 18 year old just beating another 18 year old at the time Haile Gebrselassie. With regard to cheating, so many Kenyans have been busted and that could indicate a vigorous testing program that could act as a deterrent or not! To answer the original question this 1500/mile record needs to go and I don't care if the young Kenyan does it! We can't just keep waiting for Jakob!
To clarify your history of 1974, Bayi already had a growing reputation when he turned up in Christchurch whereas Walker at that time didn't, outside New Zealand. Christchurch took them both to the top of the sport.
I remember many, many years ago a little known Tanzanian runner lined up for the 1500m at the 1974 Commonwealth Games against the great John Walker and proceeded to win a loaded 1500m race , front running a world record time and the next year in 1975, he did the same against the best of America such as Marty Liquori and again won a front running world record for the mile. It is possible a person can come from obscurity in Africa and crush it. It would be intriguing if he could break the world record. No one owes it to wait for Jakob or anyone else to someday break it. It's time for those records to go. Now if whomever breaks it and we find out down the road that he was cheating, that would be a real bummer. But just because they are young doesn't mean they can't be great. Kipchoge in the World Champ 5,000 as an 18 year old, Ismael Karui world champ 5,000 as an 18 year old just beating another 18 year old at the time Haile Gebrselassie. With regard to cheating, so many Kenyans have been busted and that could indicate a vigorous testing program that could act as a deterrent or not! To answer the original question this 1500/mile record needs to go and I don't care if the young Kenyan does it! We can't just keep waiting for Jakob!
Bayi was a GOAT type, with a front run 332 waaaaayyyy back in the day erratic pace
he had malaria on top which curtailed his career.
ran 145 flat 800 that meet and Walker with PR of 144.9
both could run a lot faster, as all 1500 men can, but the training wasn't for that.
in Tanzania there was no drug culture, no peds, no nothing.
i suppose there could have been amphetamines in theory, but there is no sniff of nothing after all the years.
Bayi dragged the field to immense PRs, that is the kind of race you chop at least 2 seconds off your PR...
In the early seventies drugs were still pretty much an unknown in distance running. The first whiff of anything was the talk of blood doping by the Finns. On the other hand it was known that drugs - mainly steroids - were being used in strength events, field events and the sprints.
Really, who other than El G cares if his record is broken? He was as dirty as the floor of a movie theater, imo.
Agreed.
If Koech breaks 3:26.00, I will be happy. Because we can stop pretending that a doped-to-the-gills EPO-era pre-superspikes time from the 1990s should be the north star for 1500m running.
1998 was 27 year ago; I have no sentimental love for the late-90s era of unchecked EPO use, nor for El G.
HUH????????????????? I'm mind-boggled with folks like you sir!!!!!!!!! You are unforgivable!!!!! You don't my man El Kingdom so don't defame him!!!!!!!!!!!
To me it would be much less satisfying than seeing someone like Jakob get it. It’s not that I dislike Koech, but I wouldn’t feel like I could trust the record any more than I already do as it stands with El Guerrouj. If Jakob broke it, then I feel like I would appreciate that he has been a trusted athlete in the sport for a while now and that it’s possible the record is clean
and no, this has nothing to do with race as one poster alluded.
Your post is ironic. You imply Jakob is clean and El Guerrouj was dirty, when comparing Koech to both of them.
Yet I'd say Jakob and El G are far more similar in terms of progression than Koech is to either of them.
To clarify, you need to give El G the same benefit of the doubt that you have given to Jakob.
Yes I agree sir!!!!!! That's fair but the folks on this thread are way too racist against skin of color, brown apparently for Italian Roman descent that is El Kingdom!!!!!!!!!! I don't get why LRC hates this guy so much!!!!!! I mean he gave this sport EVERYTHING, ALL THE PRESTIGE, FAME, REPUTATION, 3 TIMES WORLD ATHLETE OF THE YEAR WHICH IS IMPOSSIBLE FOR A MILER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
This post was edited 1 minute after it was posted.
Let’s completely set aside the possibility that he may or may not get busted in the future.
How would you feel if, after all this time, some relatively unknown pops up out of nowhere and breaks the WR? Would it be aggravating that so many seemingly more trustworthy athletes like Jakob, Kerr, Hocker, Nuguse, etc. have been getting closer and closer, only to see it get taken down by some unknown?
Obviously if Koech is doping, it would be preferable if he doesn’t touch the WR at all. But, given the suspicion around El Guerrouj anyway, do you really care if another highly suspect athlete takes the record? Is it “special” to you at all, or do you not really care to see it go?
just curious about what people think.
It happens with bicarbonate now widely available in Kenya I supposed. Niels Laros ran 3:29 as an 19 year old and he is white. You have to expect East Africans of same age to run much faster due to a much more hospitable electromagnetic field environment in Kenya and Ethiopia!!
I remember many, many years ago a little known Tanzanian runner lined up for the 1500m at the 1974 Commonwealth Games against the great John Walker and proceeded to win a loaded 1500m race , front running a world record time and the next year in 1975, he did the same against the best of America such as Marty Liquori and again won a front running world record for the mile. It is possible a person can come from obscurity in Africa and crush it. It would be intriguing if he could break the world record. No one owes it to wait for Jakob or anyone else to someday break it. It's time for those records to go. Now if whomever breaks it and we find out down the road that he was cheating, that would be a real bummer. But just because they are young doesn't mean they can't be great. Kipchoge in the World Champ 5,000 as an 18 year old, Ismael Karui world champ 5,000 as an 18 year old just beating another 18 year old at the time Haile Gebrselassie. With regard to cheating, so many Kenyans have been busted and that could indicate a vigorous testing program that could act as a deterrent or not! To answer the original question this 1500/mile record needs to go and I don't care if the young Kenyan does it! We can't just keep waiting for Jakob!
Bayi was a GOAT type, with a front run 332 waaaaayyyy back in the day erratic pace
he had malaria on top which curtailed his career.
ran 145 flat 800 that meet and Walker with PR of 144.9
both could run a lot faster, as all 1500 men can, but the training wasn't for that.
in Tanzania there was no drug culture, no peds, no nothing.
i suppose there could have been amphetamines in theory, but there is no sniff of nothing after all the years.
Bayi dragged the field to immense PRs, that is the kind of race you chop at least 2 seconds off your PR...
I agree. Tanzania the place of Mount Kilimanjaro is hallowed nation of sport. Just ask John Yuda, the man who nearly beat Kenny Bekele at the Lausanne world XC in 2003 or was it Dublin 2002? He was skinny as hell and was the hardest blue collar worker out there!! Tanzanians are far more innocent people than the corrupt Kenyans!!
This post was edited 1 minute after it was posted.
I remember many, many years ago a little known Tanzanian runner lined up for the 1500m at the 1974 Commonwealth Games against the great John Walker and proceeded to win a loaded 1500m race , front running a world record time and the next year in 1975, he did the same against the best of America such as Marty Liquori and again won a front running world record for the mile. It is possible a person can come from obscurity in Africa and crush it. It would be intriguing if he could break the world record. No one owes it to wait for Jakob or anyone else to someday break it. It's time for those records to go. Now if whomever breaks it and we find out down the road that he was cheating, that would be a real bummer. But just because they are young doesn't mean they can't be great. Kipchoge in the World Champ 5,000 as an 18 year old, Ismael Karui world champ 5,000 as an 18 year old just beating another 18 year old at the time Haile Gebrselassie. With regard to cheating, so many Kenyans have been busted and that could indicate a vigorous testing program that could act as a deterrent or not! To answer the original question this 1500/mile record needs to go and I don't care if the young Kenyan does it! We can't just keep waiting for Jakob!
Oh don’t you worry one bit about the WR not going this year. Ritzenhein is wrong, it’s not going to be broken this year. Dude doesn’t know what he is talking about. 3:26:00 and 3:27:49 is aeons apart and with a Jakob injured and Shocker and Nuguse all declining it seems even the ravishing beloved Josh Kerr is still a long shot for 3:26:99 much less 3:25:99 but Kerr still has the best chance!!