The ignorance is in assuming you are "smart enough to know" what "a lot of [us] want," and that it relates solely to marathon performance. You quite clearly don't know.
Some comments seem to indicate that she has a choice here. Seidel has been completely transparent with her mental health challenges for a very long time now. It sounds like she is really struggling and is hoping that this prescription will help her to lead a more functional life. Everyone deserves to live a life without struggle if possible. Give her a break. I am pretty sure if Molly was offered either a life completely without mental health issues, or a life full of struggle but with Olympic Gold and world records in the marathon, she would chose to live a simple happy life free of the struggle and quit competitive running immediately. Hopefully, her path to get a TUE will allow her to treat her condition AND continue running competitively. If that can't happen, at least she tried and was open about it.
Some comments seem to indicate that she has a choice here. Seidel has been completely transparent with her mental health challenges for a very long time now. It sounds like she is really struggling and is hoping that this prescription will help her to lead a more functional life. Everyone deserves to live a life without struggle if possible. Give her a break. I am pretty sure if Molly was offered either a life completely without mental health issues, or a life full of struggle but with Olympic Gold and world records in the marathon, she would chose to live a simple happy life free of the struggle and quit competitive running immediately. Hopefully, her path to get a TUE will allow her to treat her condition AND continue running competitively. If that can't happen, at least she tried and was open about it.
But Lenny, this is an answer that provides nuance and shows that Molly could be allowed to pursue both a competitive career AND have a healthy life free of mental illness! That clearly violates the LetsRun policy of being a judgmental holier-than-thou a**hat who thinks they know more about ADHD than mental health / psych professionals.
Some comments seem to indicate that she has a choice here. Seidel has been completely transparent with her mental health challenges for a very long time now. It sounds like she is really struggling and is hoping that this prescription will help her to lead a more functional life. Everyone deserves to live a life without struggle if possible. Give her a break. I am pretty sure if Molly was offered either a life completely without mental health issues, or a life full of struggle but with Olympic Gold and world records in the marathon, she would chose to live a simple happy life free of the struggle and quit competitive running immediately. Hopefully, her path to get a TUE will allow her to treat her condition AND continue running competitively. If that can't happen, at least she tried and was open about it.
You all are hypocrites. You roast Shelby Houlihan on a spit for PED use and yet refuse to condemn Molly Seidel for also using PEDs.
Some comments seem to indicate that she has a choice here. Seidel has been completely transparent with her mental health challenges for a very long time now. It sounds like she is really struggling and is hoping that this prescription will help her to lead a more functional life. Everyone deserves to live a life without struggle if possible. Give her a break. I am pretty sure if Molly was offered either a life completely without mental health issues, or a life full of struggle but with Olympic Gold and world records in the marathon, she would chose to live a simple happy life free of the struggle and quit competitive running immediately. Hopefully, her path to get a TUE will allow her to treat her condition AND continue running competitively. If that can't happen, at least she tried and was open about it.
You all are hypocrites. You roast Shelby Houlihan on a spit for PED use and yet refuse to condemn Molly Seidel for also using PEDs.
Or a third explanation is that she was on something else for her ADHD and now has had to change prescriptions or dosage or something per her doctor. Everything is not always black or white.
Makes Paper actually succeeded in making me read her whole story on IG - it is option 1 (a new development).
I took adderall for years. This is sad to see honestly. It works great until it doesn’t - and then you are in for a world of pain and regret. I wish her well, but I fear she is going through the honeymoon phase right now. Let’s check back in in a year or two. She’ll be wishing she never touched this stuff.
I find this topic interesting, how long before the drug turned on you?
I was diagnosed with ADHD in 7th grade and started taking concerta. I've been taking ADHD medications for about 15 years. I definitely had difficulties focusing in school but my grades were actually pretty good. I don't think there was any change in my school performance from when I started taking concerta. I was diagnosed with the inattentive form of ADHD. I wasn't super hyper but I did have trouble focusing. When I started taking concerta I would go the whole school day without speaking to anyone. I NEVER participated in class. I think I had trouble staying friends with people because I just wouldn't talk during the school day. At some point during high school I switched over to Ritalin which was much more enjoyable than concerta. Ritalin was more of a rush and concerta was a slow release. I never purposefully took it before races in high school but I was definitely still "on it" at practice or dual meets. At some point in high school I realized that I could really motivate myself to train or race if I just took a small dose of Ritalin beforehand. But it's not all good. I would feel motivated to train but I actually wouldn't feel that good while training. An easy run would feel more difficult but it didn't matter because I was so determined to train. Some people might feel that there is a decrease in perceived effort, but I don't think it's that simple. When I took it to run I would feel better and worse at the same time. If you want to decrease perceived effort just drink coffee, it's much better imo. There are also the stomach issues that come along with taking Ritalin. You are supposed to eat after taking Ritalin but if you eat after taking it then it wouldn't really help for your run. So you have to eat before you take it which can work fine but can cause stomach issues. I took it before runs in college because I liked the motivation that it gave me but did it really help? I don't know. I think I noticed a change after college in the way I was taking it. Every day I would wake up to drive to work and I NEEDED to take 10mg of Ritalin or else it would take me 4+ hours to wake up. I started getting really tired during the day. Basically falling asleep at my desk. I would sleep 7+ hours a night so I don't think that was the issue. It just started to feel like I was unable to function without taking my meds. When I was working a doctor suggested that I start trying to come off the meds. I talked him out of it and convinced him that I needed it. It's pretty easy to stay on ADHD meds as long as you know what to say. It's hard to know if my life would have been better off if I was never diagnosed with ADHD. On one side it has allowed me to focus extremely well but then there are the negative side effects like irritability, loss of appetite (sometimes the thought of eating make me want to vomit), dizziness, headache, and so on.
Am I addicted to it? Probably. Nothing will stand between me and getting that prescription. Of all the things I forgot on a daily basis I will never forget to request a medication refill. I assume people will respond to this saying that I should decrease my dose or see a doctor about it but I'm not going to and there really isn't anything someone could say to get me to stop taking it. With all of the downsides the rush that I get in the first hour of taking the drug is amazing. I get to be at an elevated level every day and it feels so good.
For Molly I assume she will now feel motivated to run when she doesn't want to and it will act similar to caffeine. During shorter races she might be able to focus better but who knows. I would be concerned about taking this before a marathon. I have never run a marathon but I think that these ADHD meds can cause electrolyte imbalances. If I was Molly I would be worried about becoming so dependent on Adderall that I HAD to take it before a marathon and it starts to affect her negatively.
These drugs are a difficult subject because they feel so good but they also feel so bad.
ADHD is often not diagnosed in girls because it manifests differently than in boys. While a boy is more likely to be hyper and disruptive leading to diagnosis, girls are often quiet and dreamy and therefore are seen as not causing a problem. It is very common for women to go well into adulthood without a diagnosis because of this.
ADHD causes problems with executive functioning that often manifest with depression and anxiety. It’s not just hyperactivity, it’s an inability to often do basic life tasks and to suffer extreme anxiety - things like cooking, cleaning the house. Without medication, people become overwhelmed and their life often feels deeply out of control. Before diagnosis many feel deep shame and cannot figure out why they can’t “get it together” to make appointments, be on time, focus on tasks, etc. Running could actually make this worse as often runners use running as a space to block out life problems, and she may be putting so much energy into keeping it together as a runner that she has nothing left over for the rest of her life leading to increasing spiralling and loss of control.
She’s not applying for a TUE because she “wants to do speed,” she needs medication to manage her life and do basic tasks that people normally do without huge stress and disruption. It likely took ages for this to be diagnosed and she probably spent a long time wondering what was wrong with her.
The need for Adderall is either a new development, or she won her Olympic medal on Adderall committing an anti-doping rule violation.
And yes, it is a stimulant containing amphetamines, which is why for example Gatlin was only allowed to use it out-of-competition (but he used it in competition too and got caught and banned).
Or a third explanation is that she was on something else for her ADHD and now has had to change prescriptions or dosage or something per her doctor. Everything is not always black or white.
As you are a coach, I'm not surprised to see this rationale.
However, this is black and white.
Adderall is an amphetamine.
If she needs a new prescription,she should not compete.
And no...i don't support any TUEs for professional sports.
ADHD is often not diagnosed in girls because it manifests differently than in boys. While a boy is more likely to be hyper and disruptive leading to diagnosis, girls are often quiet and dreamy and therefore are seen as not causing a problem. It is very common for women to go well into adulthood without a diagnosis because of this.
ADHD causes problems with executive functioning that often manifest with depression and anxiety. It’s not just hyperactivity, it’s an inability to often do basic life tasks and to suffer extreme anxiety - things like cooking, cleaning the house. Without medication, people become overwhelmed and their life often feels deeply out of control. Before diagnosis many feel deep shame and cannot figure out why they can’t “get it together” to make appointments, be on time, focus on tasks, etc. Running could actually make this worse as often runners use running as a space to block out life problems, and she may be putting so much energy into keeping it together as a runner that she has nothing left over for the rest of her life leading to increasing spiralling and loss of control.
She’s not applying for a TUE because she “wants to do speed,” she needs medication to manage her life and do basic tasks that people normally do without huge stress and disruption. It likely took ages for this to be diagnosed and she probably spent a long time wondering what was wrong with her.
And I wish her well mentally.
but she also should not be able to compete.
if a teacher showed up to work hopped up on adderall, tripped and needed medical care and popped for amphetamines, there is no TUE that would save their job before or after the event.
It's funny that we banned all Russians from sports but then every top American athlete eventually turns out to be on some PEDs.
Molly hasn't competed on PEDs. She has applied for a TRUE so she could use the medication and compete. Contrast that with the Russians who cheat and try to cover it up and, when caught, use an absurd excuse like 'I got it from a glass my grandfather used'.
It's funny that we banned all Russians from sports but then every top American athlete eventually turns out to be on some PEDs.
Molly hasn't competed on PEDs. She has applied for a TRUE so she could use the medication and compete. Contrast that with the Russians who cheat and try to cover it up and, when caught, use an absurd excuse like 'I got it from a glass my grandfather used'.
It's still a PED which should not be tolerated.
I don't take PEDs...my neighbor doesn't take PEDs...why should she be able to...because she is elite and just that?
ADHD is often not diagnosed in girls because it manifests differently than in boys. While a boy is more likely to be hyper and disruptive leading to diagnosis, girls are often quiet and dreamy and therefore are seen as not causing a problem. It is very common for women to go well into adulthood without a diagnosis because of this.
ADHD causes problems with executive functioning that often manifest with depression and anxiety. It’s not just hyperactivity, it’s an inability to often do basic life tasks and to suffer extreme anxiety - things like cooking, cleaning the house. Without medication, people become overwhelmed and their life often feels deeply out of control. Before diagnosis many feel deep shame and cannot figure out why they can’t “get it together” to make appointments, be on time, focus on tasks, etc. Running could actually make this worse as often runners use running as a space to block out life problems, and she may be putting so much energy into keeping it together as a runner that she has nothing left over for the rest of her life leading to increasing spiralling and loss of control.
She’s not applying for a TUE because she “wants to do speed,” she needs medication to manage her life and do basic tasks that people normally do without huge stress and disruption. It likely took ages for this to be diagnosed and she probably spent a long time wondering what was wrong with her.
I was curious if anyone had actually studied the effects of amphetamines on endurance athletes. It seems like the scientific opinion is that amphetamines are indeed PEDs, but most of the studies are on rats. I found a couple of human studies that seem pretty ambivalent, e.g.
I'm curious if anyone has some good studies on this.
I don't know about low-level, routine-dosing rx amphetamines' impact on performance in endurance sports, but I can tell you from personal (and anecdotal) experience during my cycling career that in-competition use is a definite performance enhancer (and makes it super easy to drive a few hours overnight to the next race). Lots of risk (see Tony Simpson heart failure in heat), but they are still routinely used in lower-level cycling races across Europe and the U.S. where there's no drug testing.
Off and on from 2017ish. I would say it is very important to at the very least take weekly breaks. Usually taking the weekend off is a good idea. I try to take Fri-Sun off. Also periodic longer breaks of a month or so is probably a good idea.
I also try to get my run in before taking it because with working from home, its very easy to get in the habit of pushing my run to lunch time because of how much I enjoy running/working out when on adderall. Next thing you know, my lunch break turns into 2 hours because I ran longer than I planned and went to the gym to do some squats and deadlifts when I should probably be doing my job.
For Molly, her only job is running/working out so why wouldnt she take it before running/working out which obviously will make that easier for that. This is why I think she probably shouldnt be allowed to compete but I would also be shocked if this wasnt much more common than we think. To my knowledge, there would be no way of us knowing that she was getting a TUE unless she disclosed it? Or at the very least for what its for? Professional endurance athletes should be looking to do whatever they can within the rules to get an advantage so it would be shocking if there werent a lot of people on adderall but we just dont know about it. I could see a fair amount of endurance athletes being nervous about taking an amphetamine before an intense workout due to the fear of having a heart attack or something but with no real evidence of it increasing the risk of that, it would be shocking if many werent already doing this. So props for Molly for being honest
I just don't buy the whole "oh if you actually have ADHD then it's not performance enhancing" argument. Adderall is an amphetamine. Amphetamines have very distinct and strong effects on humans. Am I really supposed to believe that people with ADHD have distinct enough biology that it somehow negates these effects? To be clear, I'm not saying that the meds can't be therapeutic. I'm just saying that along with those therapeutic effects (better focus, maybe some effect on dopamine), you're also gonna get that general CNS boost that your competitors aren't getting except from caffeine. Take the meds, I truly hope they help, but don't kid yourself about their effects.
I took adderall for years. This is sad to see honestly. It works great until it doesn’t - and then you are in for a world of pain and regret. I wish her well, but I fear she is going through the honeymoon phase right now. Let’s check back in in a year or two. She’ll be wishing she never touched this stuff.
That's why we only take it on race day, genius.
I noticed your screen name. Are you trying to imply Infeld as a TUE for it as well and takes it on race day? Please provide proof.
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