It’s official - Emily Infeld leaves Bowerman

runningchick wrote:

In this case its the athletes who are discrediting the coaches and thus its super valid to speculate what is going on. If many athletes leave due to the coaching then it is not just a one-off situation where it did not work out with an athlete. Its systematic.

What coaching? Jerry coaches by email.

What if any has been Shalane's role with Emily? As a fellow female runner did she help Emily at all where Jerry was not helping? You would hope she saw the disconnect and tried to help.

This isn't complicated. BTC specializes in group training for a very narrow segment of athletes focused mostly on the 1500-5k. Jerry is a good coach, but his system seems to focus on using the group training environment to push athletes out of their comfort zone in hard workouts. This is similar to the transition many runners have felt moving from high school to college. As in college it often produces one of two outcomes: a jump in performance after a period of struggle or injuries. Sometimes, as in the case of Emily Infeld, she saw both. This is a useful concept coming out of college into the pros due to the fact that most college athletes need an environment that will push them to the next level. Older, more established athletes like Infeld or Grace might feel like they have reached the point of their career where they see more value in customizing their workouts to match their strengths and recovery needs as they are well acquainted with crossing the line and doing too much. They are trying to enjoy the last few years of being a professional runner. There is value in being able to trust they can make it through a training cycle and show up healthy and sharp to their races rather than just pushing for that next big break through.

Jerry has a long list of athletes (men and women) he helped break through to the next level. That makes him a good coach and his system a good system. It is not the right system for everyone, and it is the athletes and their agents responsibility for partnering with a coach that will provide the training environment to best reach their goals.

All suspect with burritogate.

Alright, I'll just say what we're all thinking here:

I HATE JERRY SCHUMACHER!!!!

runningchick wrote:

Kinda crazy that a coach at that level does not know how to deal with individual runners and just puts one schedule for all and if you cannot follow that schedule then he doesn't care.

According to the official BTC website, he's "one of the most accomplished distance running coaches in the world. Since becoming a full-time Nike professional coach in 2008 he has assembled a mind-boggling list of achievements"

Also, apparently he's a coach that apparently wasn't educated on the one of the most widely abused PEDs on the planet. Another thing to add to his "mind-boggling list of achievements".

Nothing to see here... wrote:

runningchick wrote:

Kinda crazy that a coach at that level does not know how to deal with individual runners and just puts one schedule for all and if you cannot follow that schedule then he doesn't care.

According to the official BTC website, he's "one of the most accomplished distance running coaches in the world. Since becoming a full-time Nike professional coach in 2008 he has assembled a mind-boggling list of achievements"

https://www.bowermantc.com/coach-jerry-schumacher-bio

Also, apparently he's a coach that apparently wasn't educated on the one of the most widely abused PEDs on the planet. Another thing to add to his "mind-boggling list of achievements".

I find it damning that he can't individualize his training when he's a full time coach. Like you have nothing else to do 24/7 but figure out what's best for your athletes. I think he falls into the trap if running BTC too much like a college team.

The "he didn't know what nandrolone" bit? Meh. How much do clean coaches actually know about banned substances? Like I know for years I was aware of EPO, blood doping, steroids (testosterone), and human growth hormone. Specific substances though? Off the top of my head I could name testosterone and meladonium (cause Sharapova got banned for it). First that nandrolone registered was when Houlihan got banned, and tbh if they hadn't made a huge fuss about the burritos and contamination and all that I probably would have forgotten the substance then too. If you're a coach, you're advising your athletes to take basic supplements (carefully), maybe beta-alanine, and that's it. I'd frankly be more concerned if a coach knew a good amount banned substances.

Kinda like how my cop buddy couldn't tell you the difference between afghan kush and sour diesel, it's all under the general umbrella of "cannabis - that's illegal." Not quite the same, as cops do need to know about certain stuff (eg fentanyl) for their own safety. But you get what I mean.

Infeld said in her announcement post that she will be racing US XC this weekend, but entries just came out and she's not listed. Hopefully not another injury. Does anyone know if that is a complete entry list or more will be added??

fghrunner wrote:

Infeld said in her announcement post that she will be racing US XC this weekend, but entries just came out and she's not listed. Hopefully not another injury. Does anyone know if that is a complete entry list or more will be added??

Maybe she thought her coach entered her? Oops.

No offense, but Emily Infeld is DONE! I have a feeling the aftermath of her competitive career will result in a colossal downfall. She and her parents have pumped every cent of money and every last grain in her hourglass of time to the sport of distance running. It doesn't appear much else is there. I hope I am wrong.

coachy wrote:

fghrunner wrote:

Infeld said in her announcement post that she will be racing US XC this weekend, but entries just came out and she's not listed. Hopefully not another injury. Does anyone know if that is a complete entry list or more will be added??

Maybe she thought her coach entered her? Oops.

Didn't she just get married? New last name?

fghrunner wrote:

Infeld said in her announcement post that she will be racing US XC this weekend, but entries just came out and she's not listed. Hopefully not another injury. Does anyone know if that is a complete entry list or more will be added??

Please post a link to the list.

Emily Infeld is listed in the entries.

https://www.usatf.org/events/2022/2022-usatf-cross-country-championships-presented-b/open-u20-status-of-entries

Yes, a very ordinary coach with extraordinary talent and resources.

I think I might be the only person who's not impressed with either Schumacher or his athletes. He hasn't coached a single global champion and doesn't even have that many global medallists on his record. Maybe he just never gets the true top-tier talents like Brazier or peak-Centro. But with the talent BTC can get and the resources available, you'd expect them to produce more athletes capable of winning global medals. Let's be honest, the only BTC athlete who has a chance of a medal in Eugene this year is Frerichs, and that's been the case for the last few glasses back champs (I'm omitting convicted dopers, obviously).

High hopes wrote:

[quote]

Let's be honest, the only BTC athlete who has a chance of a medal in Eugene this year is Frerichs, and that's been the case for the last few glasses back champs (I'm omitting convicted dopers, obviously).

Imagine medaling in Doha , setting the North American record, then medaling again in Tokyo...

... and still being forgotten about on LR. Poor guy.

but with the talent BTC can get and the resources available, you'd expect them to produce more athletes capable of winning global medals.

You know, I could agree with this point, but just replace "BTC" with "the USA." BTC doesn't have many medal threats in the distance events right now, but outside of the 800m, the whole of the USA basically has Paul Chelimo, Courtney Frerichs, and maybe Emma Coburn if she bounces back. Hocker could turn into something, Fisher is young, and his 6th place showed promise, but the cupboard is pretty bare on the track. Given the massive talent base and the best resources in the world, you would indeed expect to produce more athletes capable of winning global medals.

In the last decade, Americans athletes in the 1500 and up in world/Olympic competition have taken:

Women's 1500m:

4/24 possible medals - all Jenny Simpson

Women's 5000m:

0/24

Women's 10000m:

1/24 medals - Emily Infeld (BTC)

Women's Steeplechase:

5/24 - 3 x Emma Coburn, 2 x Courtney Frerichs (BTC)

Women's Total: 10/96 medals - BTC 3/10 US medals.

Men's 1500m:

4/24 - Centrowitz x 3, Manzano x1

Men's 5000m:

3/24 - Chelimo x2, Lagat x1

Men's 10000m:

1/24 - Rupp x1

Men's Steeplechase:

2/24 - Jager x2 (BTC)

Men's Total: 10/96 medals - BTC 2/10 US medals.

Total - 20/192 medals, BTC 5/20. So more medal winning Americans than any other club in the last decade. If I remember right, 10/24 spots on the Tokyo team men/women 1500-10000 were taken by BTC athletes.

To balance the fact that I just spent way too long unfortunately simping for BTC, I'll throw in my hot take that I wouldn't be surprised if it didn't exist or if Schumacher wasn't coaching it come the Paris Olympics.

That's a fair point, I hadn't really thought about how empty the distance talent bank is in the US right now. Not counting the steeple because, well, it's the steeple and no one really cares about it, I don't think the US will win a single medal between the 1500 and 10,000 in Eugene on either men's or women's side. Hocker may have a chance if he can close the gap to Kerr but even then, he'd be one of a few in a shootout for bronze. You'd think someone at USATF would be looking at this to try and identify where the development pathway is going wrong - is it the NCAA? Or pro level? IN any case, with basically the pick of US distance talent, BTC has delivered 5 US medals, 4 of which are in the steeple, so only one medal in an event that anyone cares about.

And yeah, apologies to Moh Ahmed, I was thinking mainly about US athletes.

She said in the Citius Mag article she's working with a new coach. This thread has had Smith and Brosnan predictions, one of which seems more likely than the other to me. Anyone with thoughts on a new coach? Who would work for Infeld in terms of staying healthy at this point?

One could add that, if I haven't overlooked anything, since 2009 no single medal in the men's 5000/10000m went to a man not of East African descent and only two bronze medals were won by European/US heritage women (Infeld 2015 and Klosterhalfen 2019). It's obviously more open in the 1500m and 3000 steeple, so it's not surprising that BTC got most in the steeple as well.

bruce denton's gold medal wrote:

She said in the Citius Mag article she's working with a new coach. This thread has had Smith and Brosnan predictions, one of which seems more likely than the other to me. Anyone with thoughts on a new coach? Who would work for Infeld in terms of staying healthy at this point?

A professional at Infeld’s level choosing a coach who’s best female runner by leaps and bounds has run 16:43 for 5k and who’s best male runner has run 13:50 is completely absurd. I don’t care what Brosnan’s high school coaching accolades are for the 5 years of his coaching experience. There are a dozen US coaches with far more experience coaching world class athletes to consider. People claiming he’s somehow one of the top coaches in the country are out of their minds. Smith makes much more sense, but the list of possible coaches does not include Brosnan.