either way, 1k's are very good, but you need the tempos, in fact, every week you should have a tempo of 12-40 minutes or longer intervals-1M and up--as well as 400-2k track stuff. I'd really urge you to get off the pavement as much as possible, even if it is inconvenient. I'd take 2-3 hrs a day for my runs in NYC because of the time taking the subway t/f Queens to Central Park to use the trails, but it was well worth it in health.
Todd, I agree with Jonesy on all points. My 5k times dropping is to me proof that the 20 minute tempos are working. I've been running all my tempos on the track. According to Daniel's, after warm-up the idea is to maintain an even pace at threshold level for the entire duration. Check out this site to figure your level of fitness and the recommended threshold per mile pace.
http://www.runbayou.com/jackd.htm
Running on the track really helps in this. I'm still averaging around 50mpw right now on mostly singles. It's been enough for me given my level of fitness. I hope to top out around 60+. I don't plan on running any race distances of more than 10k. I built my base for around 5-6 months before ever doing one interval, rep, or threshold run. Jonesy encouraged me to get with the track work at that time and it really was the right move. Also, I had to get off the pavement too. After 1 hour, my feet and knees were aching. I still run on the pavement during my night runs but not as much. Putting my feet in ICE water after a run has helped a lot too.
and ron, by next spring, you're going to be holding that 5:46 pace for 10k and running 5k at 5:30 or better.
Jonesy, thanks for the faith. I hope so... In addition, come next spring, I'd like to be knocking on sub-4 1500m. As I recall, when you get to a certain level of fitness, most of this stuff is all mental. I know I've got the legs, so it'll boil down to how much discomfort I can stand.
I'm looking to do a lot of 5k+ racing in the next couple of months. I'm confident this is going to help my 1500m ability.
Sometimes we are in need of a quick pick-me-up.
Idea today was to run a 3-4 mile tempo on the track in 1:42/1:43 per lap, building off a great run I did about 5 weeks ago, a 3 miler with 1:44/1:45's lap after lap. 20:54 it ended up as.
Lunch suddenly decides to not sit well about 5 hours after I eat it, and thus my workout is made up off the top of my frustrated head and upset stomach:
2 miles, first lap is 1:54 and I know everything is shot. 7:19 and 6:52 for a totally worthless 14:11.
1200 that would have been a mile but my stomach wouldn't hold up. 4:55. Another 1200 in 4:46. 800 in 3:04 (1:32s), and a 400 in 1:27.
Couple of observations/questions: As this is my second week going for 40mpw, I was quite worried that this workout was an injury maker, but I took about 4-5 minutes break between everything so I hope that I didn't over do it. The 800 and 400 felt like a pace I could handle, just took my legs a while to get going. Thus the second point, I think I need a bit more of this stuff, I don't know if I've tested myself enough at my goal paces. This 3-4 miler might not have to be at anything more than 20:54 if I do it every 2-3 weeks since I don't hit that pace on any of my other runs. Just felt super fast today. Going to take it easy on my runs the rest of the week and hope for better.
Thanks for letting me vent.
How old are you Eddy? first time i've read this thread.
2:00min 8:00 usually means 4:02 if aerobically fit or up to 4:08.
two peaking workouts i recommend...
i used them to run a sub 4 mile, so the times i prescribe for you may not be that accurate.
i recommend 3*800m with 5 mins recovery.
sub 2:10's should get you to sub 4
or try
600 30second rest 600
two sub 1:38's i think you can do it.
Cool... the eddylee thread is back up! How\'s everyone progressing? Eddylee, do you have any races coming up this weekend?
I\'ll be doing a 5k Sept 1st. Workouts have been going really well. No injuries. Hope everybody enjoyed the Olympics, particularly the 1500, 5000, and 10k.
Let\'s hear the good word.
worst
thread
ever
you prefer the self-massage thread, right?
but hard to top the "william defoe" thread.
8/11/2008 M 10.2 1:13:24
easy morning 10 by the lake. creaky at the beginning. (10:40-1.1,7:43,7:07,6:51,6:21,6:39,6:29,6:15,6:13, 9:05-1.1). Middle 8M in 53:38 (6:43/M) (last 5 of that in 31:57).
Tu 10.6
a.m. 2M quick w/stroller (wore old shoes--weakened achilles). p.m. 8.6M-1:12:40-3x200 (100j=60s)-36,36,34; 8x300@3k pace(200j=90s (80/72 before last two))-53,53,53,53,51,51,52,52. form drills on c/d.
W 10.4 1:28:53
slow morning recovery, mostly low 8's. achilles still weak from using old shoes yesterday. iced.
Th 10.8
a.m. 5.9M w/stroller-64 min.; p.m. 4.9M-40+ min. w/slow strides. achilles weak.
Fr 0
Off. travel. rest day.
Sa 14
5M-27:04-29 sec pr-70th. 5:27,5:21,5:29,5:42,5:05. cramps, achilles too weak for flats. p.m. 4.5M W.26th-108th. 7ish pace.
Su 24 3:06:00
3xBPN (18:48,18:43,19:12),Inwood to 108th (x'd WS Hwy!)
Totals 80
big pr at 5M. great last mile, but didn't quite have enough in miles three and four to break 27. good to get in a 24 miler.
last week:
M 0
Off. incipient severe thunderstorm as good a reason as any to take the day off in a planned low mileage week, after 24 Sunday.
Tu 12.4 1:33:45
easy miles along Lake Champlain. sore, needed reco. run. (10:14-1.1,7:52,7:49 (+1:50-.2),7:24,7:06,6:58,7:14,7:01,7:10,7:06,7:03,8:52-1.1 up). middle 10.2 in 74:37.
W 8.4 1:16:55
super slo-mo a.m. reco, w/10xstrides ahead of tomorrow night's 10k. lots of achilles exercises.
Th 8
10k-34:19-9th. 60 sec pr (89 sec road pr). ran this race in 2005 in 41:08! 5:15,10:45,16:25,28:45-5.2M (17:05/17:12). 1st mile was too fast and struggled after. cramps, blisters.
F 13 1:46:53
mostly 8's. lessons from race: mod. 1st mile, ditch cotton socks, eat pre-race bar slowly.
Sa 13.2
4.8M w/u (forest trails), 3x200(100r)-41,38,35;2x600(200r)-mid-1:50s,1:54;2x1200(400r)-3:58,3:52; 2x600(200r)-1:53,1:53. 4.4M c/d (woods). watch malfunctioning.
Su 20.4 2:40:00
Burlington, VT-t/f 3.5M mark on Colchester Cut solo. watch busted-clock-timed. tough headwind on return on the spit. some good miles.
75.4 miles.
huge 10k pr, long overdue. screwed up prep and went out too fast to get the sub-34 goal. moving back up to 100 this week and had a good 5x1k workout avg. 3:09-10 with 400 rest. another 5M coming up in 10 days, then hopefully fifth avenue mile and a half marathon in October, before NYC marathon.
Too lazy to go through thread.
Have you broken 4 yet?
Hey Jonesy... great job on the 5mile and 10k PRs. Almost busted 27 in the 5M... that's great! Hopefully your next 5M in 10days you'll go below 27.
A few progress reports...
Ran a solo 1600m tt on Mon -> - 5:01.51 1600m tt - Splits - 74.98, 76.13, 76.29, 74.11 This was after running 25 miles prev sat/sun. The tt felt really good. Had power to maintain pace. I could tell the 5k's and all the aerobic training is paying off as evidenced by last lap being the fastest. This is a around equivalent of 4:40 1500m.
Last night did solo 5K tempo on the track. 18:39.13 – (6:09.56, 5:55.36, 5:51.36)
Anyway... getting faster... slow and sure! The main thing is no injuries!
no. would love to get in a late track meet. bhs gave zero response to my request to hold a small meet there.
ron, very nice job in the tt's. in a race, you're looking at low 4:50s mile now. excellent progress. and 6's for 5k solo is big improvement as well.
Latest Wild-man report->
Raced a 5K this morning and took another whack at my 5K comeback PR. Managed a 17:18.70 averaging 5:36/mile. Which knocked off 37 seconds. Legs felt real good as course was flat. Temp was nice but humidity was high. Real happy with results and hope to get into the 16's soon. Staying locked on the 1500m and feel confident these 5ks are helping in building strength and aerobic capacity for when the mad speed work starts.
Thread has been real quiet. How's everybody doing? Hope all is well and you're all meeting your goals!
dude, you are dropping time like crazy. outstanding job! looks like those time trials are working.
M 15.2
a.m. 4.8M-~40 min. reco w/strides and drills.
p.m. 10.4M-~1:13:35 (added 2 min--got watch 4 bks in). 9:42-~1.1M dn,7:30,7:08,7:04,6:30,6:37,6:34,6:16,6:06,8:08-1.1 up. middle 8-53:45. felt decent.
T 16
4 p.m.--5.5M w/stroller easy.
7:30 p.m.--10.5M-solo, t/f BHS track (24:20/29:18)-3x200 (100j)-38,37,36; 5x1k (400j)-3:09,3:11,3:11,3:10.0,3:08.4. cold lake swim on return, but great temps for running
W 15.9
a.m. 5.5M w/stroller-1 hr. reco;
p.m. 10.4M-1:24:57-(12:01 for 1.3, 8:40,8:12,8:16,7:31,7:27,7:35,7:09,7:49,10:24-1.1). not much in the tank.
Th 14
a.m. 5.5M w/stroller-1 hr. dehydration headache; p.m. 8.5M-w/2k-7:25 (last mile-5:49)-sluggish; 3x600m hills, 3x400m hills.
Fr 12.6 1:48:01
evening run mostly at 8ish pace. legs were dead, from re-adjusting to high mileage and from quad-strengthening exercises.
Sa 12.4 1:41:26
morning. really slow start, then mostly 8s and high 7s, except last few miles-7:14,6:58,6:41,6:19. hard strides last mile and a half.
Su 20.6 2:37:38
(1:27:19 (10.4)/1:10:19 (10.2)). beautiful morning. 6:53 avg on return.
Totals 106.7
struggled a bit with increased mileage but had an excellent 1k workout and half of a good long run. will probably cut the mileage again this week for a 5M race and then do 5-6 weeks of 100 mpw before the marathon.
Hey Jonesy, another very impressive week! Especially the 5x1000m interval workout. I'm trying to maintain 3:26 pace and I can barely hold 3:35 with the same 400m jog in between. You're really busting it. Interestingly, your time ranges correspond with workouts designated for somebody who has a level of fitness around 4:15 for the 1500m. Keep it up as you should go sub 4:10 really soon.
Good luck in your 5mile race coming up. I'll be racing a 6k cross country race this coming Sat. This will be interesting.
All I can figure on why I dropped 37 secs from my 5k best is that I hung with the leaders believing I could. They eventually pulled away but I stayed locked on them for a long time. My goal was to run mid-to-high 17. Needless to say, I was surprised. The winning time was 16:12. I came in 6th. Another point was the 2nd place finisher ran 16:19 and was 37 yrs old.
Approx 57 mile week.
Why don't you all just get it over with and meet up in the woods and suck each other's pencil dicks!
it's a training/racing thread on a running website, dumbass. so go f yourself.
jonesy, wow. just wow.
Everyone else, awesome stuff. I completed my third 40 mile week (it was 36 miles but the same minutes spent running as my last 40 mile week).
Bought and read, cover to cover, Daniels Running Formula and it's time to get some periodization in my life.
Question: 1500/3200 plan or the 5K/10K? Daniels says the 1500 plan can be better for newer runners. But I thought maybe do the 5k/10k and see if I can run a respectable half.
40 this week, 45 if the soreness lessens (5.4 and 6.2 thus far). Haven't gotten those softer surfaces as recommended. The trails by my house are unkept and you can't really maintain any sort of stride and it sucks when the ball of your foot lands on a rock.