On December 14 Sage Canaday raced and won a 10k in 32:36. Can he run a 2:19 marathon in Houston?

Haha totally agree!

NERunner053 wrote:

Bad Wigins wrote:

If the US can't form a good field without relaxing entry standards to well slower than the women's world record, then it's time to retire the trials and hand-pick the entrants. Obviously there are not enough good US marathoners for a trials race.

Yep line up 10 people & line them up to run a marathon around a track. That'll help grow the sport.

You miss the point completely. If all you've got is ten people (has the US even got that many with the REAL standard?) then you only make your chances worse by pitting them against each other at the full marathon distance. Find another way to pick the best one and keep them fresh for the real event.

Nobody cares which post-collegian can run a 2:19, or even a 2:15. Nobody. At. All. It is not elite-level sport and the US makes itself look stupid by pretending it is.

Sage is probably the only person through a sample size of just one could settle the debate of whether the vaporfly actually is any advantage. Sage get hoka to let you run in the next% just this once.

Bad Wigins wrote:

Nobody cares which post-collegian can run a 2:19, or even a 2:15. Nobody. At. All. It is not elite-level sport and the US makes itself look stupid by pretending it is.

Even if nobody cares who can or can't run a 2:19 (evidently false based on all the Sage Canaday threads), they aren't hurting anyone running in the trials race.

YMMV wrote:

I ate no meat for 14 years and it only ended my running career at 22 (restarted successfully once I became omnivore again) and landed me in the hospital a couple of times in my late 20s. I consider Sage's longevity as a vegan runner as actually quite remarkable (assuming he hasn't "cheated" the diet), despite his overall lack of improvement since college.

That's one big assumption. Just look how he cheated his green lifestyle. His carbon footprint is larger than that of some African countries.

Isn't it pathetic that a professional runner can't OTQ these days? Literally everyone qualifies these days. I know of moms who started a running a year ago, are doing 30 mpw and they qualified.

You just put on the Vaporflies, run a skislope course like CIM and chances are really high that you qualify.

freeoj wrote:

Isn't it pathetic that a professional runner can't OTQ these days? Literally everyone qualifies these days. I know of moms who started a running a year ago, are doing 30 mpw and they qualified.

That comparison is not fair at all. The OTQ for women is much slower and much easier. Everyone should be respected and encouraged for putting in their hard efforts in order to run their best but it is not right to tear down others who have a much higher standard to reach in order to qualify for something.

Did sage run CIM? It would've been his best chance to qualify.

Bad Wigins wrote:

NERunner053 wrote:

Yep line up 10 people & line them up to run a marathon around a track. That'll help grow the sport.

You miss the point completely. If all you've got is ten people (has the US even got that many with the REAL standard?) then you only make your chances worse by pitting them against each other at the full marathon distance. Find another way to pick the best one and keep them fresh for the real event.

Nobody cares which post-collegian can run a 2:19, or even a 2:15. Nobody. At. All. It is not elite-level sport and the US makes itself look stupid by pretending it is.

This is, sadly, spot on.

why would we do that wrote:

semi_pro wrote:

At least be kindly critical if you really have to point out someone else's problems. .

OK, I'll be kindly critical: Sage, I think you should try eating meat. Please.

Is that kind enough?

Aww. See? Isn't that beautiful? I knew that LRC could be a positive and affirming community!

why would we do that wrote:

semi_pro wrote:

Shouldn't runners be supporting the dreams of other runners, not tearing them down for having a bad day?

??? Why is it my job to support the dreams of other runners? My job is to support myself and to reach my own goals. We rag on Sage because he puts himself out there and profits from it. It is part of his job. With the exposure (and perks) come the criticism. It's completely fair.

Let's not pretend that this place has the ratio down for encouraging people and critiquing people. Sage's ratio is way off on this website. People love to hate. There's nothing friendly/warm/encouraging about what LRC does to him. Yeah, it's his job. But it's not our job to just sit behind a keyboard and criticize. Sage works hard and is open about training, does a lot of videos to try to help other runners.

For what it's worth, he called it a tempo run at about marathon pace. It doesn't look like he went too hard and couldn't hold the pace. His heart rate data, in the 160s, looks right for his age & marathon pace.

NERunner053 wrote:

Let's not pretend that this place has the ratio down for encouraging people and critiquing people. Sage's ratio is way off on this website. People love to hate. There's nothing friendly/warm/encouraging about what LRC does to him. Yeah, it's his job. But it's not our job to just sit behind a keyboard and criticize. Sage works hard and is open about training, does a lot of videos to try to help other runners.

No, Sage does a lot of videos to make money. His endless videos about his struggles as a professional runner to break 2:19 are just generating content to get hits and ad revenue. He’s no different than Ragen Chastain and her running videos. Same motivation, different target audience, both unable to achieve stated goal.

Yea i think he did ok too. I hope he doesn't reduce his mileage or waste time going for a blood test.

Training talk: What should he be doing?

He shouldn't be doing any more hard stuff now that he's 5 weeks out right? He should be letting his legs recover. Things like hills, sprints, strength traing, and long intervals above race pace. The hay is already in the barn for things like that. Time to recover.

Should he be focusing on:

-easy miles, keeping that easy volume up. Is he the type to lose fitness quick if he tapers too early?

-Daniel's style economy reps with 3+ mins rest.

-strides.

-1 milers @ goal pace here and there in long runs and after a tempo.

-Also he should definitely eat more grains and tubers. I'm talking mash and rice son. ?

He should give up the beer habit until after the race.

Far fig nootin wrote:

He should give up the beer habit until after the race.

But beer can't possible do any harm to his body or the environment since it is VEGAN!!!

Isn't lining up about a dozen people exactly what the japanese did for their woman's trial? Seemed to work fine. I also doubt many people stay in the sport for the trials. It might be a goal but all the 2:19 type guys I knew keep on running as they slowed to 2:30 guys as they aged. They ran because they like to run not because of some race goal.

At any type of race effort, this is horrible result. You need to be having a really bad day not to be able to run 10k at marathon pace. Only he knows exactly how he felt effort wise.

I am coaching Sage to a 2:40 guys. Check out his 20x400. In no time Sage will be running 3 hours. It's all magic!!

You gotta respect this guy. Sage beated Anton Krupicka at Speedgoat 50k.

I have a lot of respect for Sage - he's figured out a way to make a living doing something he loves to do, has been successful in many of his running endeavors, and seems like a decent guy. The fact that he still keeps coming back here to have constructive conversations here despite all of the vitriol he receives from anonymous trolls speaks a lot to the quality of his character.

I'm hesitant to offer any opinions on what he could do differently, seeing as how he's much more experienced than I am, but I do wonder if his recent struggles could be overcome with some experienced outside counsel. By that, I mean professional-level coaching. Specifically, I wonder how he could do if he joined an elite level group like Northern Arizona Elite. It's a strength based program, he'd have other athletes to train with, he's already used to altitude, and they're sponsored by Hoka. Joe Gray has had excellent results training with Scott Simmons and the ADP - they've clearly figured out a way to combine more 'traditional' training with some tweaks for mountain running. I'm sure Ben Rosario and Sage could figure out how Sage could do most of the same training as NAZ but with some tweaks of their own for when Sage is focusing on longer mountain races.

Yea that would be dope. Then he wouldnt have to struggle to safely do speed sessions half the year. Its awesome hes so quick training mostly alone and at that size.

With my last post im hoping that he will shed some light on what his plans are for Q and L days over the next 5wks. Training talk is fun if you learn.