Why is Mo Farah lying so much about Jama Aden??

Tired of losing, no Mo wrote:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MTaMdJVFdhw

I savored this race fully. Kipchoge outracing Farah over 2 miles indoor 2012. The Kipchoge, feeling his age and the kick of youngsters, moved up to the half and marathon. The older Farah has kept himself on the track, a 33 year old who can now outkick anyone, especially the young bucks.

Good link, hadn't seen this one before. Not saying whether I know Kipchoge is clean or not but it's good fun seeing Mo getting smacked. The Yorkshireman commentating is more irritating then a bee sting, I've heard him before, he's always "go Mo" or "come on Mo" and I always thought "what about the others in the race?"

slicerdicer wrote:

Chris Froome?

Bingo!!

Rematched the ESPN 30/30 Marion Jones segment from Filmed by John Singleton. Watching the footage of her confession on the courthouse steps and hearing all her apologetics, guilt and remorse (a byproduct of getting caught), I thought about Mo and the lying he's done regarding Aden. Jones talks about how she just dug in deep with the lies, fighting and campaigning against the accusations. Instant parallels with Lance Armstrong's journey of denial, lawsuits, and eventual confession and utter demise.

Mo has given testimony to both Bristish and American authorities. All of this is still relatively fresh and investigations are ongoing. The Salazar allegations came first and then the Aden allegations are the newest dark cloud over Farah's today (and tomorrow). If this comes out in a similar way, Farah will crush GBR.

larkimm wrote:

Why so much ire about a guy who hasn't won world or olympic championship races in either championship record times or with margins greater than 1.0s (apart from 2015 10000m) and who most posters on here deny can be considered great because he can't run the great times of KB or HG?

(KB's average winning margin was 2.4s in the 5000m and 2.6s in the 10000m demonstrating clearly more dominance)

Objectively, lots consider him to be an also-ran in the pantheon of great 5000m and 10000m runners. So why do you yanks get so worked up about him? It's not as if he's beating any of your guys anyway, by LR logic he's just beating doped up Ethiopian and Kenyans who are lying about their ages and who aren't really that great anyway as the really good runners run city marathons.

I see where you are going with this, but you are wrong:

27:05.17 - Farah - winning a couple weeks ago

27:05.10 - Bekele - Olympic Record 2008

13:03.30 - Farah - winning a week ago

12:57.82 - Bekele - Olympic Record 2008

Are these times that different than the all-time best that have been achieved over the last 120 yrs of the Olympics? How fast would he have to run in the championships for his lying and suspected doping to matter? Would it be 26:50 / 12:55? 26:30 / 12:45?

What difference does it make how relatively fast he is compared to the Champions of the last 50 years? Or whether he is beating "our guys"?

If he is lying about a high-profile coach who has now been caught for doping (which is all the OP was talking about) then that is strange and reflects badly on him.

And the reason ANYBODY "gets so worked up" over him is that he has won the 10k in the 2011 Daegu WC, the 5k/10k in London 2012, the 5k/10k in Moscow 2013, the 5k/10k in Beijing 2015, and the 5k/10k in Rio 2016. We are all distance running fans, and those are NINE of the most important distance contests on the planet over the last 5 years ... and we only have this planet to be fans on.

doot doot wrote:

Tactical Chunder wrote:

Mo Farah = greatest long distance track racer ever.

4 Golds.

Does anyone know of any athletes with a similar performance trajectory to that of Farah?

Where they were ok-ish, but then had a literally unprecedent, meteoric rise to dominance (or even just huge PR gains at the elite level) in their very late 20s?

Has anyone similarly seen such great improvement that late?

Obviously Allah broke the mold with Farah, but I'm curious about similar "talents." 😂

If his "meteoric rise to dominance" was "unprecedented", how could "anyone know of any athletes with a similar performance trajectory to that of Farah?"

Do you know what "unprecedented" means?

Dude! Way off task:

-the truth isn't ad hominem, Mo went from a national level runner to truely invincible in two years in his late twenties, he trains with people who are dodgy and when they're caught, he denies ever knowing them.

-Don't think Mo watches Fox News.

-Don't think Mo is a fan of Donald Trump.

-Murdoch just sacked Ailes.

-Ivanka???

-Murdoch has been married so many times, he has more in-laws than even he realizes.

-I cringe when I see the meaningless word neoliberal used, the only deductible insight from its use is the person using it is a Marxist.

-Profits aren't a crime, but the physical hurting of people is, commerce is good but corruption isn't.

Funnily enough, I actually agree with you on the Nike money part. Over the last 30 years or so Nike drug money has made sprint events etc utterly filfhy.

False little suzy wrote:

doot doot wrote:

If I'm not mistaken all of the greats set their PRs and WRs late in their 20s or early 30s.....

.......

Oh you're mistaken. We're talking about Track here, not marathons. Farah is a 33 year old world beater in a young man's arena. This was shown in another thread using American-born runners and top 5000m times. Sticking with this distance, here are "the greats" PRs you speak of...top ten fastest men over 5000m to date and the age they set their fastest times:

Bekele 22

Gebresallasie 25

Komen 21

Kipchoge 20

Gebremeskel 23

Sihine 21

Gebrhiwet 18

Koech 19

Songok 22

Alamirew 22

Cherono 21

Oh yes, Mo Farah @ 28 years, 3 months, and 29 days old ran his fastest 5000m.

If there is a sweet spot or golden zone, its early to mid 20s.

Whilst I agree with you, the Robertson brothers (yes I know) claim that most of the top Kenyans are lying about their ages, and that they are really about 3-7 years older then what they have listed. This will be the next big issue to be exposed mark my words. Dodgy agents are incentivized to cheat, if you can win a world Junior medal (as a 21-22 year old) the next session you get starts in the big races.

Oddities wrote:

Paula Radcliffe

Regina Jacobs

Dieter Baumann. 5000 m PRs:

- age 27: 13:09

- age 30: 13:01

- age 32: 12:54

Quite an illustrious group there. Of course all clean as a whistle; nothing to see here.

The Overexplainer wrote:

Do you know what "unprecedented" means?

As applied to the Mobot unprecedented means learning the grey-zone methods from Salazar, with further special supplement training from Aden. Only Mo has had special access to both.

tony the tiger wrote:

Mo Farah is the best long distance athlete that ever lived

Hey Mr. tiger.

Are you sure about that?

Ms. Paula Radcliffe's 2:15:25 is equivalent (Purdy tables) to a 4:00 mile, 8:00 3K, 13:53 5K, and 29:03 10K. Paula is way beyond Almaz Ayana, Wang Junxia, and the Dibabas. Paula is the best long distance athlete that has ever lived on this planet.

From wiki:

She has previously asked for the results of a blood test taken at the London Marathon to be made public, saying that she had "absolutely no objection to my test being released".[115]

In 2015, in the wake of revelations of widespread doping in athletics,[116] Radcliffe said that, unlike some other prominent British athletes, she would not be releasing her blood-test history, and discouraged other athletes from doing so.[117] She was later indirectly identified as a suspected doper by MP Jesse Norman during a parliamentary inquiry into blood doping.[118][119] In response, Radcliffe issued a statement in which she "categorically denied" cheating in any form and said she has "nothing to hide".[120] Shortly afterwards, her three suspect test results were leaked, though Radcliffe still refused to release her complete blood-test history.[121] In late November 2015, the IAAF declared that the accusation were "based on the gross misinterpretation of incomplete data". The UK Anti Doping Agency, having received Radcliffe's blood test history via the IAAF, stated that "Ukad has come to the same conclusion as the IAAF review that there is no case to answer".

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

(Ross Tucker has Paula as a 7 on his "suspicious" scale.)

Here is the information I used to come to a conclusion on Ms. Radcliffe:

On Oct. 2, 2003…two days before the World Championship Half-Marathon that she won…Paula had a blood test result which had a hemoglobin value of 12.8 g/dL, and a reticulocyte score of 0.59% (of RBCS), which make up an OFF score of 82 pre-race.

On Oct. 4, 2003…Paula had a blood test result which had a hemoglobin value of 15.6 g/dL, and a reticulocyte score of 0.47% (of RBCs), which make up an OFF score of 114.87 post-race.

That is a 21.88% increase in hemoglobin value in 2 days, from 12.8 g/dL to 15.6 g/dL.

To get a rough estimate of hematocrit score (which many people are more familiar with), the hemoglobin score can be multiplied by 3, so the 12.8 Hb would be roughly equivalent to a hematocrit value of 38.4%. A 21.88% increase in hematocrit value in 2 days, from 38.4% to 46.8% is a very large magnitude increase... in a very short amount of time.

Even severe dehydration, which causes a loss of plasma volume, and elevates Hb values, does not increase hemoglobin values more than 15%…even in extreme dehydration after running for 2.5 to 3 hours and losing 4% of bodyweight. Paula ran for 1 hour 7 minutes and also won the race.

Altitude training can increase Hb values by 5 to 10%…and takes 3 weeks to work. All types of EPO take weeks to work. Cobalt chloride takes weeks to work. Inhalation of xenon or krypton gas to increase erythropoiesis also takes weeks to work. Hypoxia-inducible factor (HIF) stabilizers such as FG-4592 also take weeks to work. No other drug or substance that I know of can work in 2 days to increase hemoglobin values by that much.

The only way I know of that can increase hemoglobin values by 21.88% in 2 days is:

1) An autologous blood transfusion by Ms. Paula Radcliffe.

(The reticulocyte score also shows a 20% decrease (from 0.59% of RBCs to 0.47% of RBCs), which is also consistent with a blood transfusion, since the reticulocytes are diluted by the infusion of the old stored blood.)

My conclusion is:

Ms. Paula Radcliffe is a Brit Doper-Cheater-Liarâ„¢. Paula is a 700.

For some more reading on the mechanism of action:

Paula is OFF the charts in every way!!!

Paula has a TIGER in her tank!!!

Go Paula!!!

Go Brits!!!

casual obsever wrote:

Oddities wrote:

Paula Radcliffe

Regina Jacobs

Dieter Baumann. 5000 m PRs:

- age 27: 13:09

- age 30: 13:01

- age 32: 12:54

Quite an illustrious group there. Of course all clean as a whistle; nothing to see here.

Well done. Doesn't add up.

Do you like to read?

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3874847/

Have a nice day Mr. tiger.

What does the article conclude? I was too lazy to press the arrow key 142 times to get to the conclusion. Thanks for posting the hgb/retic count % on Radcliffe, btw. I have never seen that; and as a medical professional, those statistics speak volumes. Is there a similar breakdown for other suspicious athletes?

The thing about people like Mo, Paula, Lance, Marion that always amazes me are the implausible excuses that come one after another and the many people that defend them.

The IAAF has not changed.. the IOC is still okay with widespread corruption.

It's the same pattern. Lance, Marion, Paula, and now Mo.

The facts already overwhelm his excuses. He puts on a great show, so the iAAF are behind him 100%.

Same pattern..

tony the tiger wrote:

Mo Farah is the best long distance athlete that ever lived

No, tiger, regardless how often you triumphantly claim this, it's not getting true because of that. And it's not debatable at all. And this was discussed so often on this board, that it's getting boring to list all the points again.

But in short for you: Gebrselassie and Bekele are clearly Nr. 1 and 2. They have much better PBs than Farah, and also many successes other than 5k/10k at the yearly highlight.

Advantage from Gebrselassie:

1 Mile: 4s

2000m: 14s

3000m: 7 1/2s

2 Miles: 2+s

5000m: 14s

10000m: 23s

HM: 1/2+min

Mar: 4 1/2min

Farah has this big advantage in the 1500m.

Gebrselassie's success at the highest level was stretched over a period of almost 2 decades. Only a fool would vote for Farah while regarding all facts, and it's not even close. Farah's two strong points - great 1500m time and constantly successfull doubling late in his track career - never ever can close the gap to Gebrselassie which came from ALL OTHER considerable points.

Same while comparing to Bekele. 1 more outdoor gold - but not a single word to Bekele's 11 XC gold medals? His records? His indoor success? Just laughable.

Farah's championship record from the last 6 years is very impressiv, no doubt. But overall it's not even debatabel. And now go on and write triumphantly when ever there is a chance your bullshit. Neglecting the facts, like a child.

well yea farah's a massive fraud, pretty obvious. lol ppl that think he's clean probly also think hillary's innocent and the poor victim of a "witch hunt" lol

well duhh wrote:

well yea farah's a massive fraud, pretty obvious. lol ppl that think he's clean probly also think hillary's innocent and the poor victim of a "witch hunt" lol

For sure, the chance that Farah is clean is - well - more on the low side... but that's not the point here.

I like Farah, but I admit that he and many athletes may be, at the very least, operating in the grey zone.

well duhh wrote:

well yea farah's a massive fraud, pretty obvious. lol ppl that think he's clean probly also think hillary's innocent and the poor victim of a "witch hunt" lol

This is correct, but theoretically Mo's mile equivalent or 2000m should be quicker the Geb's based on his 1500m pb but at every other distance Geb is better.

Let's put his 3:28 pb into context, that is quicker that Centro, Willis, Coe, Ovett, Cram all Olympic medalists over 1500m in modern times and countless Kenyans. An unreal time for an event he doesn't train for and has rarely run.