The Ultimate Hypothetical 800m Race

safa ran those times all after the track was relayed in ~'04 ( i know a guy who went to check the dimensions of the new track )

besides, we've not had any blistering 800s & above on that track since then

last "great" runs on the track

- 1:42.32 Wilson Kipketer DEN 12.12.70 1 Rieti 08.09.2002

- 3:26.96 Hicham El Guerrouj MAR 14.09.74 1 Rieti 08.09.2002

- 3:29.30 Bernard Lagat USA 12.12.74 1 Rieti 28.08.2005

- 3:47.85 Daniel Komen KEN 17.05.76 1 Rieti 03.09.1997

- 7:28.72 Issac Songok KEN 25.04.84 1 Rieti 27.08.2006

- 1:56.29 Janet Jepkosgei Busienei KEN 13.02.83 1rA Rieti 09.09.2007

- 3:56.18 Maryam Yusuf Jamal BRN 16.09.84 1 Rieti 27.08.2006

- 4:18.23 Gelete Burka ETH 15.02.86 1 Rieti 07.09.2008

- 8:30.25 Vivian Cheruiyot KEN 11.09.83 1 Rieti 09.09.2007

- 14:23.46 Tirunesh Dibaba ETH 01.06.85 1 Rieti 07.09.2008

best calibre run there in past nearly 7y is a fairly derisory 3'29.3 by bernie

hardly the stat to be associated with "fastest distance track in the world" !

'i still don't know where he found the "strength" to go from a 1'44-flat weakling in '78 to a 1'42.4 guy the next year ???'

===========================

Get your facts straight:

1976 1977 1978 1979 1980 1981

1:47.7 1:44.95 1:43.97 1:42.33 1:44.7 1:41.73

He was only 21 when he ran the 1:43.97 which at that time was only 0.47 behind the world record. You would expect a runner of that age to progress in terms of time over the next few years.

You're wasting your breath, this guy is far too stupid to listen to anything. I mean come on, he insists on writing "wabbit" over and over and over again. Too bad he had to ruin this thread, it was really funny before he got here.

Coe was a weakling in '78 and was also suffering from food poisoning in Prague. His weight was about 112 pounds there.

Is it that hard to believe that a young sick person might get his strength back plus a little extra? He also started his circuit training specifically designed to get him stronger.

Lol!

You really are an arrogant p**ck. I didn't write the wikipedia article, though looking at it, it certainly seems v. thorough. Neither am I middle distance or AW, 2 people who obviously share similar ideas about the sport, hence your "lumping us together". Wake up and smell the coffee, there are other people who do not share your views.

As for being in nappies or whatever other crap you wrote, you have no idea how old I was in the 1980's, but I would add there are many "kids" who talk a lot more sense than you.

I'm not even going to bother responding to other comments you've raised on here, rather let others decide what value they have.

I hope this thread can get back on track (pardon the pun) rather than degenerate into a slanging match.

One person who I know little about and who I don't think won any major medals was Fiasconaro. Whats the deal with him?

I remember a commentator saying something along the lines of, "...., along with Ovett, Juantorena & Fiasconaro, turned this event into a sprint", which I always found a strange thing to say. Was he a 400/800 guy, and why did he not hang around long?

ukathleticscoach wrote:He was only 21 when he ran the 1:43.97 which at that time was only 0.47 behind the world record. You would expect a runner of that age to progress in terms of time over the next few years.

cruz was 21y 5m when he ran 1'41.77

he didn't progress, so it's no given that they will

I think Cruz would win.

bullshit

there is "deano-crap" all over that entry

poorly written & full of "fabulous, fantastic, etc" eulogising rubbish

i'm surprised wiki haven't cleaned it up

bollocks

same derisory rubbish

well, you are in your 30s according to other posts making you a kid when coe came to notice in '78

it's laughing stock material for this forum to be told about an athlete by someone who was in short trousers for his day job at the time !

there's enough here fom wiki :

if anyone has the time to babel-fish large chunks of it, it's be nice to hear interesting parts

Fiasconaro was a 400 guy who moved up:

There is a fairly large article on juantorena training for the 800 WR on the athletics canada coaching site. This is a small part of it:

Cheers for that!

Lol!

I think its funny that you've had a go at others because you think they're me! I think I'm flattered that I wind you up so much.

"well, you are in your 30s according to other posts making you a kid when coe came to notice in '78

it's laughing stock material for this forum to be told about an athlete by someone who was in short trousers for his day job at the time !"

Are you kidding? So if someone born in 1985 has a degree in 20th century history, they couldn't possibly know as much about the politics behind WW2 as someone's granny who is 80 and lived through it? As usual you're talking out your a**e.

"cruz was 21y 5m when he ran 1'41.77

he didn't progress, so it's no given that they will"

I've made that argument before and you "rubbished" the idea. Now it suits you, you've adopted it yourself. Lol. Hypocrite!

If that's the case then the same could be said of Ryun after '67. Yet you're quite happy to "give him" an extra 7 seconds over 1500m, saying he was capable of 3:26. You are so inconsistent.

ventolin wrote:

ukathleticscoach wrote:He was only 21 when he ran the 1:43.97 which at that time was only 0.47 behind the world record. You would expect a runner of that age to progress in terms of time over the next few years.

cruz was 21y 5m when he ran 1'41.77

he didn't progress, so it's no given that they will

You were implying that Coe's progress was not normal and due to cheating . I showed that his progression was a normal rate.

Finding one athlete who does not show a normal rate of progression does not prove that another athlete is cheating

It does however show that you are clutching at straws.

Cont..

Now the bear having being elbowed by Snell is out in lane eight and in a daze can hear someone in the crowd talking very knowledgably about running. As the bears head clears he realises the guy is actually talking complete bull. The bear picks him up & tucks Ventolin under his furry arm for a mid race snack....

deanouk wrote:

Are you kidding? So if someone born in 1985 has a degree in 20th century history, they couldn't possibly know as much about the politics behind WW2 as someone's granny who is 80 and lived through it? As usual you're talking out your a**e.

listen moron

get the analogy correct

if granny had a degree in in history, then answer is 100% YES

besides, i'll take the opinion of any interested 50y ole fan here on athletics of the '70s than that of some kid who was hardly out of diapers at the time who's one "advantage" is that he's got coe's book stuck up his ass

deanouk wrote:

"cruz was 21y 5m when he ran 1'41.77

he didn't progress, so it's no given that they will"

I've made that argument before and you "rubbished" the idea. Now it suits you, you've adopted it yourself. Lol. Hypocrite!

no

don't flatter youself - you weren't worth bothering with

i made a simple statement of fact about cruz's premature halt in progress

If that's the case then the same could be said of Ryun after '67. Yet you're quite happy to "give him" an extra 7 seconds over 1500m, saying he was capable of 3:26. You are so inconsistent.

i have no idea what you are drivelling on about

if you are so interested in my opinion on the man, here it is :

if ryun had been transported by time machine from 8th july '67 to oslo on 30th july '75 & given wabbits taking him thru 55 then 1'50, & then driven from 550 to 600m out, the very worst i'd have expected to see on the clock was

3'27.xx

in fact here is the manifestation of how i'd almost exactly see that race unfold

ukathleticscoach wrote:

You were implying that Coe's progress was not normal and due to cheating . I showed that his progression was a normal rate

no you didn't

he improved by ~1s from '77 to '78 with 1'43.9 with wr at time of 1'43.4

normal progress i was expecting back then for '79 was by law of diminishing returns & progress from then ( if any ) by few tenths/year for 1 or 2y, to maybe an eventual mid-1'43 career pb if he did well

in fact, very few if any were rating coe's chances at all in the media - ovett had much better prospects over 800 on existing evidence

ask any knowledgeable fan at the time if before his oslo run you expected him to improve by 1.5s to 1'42.3 & whether they'd consider that a normal progression, they wouda laughed in your face on both accounts

You are ignoring the fact in that when running 1:43.97 he was only 21. You develop in that one year more than by just training as strength develops

Coe was defeating East German's who it has been proved were systematically using drugs. They don't work the same on men over middle distances - that's why only the women set all those world records

Ovett, who I am a big fan, of admitted that Coe was a more naturally talented athlete

................

The bear is beginning to tire he doesn't like the taste and is about to spit you out

ukathleticscoach wrote:

You are ignoring the fact in that when running 1:43.97 he was only 21. You develop in that one year more than by just training as strength develops

no

look at his improvement curve :

1.8s '76 - '77

1.0s '77 - '78

it's slowing down & tenths at most are expected off that NOT 1.5s the next year

epopians wrote:

AW Fan wrote:

does anyone else think that ventolin and vipam are really the same person?

Yes. He also goes by the name of Eldrick on T&FN message board, where he trolls everyone on there too. He's always using his Jundo Predictor to say how much faster certain athletes can run (usually Kenyan, as thats where he's from)

Eldrick is black? No wonder he's so stupid!