One difference is that now it is much easier for athletes to transfer than it was a few years ago. That's what Brosnan is counting on. Maybe he'll pull it off, maybe he won't.
Yes, it is much easier to transfer.
But do we see a lot of top-tier runners do it? I think the challenge is that a coach doesn't want to load up on people who are disgruntled and under-achieving at their current school, and if they are succeeding at their current school they probably have a decent coach-athlete relationship and won't move. So you are more likely to get people (personalities) that you don't want and it's harder to get the ones you do want.
Then there's the issue that college students can be very happy with their friends, teammates, living arrangements, and are on a countdown to graduating from their current school.
Some of the reasons that distance runners transfer are:
1. Their coach leaves and they aren't happy with the new coach.
2. By the end of their sophomore year they decide on a new major that their current school doesn't offer, or isn't very good at.
3. They graduate and still have eligibility left, so they go to graduate school somewhere else.
curious to who this could be - many of the top girls in the big west are either non seniors, out of eligibility, or finishing grad programs at current schools.
Brosnan didn't happen upon the best handful of runners in history. He developed them. He had six guys run 8:40s or better in the span of about four years. None of them set any records in middle school before him. I previously charted a few high schoolers of the same class performing near the Youngs as frosh, none of whom developed anywhere close to them. Even if every one of them transferred in from out of district, only the most recent ones would have even known that Brosnan was a coach to transfer for because he only just developed the program from near nothing in 2017-19. They could have had the best ten kids in the entire country transfer in, and even if Brosnan were only as good as their actual coaches and they developed only to the same level as they did in reality, they wouldn't have been as good as NP's top five of Nico, Lex, Leo, Colin, and Aaron. Just think about how unlikely it would be for this to be sheer chance that you get six 8:30s and 8:40s guys in the span of four years in an American hs. That has happened exactly once. They would challenge or beat the all-time best five from American high school history! Take your hundreds of thousands of xc runners every year going back sixty years and they would beat them or come close. How is it possible that anyone could still think this is pure chance and has nothing to do with coach's uncanny ability to get them to buy into his system, his higher expectations, and his college/pro style training system?
Brosnan didn't happen upon the best handful of runners in history. He developed them. He had six guys run 8:40s or better in the span of about four years. None of them set any records in middle school before him. I previously charted a few high schoolers of the same class performing near the Youngs as frosh, none of whom developed anywhere close to them. Even if every one of them transferred in from out of district, only the most recent ones would have even known that Brosnan was a coach to transfer for because he only just developed the program from near nothing in 2017-19. They could have had the best ten kids in the entire country transfer in, and even if Brosnan were only as good as their actual coaches and they developed only to the same level as they did in reality, they wouldn't have been as good as NP's top five of Nico, Lex, Leo, Colin, and Aaron. Just think about how unlikely it would be for this to be sheer chance that you get six 8:30s and 8:40s guys in the span of four years in an American hs. That has happened exactly once. They would challenge or beat the all-time best five from American high school history! Take your hundreds of thousands of xc runners every year going back sixty years and they would beat them or come close. How is it possible that anyone could still think this is pure chance and has nothing to do with coach's uncanny ability to get them to buy into his system, his higher expectations, and his college/pro style training system?
You seem like a really big fan of Brosnan, so sorry if any of this offends you. 5 of the 6 kids you mention were from 2 families. They were casual runners in middle school, playing other sports and not training seriously at a high level like other middle schoolers that run in the 4:40’s. What other runners did you chart that ran 4:15 as 9th graders that didn’t turn out great?
it is pure chance they ended up at NP, coupled with a coach who did a really good job with them. However, there are dozens, if not more coaches in high school that would have had similar results.
He is proving what kind of coach he is at UCLA, which is nothing special. If he was THAT great, you would think he could make a measurable improvement in a group of runners in a year over a coach who was fired because he didn’t have great results. This whole, give him time to recruit doesn’t hold true based on your argument. According to you, it’s not about the athletes, but the coach’s skill at developing the runners. So, the current group of runners should buy into his system and higher expectations to make a significant improvement. Why haven’t they?
Outside of the 2 families, he’s taken a ton of really good middle schoolers and made them really good high school runners, but none on the level of the Youngs and Sahlmans.
You seem like a really big fan of Brosnan, so sorry if any of this offends you. 5 of the 6 kids you mention were from 2 families. They were casual runners in middle school, playing other sports and not training seriously at a high level like other middle schoolers that run in the 4:40’s. What other runners did you chart that ran 4:15 as 9th graders that didn’t turn out great?
it is pure chance they ended up at NP, coupled with a coach who did a really good job with them. However, there are dozens, if not more coaches in high school that would have had similar results.
He is proving what kind of coach he is at UCLA, which is nothing special. If he was THAT great, you would think he could make a measurable improvement in a group of runners in a year over a coach who was fired because he didn’t have great results. This whole, give him time to recruit doesn’t hold true based on your argument. According to you, it’s not about the athletes, but the coach’s skill at developing the runners. So, the current group of runners should buy into his system and higher expectations to make a significant improvement. Why haven’t they?
Outside of the 2 families, he’s taken a ton of really good middle schoolers and made them really good high school runners, but none on the level of the Youngs and Sahlmans.
You are way creepier than the guy you are responding to.
Brosnan didn't happen upon the best handful of runners in history. He developed them. He had six guys run 8:40s or better in the span of about four years. None of them set any records in middle school before him. I previously charted a few high schoolers of the same class performing near the Youngs as frosh, none of whom developed anywhere close to them. Even if every one of them transferred in from out of district, only the most recent ones would have even known that Brosnan was a coach to transfer for because he only just developed the program from near nothing in 2017-19. They could have had the best ten kids in the entire country transfer in, and even if Brosnan were only as good as their actual coaches and they developed only to the same level as they did in reality, they wouldn't have been as good as NP's top five of Nico, Lex, Leo, Colin, and Aaron. Just think about how unlikely it would be for this to be sheer chance that you get six 8:30s and 8:40s guys in the span of four years in an American hs. That has happened exactly once. They would challenge or beat the all-time best five from American high school history! Take your hundreds of thousands of xc runners every year going back sixty years and they would beat them or come close. How is it possible that anyone could still think this is pure chance and has nothing to do with coach's uncanny ability to get them to buy into his system, his higher expectations, and his college/pro style training system?
You seem like a really big fan of Brosnan, so sorry if any of this offends you. 5 of the 6 kids you mention were from 2 families. They were casual runners in middle school, playing other sports and not training seriously at a high level like other middle schoolers that run in the 4:40’s. What other runners did you chart that ran 4:15 as 9th graders that didn’t turn out great?
it is pure chance they ended up at NP, coupled with a coach who did a really good job with them. However, there are dozens, if not more coaches in high school that would have had similar results.
He is proving what kind of coach he is at UCLA, which is nothing special. If he was THAT great, you would think he could make a measurable improvement in a group of runners in a year over a coach who was fired because he didn’t have great results. This whole, give him time to recruit doesn’t hold true based on your argument. According to you, it’s not about the athletes, but the coach’s skill at developing the runners. So, the current group of runners should buy into his system and higher expectations to make a significant improvement. Why haven’t they?
Outside of the 2 families, he’s taken a ton of really good middle schoolers and made them really good high school runners, but none on the level of the Youngs and Sahlmans.
Let's not forget about Ashbrenner who ran 8:44, Applford 8:52 and Samantha McDonell with ran 4:36 and the girls National 4x1600m record. The list goes on and on
we have never seen this from any HS coach in History. Hate all you want the guy can coach.
Why are we acting like he isn't producing with his roster talent-
Staggs: 4:01 to 3:54
Mireles: N/A to 8:02
Wilbur: 4:10 to 4:02
Herold: 4 second PR in the 5,000 (remained around the same)
With little to no talent on the roster, Brosnan has done just fine. The program will flourish in 2-4 years after he is able to recruit some young athletes and transfers to build depth on the roster. There are a lot of distance programs that will not be sending an athlete to indoor NCAA's and we aren't bashing the coaches for that, so why bash Brosnan on his first year when he is sending an athlete to NCAAs?
Brosnan didn't happen upon the best handful of runners in history. He developed them. He had six guys run 8:40s or better in the span of about four years. None of them set any records in middle school before him. I previously charted a few high schoolers of the same class performing near the Youngs as frosh, none of whom developed anywhere close to them. Even if every one of them transferred in from out of district, only the most recent ones would have even known that Brosnan was a coach to transfer for because he only just developed the program from near nothing in 2017-19. They could have had the best ten kids in the entire country transfer in, and even if Brosnan were only as good as their actual coaches and they developed only to the same level as they did in reality, they wouldn't have been as good as NP's top five of Nico, Lex, Leo, Colin, and Aaron. Just think about how unlikely it would be for this to be sheer chance that you get six 8:30s and 8:40s guys in the span of four years in an American hs. That has happened exactly once. They would challenge or beat the all-time best five from American high school history! Take your hundreds of thousands of xc runners every year going back sixty years and they would beat them or come close. How is it possible that anyone could still think this is pure chance and has nothing to do with coach's uncanny ability to get them to buy into his system, his higher expectations, and his college/pro style training system?
Nico ran 15:43 for XC 3-mile as a freshman with no running experience before Brosnan ever got to him. Jace ran 15:26 in the same race. Nico didn't run track that year but Jace ran 9:30 for 3200. Tell me how many guys you've met who ran 15:xx as 14-year-olds in a program that had never accomplished anything? In their first season of running? Brosnan is a fine coach, but he got UNBELIEVABLY lucky with the talent he was given to work with. He reminds me a lot of Tinman, but Tinman at least had the sense to realize there were dozens of Drew Hunters out there. Brosnan just got lucky enough to work with two entire families of Drew Hunters.
The classic “he has all the talent” is just the sad coaches who never had success excuse.
Brosnan had girls running 4:36, girls breaking national 4x1600m records , and many other boys breaking 9min. The list literally goes on and on with fast times and development. Saying he just got lucky is a poor excuse. If that’s the case, then Bowerman, Mike Smith, Dave Smith, the Powells have all been lucky. Try taking the best two athletes or families from any program and you’ll be less successful no matter who you are in HS.
Like him or not he made history with Newbury Park and is moving the needle quickly at UCLA.
Brosnan didn't happen upon the best handful of runners in history. He developed them. He had six guys run 8:40s or better in the span of about four years. None of them set any records in middle school before him. I previously charted a few high schoolers of the same class performing near the Youngs as frosh, none of whom developed anywhere close to them. Even if every one of them transferred in from out of district, only the most recent ones would have even known that Brosnan was a coach to transfer for because he only just developed the program from near nothing in 2017-19. They could have had the best ten kids in the entire country transfer in, and even if Brosnan were only as good as their actual coaches and they developed only to the same level as they did in reality, they wouldn't have been as good as NP's top five of Nico, Lex, Leo, Colin, and Aaron. Just think about how unlikely it would be for this to be sheer chance that you get six 8:30s and 8:40s guys in the span of four years in an American hs. That has happened exactly once. They would challenge or beat the all-time best five from American high school history! Take your hundreds of thousands of xc runners every year going back sixty years and they would beat them or come close. How is it possible that anyone could still think this is pure chance and has nothing to do with coach's uncanny ability to get them to buy into his system, his higher expectations, and his college/pro style training system?
Nico ran 15:43 for XC 3-mile as a freshman with no running experience before Brosnan ever got to him. Jace ran 15:26 in the same race. Nico didn't run track that year but Jace ran 9:30 for 3200. Tell me how many guys you've met who ran 15:xx as 14-year-olds in a program that had never accomplished anything? In their first season of running? Brosnan is a fine coach, but he got UNBELIEVABLY lucky with the talent he was given to work with. He reminds me a lot of Tinman, but Tinman at least had the sense to realize there were dozens of Drew Hunters out there. Brosnan just got lucky enough to work with two entire families of Drew Hunters.
By no running experience you mean "an extensive youth track career"? Aschbrenner and the Youngs ran like 4 years of club XC/TF before coming to NP and ran solid but not exceptional times.
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