Unpopular Bekele GOAT opinions

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2 years ago 10/05/2022 7:06pm EDT

re: Dethroned Anbessa

Dethroned Anbessa wrote:
Here is the criteria by which I am making my decisions with the 4th category being the most important. The 4th category is sort of a combination of all other categories.
1. Peak athletic ability (PR)
2. Competition record and relative dominance of era
3. Range
4. hypothetical GOAT race outcome. (15/5k/10k/mar 100 randomized races win % with fresh legs)
1. (PR) - Kipchoge, Cheptegei, El Guerrouj, Bekele, Komen
2. Competition - Farah, Kipchoge, Bekele, El G, Coe
3. Farah, Bekele, Kipchoge, El G, Geb
4. El G (28%), Kipchoge (24%), Farah (20%), Bekele (15%), Geb (4%), Ingerbritsen (2%), Cheptegei (2%), Komen (1%), Wanjiru (1%), Lagat (1%), Coe (1%), Barega (1%)

Terribly flawed analysis. Bekele in 2008 form does not lose the 5000m, 10000m, and perhaps even perhaps HM to anyone, all time.

Surely you’re a fool looking at these percentages, giving Farah a greater win percentage than Bekele and giving El G, with very little range, such a high percentage. Bekele beats BOTH at Marathon 100% of the time, at 10k 90 % of the time, and 5k at least 50%. See Rojo’s post about head to head records. also see my previous thread:

LetsRun.com Forum Thread

Bekele’s 2008 Olympic 5000m final was the GOAT performance - prove me wrong

Runnerofruns04/25/2022 10:55pm EDT3 years ago

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=CtBPtksTW4QThe dominance from start to finish. The quality of opponents. The last 5 laps. Look at the power on the backstretch of the last lap. Wowwwwww!Unmatched in all my years of fandom. Willi...

Thread:www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?th...

what a troll. SMH.

#62

This post was removed.

2 years ago 10/05/2022 7:23pm EDT

Letsrun somehow bumped me off the nick Johnson thread, oops. Ignore that ^^^

2 years ago 10/05/2022 7:46pm EDT

re: Runnerofruns

Runnerofruns wrote:
Dethroned Anbessa wrote:
Here is the criteria by which I am making my decisions with the 4th category being the most important. The 4th category is sort of a combination of all other categories.
1. Peak athletic ability (PR)
2. Competition record and relative dominance of era
3. Range
4. hypothetical GOAT race outcome. (15/5k/10k/mar 100 randomized races win % with fresh legs)
1. (PR) - Kipchoge, Cheptegei, El Guerrouj, Bekele, Komen
2. Competition - Farah, Kipchoge, Bekele, El G, Coe
3. Farah, Bekele, Kipchoge, El G, Geb
4. El G (28%), Kipchoge (24%), Farah (20%), Bekele (15%), Geb (4%), Ingerbritsen (2%), Cheptegei (2%), Komen (1%), Wanjiru (1%), Lagat (1%), Coe (1%), Barega (1%)
Terribly flawed analysis. Bekele in 2008 form does not lose the 5000m, 10000m, and perhaps even perhaps HM to anyone, all time.
Surely you’re a fool looking at these percentages, giving Farah a greater win percentage than Bekele and giving El G, with very little range, such a high percentage. Bekele beats BOTH at Marathon 100% of the time, at 10k 90 % of the time, and 5k at least 50%. See Rojo’s post about head to head records. also see my previous thread:
Thread:www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?th...
what a troll. SMH.

Just so we are clear these races are not head to head but regular championship style races.

So giving El G at least 20% is basically a guarantee as is giving Kipchoge at least 23%. El G would almost automatically win the 1500 in his prime over anyone as would Kipchoge in the marathon.

Bekele would win a high percentage of 5/10ks but he would be splitting those with all the other runners (El G, Cheptegei, Farah, Geb, Komen, etc.)

I do give the edge to Farah in those races but I understand the point of view that Bekele would win over Farah as well. As I said it depends on the race tactics.

2 years ago 10/05/2022 7:50pm EDT

re: Dethroned Anbessa

I agree that Bekele destroys El G in the marathon every time, but he loses to Kipchoge every time so it doesn’t matter he still loses.

In this made up game I’m giving no credit for 2nd place over 10th place etc. it’s strictly winning percentage. That may be a flawed way of looking at it but that’s what I was doing when making my analysis.

2 years ago 10/05/2022 8:43pm EDT

re: Dethroned Anbessa

Dethroned Anbessa wrote:
I agree that Bekele destroys El G in the marathon every time, but he loses to Kipchoge every time so it doesn’t matter he still loses.
In this made up game I’m giving no credit for 2nd place over 10th place etc. it’s strictly winning percentage. That may be a flawed way of looking at it but that’s what I was doing when making my analysis.

To say El G would win 1500 even 50% of the time, or that kipchoge would win the marathon 70% of the time, against ALL athletes in their prime is foolish at best. They were/are stellar in their event, but they are not indomitable. 2:01:41 Bekele beats prime marathon Kipchoge 2-3/10 times, let alone including all other runners in history. It took El G 3 tries to win the Olympics. The proof is there; it is HARD to win these races, and you’re overestimating their ability vs others.

2 years ago 10/06/2022 12:09pm EDT

re: Dethroned Anbessa

Dethroned Anbessa wrote:
Jerry Maguire wrote:
Listen kid.
Bekele has dominated on EVERY SURFACE.
XC GOAT
Track GOAT. World Records and Championships.
He’d still have the records if it weren’t for the spikes.
His 2008 Olympic 5000m gold and Olympic record is a work of art.
Link:www.letsrun.com/2008/5k0824.php
12:57.82
“A 53.87 last lap which produced a 2:25.30 last 1k. Yes, the last kilometer was 2:25.30. The last 1,600m? 3:57.01. That's a sub-3:59 last mile, folks. The last 2k of 4:56.97 and last 3k of 7:35.53”
I’m in my mid 30s and watched Bekele do that. Honestly, no where near as impressive as Farahs 2015 WC 5000m in sub 2:20 last 1000m and 1:48.6 last 800 meters. He simply wouldn’t lose to Bekele in a 5000 meter race.

You really think that? Bekele had 5000m and 10000m PRs that were ~16 and ~30 seconds faster than Farah's, respectively. There is no way that Farah would beat Bekele unless Bekele was injured. Besides that, you are completely disregarding that Farah was the king of running the bulk of the race slow and then turning it way up at the end. Sure, Farah put out a final 1000 that was ~5 seconds faster than Bekele. But Bekele won the 2008 Olympic gold in 12:57.82 while Farah won the 2015 world gold in 13:50.38. Farah was just about 53 seconds slower.

There's no way Farah could kick like he did in 2015 off of 2008's pace. He'd be toast

What? No love for Said Aouita? He's the only Olympic runner to medal in both the 800m (bronze, 1988) and the 5,000 (gold, 1984) and he set WR's in the 1,500 and 5,000 meters in 1985. The guy was versatile, to say the least. Why isn't on the list --- because of doping allegations?

2 years ago 10/06/2022 4:45pm EDT

re: Jerry Maguire

C'mon, man. Viren? Really? The guy was the poster boy for blood doping.

2 years ago 10/06/2022 5:11pm EDT

re: Dethroned Anbessa

Paula Radcliffe is regarded as the GOAT in women long distance running and rightly so.The reason is because of the kind of super human performances she had during her era.Even though she didn't do well in cross country,her PRs and WRs in the marathon, on roads and 10ks stood for a long time,hence make up for her no-shows in cross country.Based on the same logic EL G ,Kipchoge and Komen have an edge over Bekele.Again ,can I remind you that all of Bekele's records have been broken already exfeot the bew masters marathon WR which is quite vulnerable anyway. Also, his number of wins and dominance will be eclipsed by either Kiplimo or Cheptegei.On the contrary the records of Kipchoge, ELG and Komen will stand for a long time to come.By the way how many people ever beat EL G in during his reign?I think its only Noah Ngeny and Kipchoge. Whereas Bekele was beaten by Kipchoge(2003 in 5000 and severally in the marathon),EL G (several times in 5000),Shaheen (once).Tedese (once in world cross) so his GOAT status can be queried in comparison for instance to EL G one.

2 years ago 10/06/2022 11:27pm EDT

re: MatthewXCountry

MatthewXCountry wrote:
Dethroned Anbessa wrote:
Bekele is 5th for GOAT mid to long distance. The guys in front of him are either better champions or faster.
my top 10
1. Kipchoge
2. El G
3. Farah
4. Cheptegei
5. Bekele
6. Geb
7. Komen
8. Ingebritsen
9. Coe
10. Ngeny
Ummmmm ... Ever heard of Jordan Hasay?

He was pretty good, too!

2 years ago 10/07/2022 12:01am EDT

re: Sebcrux

Sebcrux wrote:
Paula Radcliffe is regarded as the GOAT in women long distance running and rightly so.The reason is because of the kind of super human performances she had during her era.Even though she didn't do well in cross country,her PRs and WRs in the marathon, on roads and 10ks stood for a long time,hence make up for her no-shows in cross country.Based on the same logic EL G ,Kipchoge and Komen have an edge over Bekele.Again ,can I remind you that all of Bekele's records have been broken already exfeot the bew masters marathon WR which is quite vulnerable anyway. Also, his number of wins and dominance will be eclipsed by either Kiplimo or Cheptegei.On the contrary the records of Kipchoge, ELG and Komen will stand for a long time to come.By the way how many people ever beat EL G in during his reign?I think its only Noah Ngeny and Kipchoge. Whereas Bekele was beaten by Kipchoge(2003 in 5000 and severally in the marathon),EL G (several times in 5000),Shaheen (once).Tedese (once in world cross) so his GOAT status can be queried in comparison for instance to EL G one.

I’ve never seen or heard anyone refer to Radcliffe as the female GOAT. She’s known for her infamous Olympic failures as much as she is for her fast marathons. I’m not sure who is the female GOAT but it’s definitely not Radcliffe. Tirunesh Dibaba had a much better career.

9 months ago 11/26/2024 2:15am EST

re: Dethroned Anbessa

Dethroned Anbessa wrote:
well,,, wrote:
Chep was completely owned by a 1500 runner in this year´s WC.
Yes coming off of a 10,000 meter title and to Ingerbritsen who is not really a 1500 runner. I think Jakob will ultimately be a better 5k runner than 1500m.

Bump

9 months ago 11/26/2024 2:18am EST

re: McRunnin

McRunnin wrote:
Sebcrux wrote:
Paula Radcliffe is regarded as the GOAT in women long distance running and rightly so.The reason is because of the kind of super human performances she had during her era.Even though she didn't do well in cross country,her PRs and WRs in the marathon, on roads and 10ks stood for a long time,hence make up for her no-shows in cross country.Based on the same logic EL G ,Kipchoge and Komen have an edge over Bekele.Again ,can I remind you that all of Bekele's records have been broken already exfeot the bew masters marathon WR which is quite vulnerable anyway. Also, his number of wins and dominance will be eclipsed by either Kiplimo or Cheptegei.On the contrary the records of Kipchoge, ELG and Komen will stand for a long time to come.By the way how many people ever beat EL G in during his reign?I think its only Noah Ngeny and Kipchoge. Whereas Bekele was beaten by Kipchoge(2003 in 5000 and severally in the marathon),EL G (several times in 5000),Shaheen (once).Tedese (once in world cross) so his GOAT status can be queried in comparison for instance to EL G one.
I’ve never seen or heard anyone refer to Radcliffe as the female GOAT. She’s known for her infamous Olympic failures as much as she is for her fast marathons. I’m not sure who is the female GOAT but it’s definitely not Radcliffe. Tirunesh Dibaba had a much better career.

Lmao. A single year from Hassan (2019, 2021, or 2024) is better than the entirety of what Radcliffe did during her career combined. Gidey, Tsegay, Chebet and Kipyegon all easily put her to shame as well

9 months ago 11/26/2024 4:05am EST

re: she's not even top ten

This list is nonsense.... Kipchoge on 1st is ludacris........................................Farah above Bekele (or anyone else above Bekele) is ludacris...........

Like someone else said, King of XC (lots of double championships, short+long), King of Track, King of marathon (at least a couple of times).

Haile is definitely missing in top10.

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