Jenny Simpson is the Greatest US 1500m runner EVER- male or female

What about Rowbury? Is she not clean? She has AR

I have to go with Jim Ryun. Olympian as a junior in hs. American record in hs. Multiple world records at different distances. Silver medal. Still holds under 20 records. His 351 mile would still be noteworthy 5 decades later. While Simpson is consistently great Ryun was unquestionably the World's best miler for a few years and his mile and 1500 records lasted nearly a decade.

Simpson or Ryun in some order. Centro not far behind. I'll put him in that group if he breaks the AR or gets another world/oly medal, but right now too many of his wins/medals came with mediocre times in my opinion.

Lagat belongs in the convo only if we include his performances while competing for Kenya, which Im not.

Wow...lots of head to head action between them over the last 10+ years!

I think Efraimson is close to making a US team

Bachman wrote:

Simpson or Ryun in some order. Centro not far behind. I'll put him in that group if he breaks the AR or gets another world/oly medal, but right now too many of his wins/medals came with mediocre times in my opinion.

Lagat belongs in the convo only if we include his performances while competing for Kenya, which Im not.

Didn't Lagat win world gold for the US, and set a number of US national records--and the 1500 one still stands?

Why mention Lagat. He's a drug cheat. He was let off for political reasons. When he and his coach decided to grandstand after he was let off, the IAAF told them to shut up or certain things would be made public. Lagat and Li shut up and literally hid for months. Lagat's a fraud. Political Correctness saved his career.

Scorpion_runner wrote:

You fool. She couldn't carry Mary Decker's jock strap.

No world records and was never number 1 in the world.

And Mary was number 1 from 800m to 10000m.

Now put that in your pipe in smoke it.

And don't say anything about PEDs, she did that at 37

Mary certainly got tons more fame or infamy than Jenny has or probably ever will, regardless of who's "The Greatest US 1500m runner EVER" on the distaff side, which I think boils down to these two.

I love Jenny, but no WR or Olympic Gold, not at same level as Ryun, Slaney, or Centro.

I was pretty solidly on the Ryun when the thread about best American of all time came up last year.

I still am, but after Rio, I'm on shakier footing.

Sabc szabo wrote:

Title 9er wrote:

Her PR of 3:57 is not even close to what it takes to make the meet for the men's 1500m in 3:39. So I would say she's probably not the best 1500m American ever. She's also like 25+ seconds slower than the top male Americans

Yawn. This line of reasoning is lame and you should feel sad.

Technically based on the title, he's not wrong

No he's not. Greatest doesn't mean just times, it means the whole list of accomplishments and how you compare to your gender.

B. Lagat and Jim R. easily.

Kev2 wrote:

What about Rowbury? Is she not clean? She has AR

What about her? Probably not. So she ran faster than Simpson in one race where they both finished well back of the leaders; I think the fact her PR is a little bit faster doesn't mean too much to most people.

You know, I almost agree with you. She has national titles and World and Olympic medals. However, I can't give her my vote because the "greatest US 1500m runner EVER - male or female" has never held the American record.

For me, it's still Ryun despite his flaws. 2 WRs and an Olympic silver medal.

I still have Ryun and Decker the best for their respective sexes, but Centro and Simpson are close.

Actually, I'm dropping Simpson to #5 after doing some research. #2 is Slaney with 6 #1 US rankings, the American record and World Championships gold. #3 is Rowbury with 6 #1 US rankings, the American record and World Championships bronze. #4 is Centro with 5 #1 US rankings, World Championships bronze and silver and Olympic gold (no American record). Simpson is #5 with 2 #1 US rankings, World Championships gold and silver and Olympic bronze (no American record).

Actually, Simpson is now #6. I completely forgot Bernard Lagat who ranks #5 with 5 #1 US rankings, World Championships gold and bronze and the American record.

Ultradude wrote:

Who has the women's American record for 1500? Oh yeah, Shannon Rowbury.

That's right. Simpson really has to take the AR back before we can make a serious case for her over someone who has owned the WR like Ryun or an Olympic gold medal like Centro.

Boutros Boutros Golly wrote:

I think Efraimson is close to making a US team

Ummm... cool? Lots of people have made the US team. Almost every year, 3 do. This is about the best of them. Ever. Don't offend Jenny and Shannon by bringing a child into this conversation. Efraimson is good, but a long way from world champion.