Doping Red Flags

aduck2002 wrote:

add to list..

running with an erection

is also a massive red flag.

MO Farah?

add foaming at the mouth to the list ..

funny thg is male cross country skiers often finish covered in spit from effort,

aduck2002 wrote:

and also dominated xc worlds-

how gud was cera..

the later age of some reflects when new ped hits scene. cough (igf-1).

You're so good at the old stuff. Why don't you try telling us of what's the next thing. Cera talk in 2016 loooooool. Tell us what the next thing to come (ala meldonium) is and we will start listening to you

Some of the red flags are a bit questionable:

(1) allegations : depends on who is making the allegations, and how credible the allegations are (if they are proven they are more credible!) If we take allegations on letsrun at face value, no-one is clean.

(7) (maximizing their "legal advantages") seems questionable -- most high profile doping cases don't as far as I know, involve people who were maximizing their legal alternatives as well as the illegal ones. After all, why fool around with a bread knife when you're already using a chainsaw ?

(9) (being "on" all year). Disagree with this, it's easier to escape detection if you only aspire to be a one hit wonder.

(10) "Doping shows up in the last 200m of the race usually" Sure, but in a tactical race, fitness that is not caused by doping also shows up in the last 200m of the race.

(12) "It looks like being from Ethiopia, Kenya, or Jamaica should also be on this list. Any time you have a small population of people taking over a large proportion of the medals… red flag."

... well not unless the countries in question have a bad track record as far as doping is concerned, and/or a large number of athletes that trigger other red flags (that's why Turkey and Russia are red flags.) Is Jamaica's doping record any worse than the USA's in the sprints ?

13. "Getting greedy. They always get greedy. They want more records and more medals. They double or triple at major championships."

don't see how this is a red flag. Is he calling out Zatopek here ?

Very well-expressed, especially the "butter knife/chainsaw" analogy.

Examples from XC skiing: Johann Muhlegg and Andrus Veerpalu could be mediocre or not competing at all and then, all of a sudden:

and

I've always said based on his improvent wejo could be suspicious if you aren't smart.

The person in the other thread said Wejow as guilty of #4, #7, 10 and 11. That's not true.

Weldon is the OPPOSITE OF THIS. The whole reason why we started this website was to share the training philosophies of John Kellogg adn tell people how well his training and high/low training works. We even had a "Survivor Flagstaff" contest where we had roommates and what not -

I certainly wouldn't say Weldon was 'consantly looking for legal advantages" or that he had to "go through a doctor to get it." the only advantage he was constantly seeking was altitude. Some could argue a poor person can't do high low training. He was doing it by actually living out in Flagg, not with an altitude tent. Doctors had nothing to do with it.

He put ** by this which means maybe he was thinking of #8? "8. A long plateau followed by a massive breakthrough after the age of 30. I’d say the 26-29 are the golden years, and you can have a breakthrough because this is when consistency meets experience. But older than 30? Red flag it. This only applies to track events."

Weldon had a big breakthrough but it was well before he was 30.Weldon ran 3030s in 1994 at age 20, staganted at 30:13 at age 23 and then ran a big PR of 2830 at age 26.

Wejo was 4th in the countyr in 2001 and 2003. He bombed in 2000 and 2004.

#10 is something about not being tired in the last 200. Not sure how that applies either.

longjack wrote:

quantum leap in times without explanation.

for example, wilis seems to be a legit 332 guy for years, but he was often injured, now he's got a couple of years without injury.

another red flag is when your wife dies from EPO induced heart attack and you have the world record.

it is a paradigm of bullshhitt

The problem with that is that people will judge that based not on if there is an explanation but whether they personally know the explanation! Which of course they don't - you know almost nothing about the lives of these people.

Second point kind of highlights that - you have invented/speculated that it was EPO induced.

You have confirmation bias at play in both directions - if its an athlete you want to be/think is clean you find 'evidence' why that is so (He was injured then was injured) and if you want the athlete to be dirty you find 'evidence' to support that theory as well (his wife died due to EPO!)

this is the bomb waiting to explode my friend. maybe soon

check out my record on peds accusations and the busts. look at gibson too.

What's a more fun question is: Who is the athlete that wrote this list?

I'm gonna go with Heather Kampf or Phoebe Wright.

Running fast all year (no one does that).

But in any case, a person who races all year or frequently is the least likely to dope.

More races = more testing and less time for doping.

Dopers run very few races from what we've seen.

yadddaaaa yaddaaa wrote:

What's a more fun question is: Who is the athlete that wrote this list?

I'm gonna go with Heather Kampf or Phoebe Wright.

I reckon you're on the right track there. Mentioning the last 200m of the race (and in particular a "wall" 200m from the end as opposed to describing a finishing kick points to a mid distance runner, and probably an 800m runner.

Note also the use of first person here "those Turkish ladies that have never run fast ever and waltz on to the track to take gold and silver. What the hell. Don’t mock us like that." So my guess is that it's a female mid distance runner, and probably an 800m or 800m/1500m runner (like Heather Kampf or Phoebe Wright)