Kenya vs USA

catman wrote:fred, what became of Jeff Nelson? . . . Most likely your coach retired cause soccer took away most of the talented runners. It definitely did that in my area . . .

I wouldn't want Fredo to take the blame for what I wrote.

Jeff Nelson went to the Univ. of Oregon and got injured and discouraged by what he considered the blood-and-guts approach there. From what I read, he got tired of hammering it out with Chapa, Salazar, and the rest. He went back to Glendale CC for a year or so, got hurt again, then hung it up. Too bad.

My coach never indicated that he was discouraged by any loss of talent to soccer. In fact, he was such a great motivator that he could draw talent away from the soccer team. One such kid went on to win the 1988 NCAA steeplechase and made the 1995 IAAF World Champs team in the steeple. No, my old coach was discouraged by the deterioration in the work ethic. He said that clearly and repeatedly.

Good post, Concerned American. I read those articles, too, and felt that Skinny was just pulling our chain. There is always going to be some idiot claiming a gentic factor where none exist--pretending to be smart when just the opposite is the case. You know the guy--he takes a shower with a black guy--sees that his dingy looks bigger and he starts to lose it. He is too ignorant to know that on account that blacks carry the sicle cell anemia gene that they are always at least semi-hard all of the time. Some white boys really take the cake and give to their less ambitious black bro to eat. And they lap and laugh it up.

Blacks from both West Africa and of West african descent worldwide actually do dominate sprinting. There are Brazilian athletes of Black descent which were and are dominant sprinters and jumpers. Athletes from just about every colonized Island as well. Look at the evidence.

And not all Kenyans want it from a young age. Peter Rono was inspired by the 5th place finisher in the LA Olympics and won the next Games. Jamers Koskei saw his neighbour getting rich and started in his late twenties. So did Simon Karori. That's a gift and a Genetic one at that. In fact a large number of the most successful Kenyans were late starters. Often fat bastards too. It ain't just lifestyle and mental barriers slowing the white guys down.

That not a gift. That good training. All you have to do is compare athletes at each age level. American already way far behind at the junior level. But not sprinter. Just distance runner. If black had advantage then how come black runner from American not leading nation? How come black runner not make it to Olympic games? How come black Kenyan runner from Virginia not win Footlocker? He get 15th place or something. It not black or white. It training. Oh my head spinning now. I lose concentration. I must practice better English to keep proficient and consistent.

Take Ah ahdvice and listen to the words of wisdom from Ah.

Pussygirl, Yes you and I are alike in that way my mongrel friend. Must be our muddled Indian/White ancestry. No tribe took it up the old tailpipe quite like the boys from the Smoky Mountains. Tribal legend states that the misty smoke hanging over those hills comes from just such friction. Peace my pipe smoking brother. Try to stay away from the skin cigars the palefaces may offer you.

Elijah Lagat didn't start running until his late 20's when his doc told the only way to lose weight (Lagat had gained a bunch of weight from a weird African disease) was to exercise. Lagat discovered he liked running, and in his early 30's he won the Boston Marathon in 2:09.

This is surprisingly similar to Bill Rodgers' experience, where after chain smoking and working in a hospital he decided to start running so he would never look like the folks he wheeled around. Then he won Boston in 2:09.

on an unrelated note, Catman, could you please leave the supremacy stuff at home. I come to this site to read about running, not speculations on a vast worldwide Zionist conspiracy. I think there are plenty of resources on the internet to learn more, and you have provided many links to these pages. But I don't want to read about it here.

You know when I first started reading Ah's posts I really wanted to punch him in the face, but now that he (and my bet is that it's Malmo) has come "into focus", I think he is hitting the nail on the head. We race too frickin much and we really race too much during hs. Too many coaches care who wins the Podunk hs vs. East Idaho dual in which you will most often see the distance stud running the 4 x 8, 1600, 3200, and maybe even the 800 and/or 4 x 4. And the work ethic has gone down hill. Too many people are worried about "burning out" instead of catching fire. I'd like to just smack all the hs coaches who are planting the evil seeds of "volume will get you injured" into the minds of our youth. These are the same fat asses who won't get put down the remote, get off the couch, and at least supervise some summer or winter workouts for their athletes. They are also the same dipshits who openly criticize the programs who are successful by saying they run too many miles. What kind of doo doo is that, if you can't beat someone-you criticize their work ethic? Holy justification batman, you have got to be kidding me. Since when is it a crime to outwork your opponent? But, that's the state of things and too many kids are couch potatos compared to when we were coming up. I don't ever recall the courts, fields, gyms, or tracks being empty when I was a kid, but you'd be hard pressed to find kids there except for organized leagues. We looked up to Jim Ryun, Frank Shorter, Bill Rodgers, Pre and considered them to have the same status as any other world class athlete. You can't hardly do that now because you DON'T see track and field on TV anymore (nice going USATF!!!!!!) and when it is, it's the butchered, fluff crappy bastardized version of what is used to be. We can get the X-games on ESPN nearly any day of the stinkin week, but I can't recall seeing the NCAA or the USATF championships live on network TV in eons. We have let ourselves be shunted to the back burner while the NHL and the WWF are on ad nauseum. Sorry, if you have an affinity for those "games" (not sports) but I'm pissed off about the state of track and field in the US both for the next generation of athletes and for us who are in the trenches trying to keep it meaninful for the athletes who have the talent, but aren't sure if it is meaningful or not because we let our own television networks bend us over. And don't get me started on Phil Knight and his fellow "sell outs" at Nike. Pre must be rolling in his grave when you got enough dough to fund the Brazilian soccer team, but you can't adequately support the sport that made you, you big bum. Bowerman should have kicked your ass Phil

Gotta go before I pop an aneurism......

WE NEED SOME F----ING LEADERSHIP IN THE SPORT IN THE USA!!

BillCarr politics plays a very big role in running sports and our everyday life. For me not to say anything would be the same as telling me to eat all I want but never to crap. Sorry--best analogy that I could come up with.

... I don't think Mr. "Ah" is malmo. He mentioned that it was problems with training that has prevented Wejo from being world class and tends to believe that his greatest accomplishment was pacing PR (how are THOSE initials for a runner?). I think malmo knows that Wejo's training in high school and currently is quite the opposite of being a problem. He also knows that, just because Wejo hasn't hit a big one in the marathon yet, he HAS come from 30:14 in college to run 28:10 (and two other mid-28s), getting two pretty big victories against some international-level runners in the process, and was ranked 4th in the U.S., leapfrogging hundreds of runners who were way ahead of him in college. No, malmo would know that Wejo's training (high school and present) is what he (and even Mr. "Ah") would say we need MORE of to close the gap.

However, except for the "just give up" angle, Mr. "Ah" has hit a lot of things right on the mark in typical malmo-esque fashion. Does make you wonder. I'm just not sure malmo would take a jab (with the "pacing Paula" reference) at a guy who has a FASTER 10,000m PR than he does and who is known to run lots of old school mileage.

DIII Coach wrote:

Too many people are worried about "burning out" instead of catching fire. . . You can't hardly do that now because you DON'T see track and field on TV anymore (nice going USATF!!!!!!) and when it is, it's the butchered, fluff crappy bastardized version of what is used to be.

I agree. Fear of burning out is unjustified. What are they saving themselves for? Future mediocrity? At least those whose work volume was heavy at a young age -- the Lindgrens and Ryuns -- accomplished spectacular things at some point in their careers. I've never heard of Sammy or Geb, who has been great since his teenage days, worrying about burnout.

I'm reluctant to blame USATF entirely for lack of T.V.interest, though. It seems there aren't T.V. execs who recognize -- or care about -- the intrinsic value of sports like T&F. There aren't any Roone Arledges anymore. Today's T.V. execs are amoral pimps who hide behind the lie that they merely respond to demand, all the while knowing that they create it. After all, it's creating demand, through advertising, that pays their obscene salaries.

Whoops, there goes MY aneurysm.

Yes, a 28:10 and 2 mid 28's is a superior product. So you

have to ask, what is it that got an American to this level.

You would think that the previous training model is just

not cutting it.

And when Wejo is training those slow 8:30 miles and people

go by him, he has to put up with crap. Yet he hammers them

into the ground when it counts.

Not true, I train with Gideon Mutisya, of kenya he has been racing competively for 15 years now, not just two, of course his times are not what they used to be he did a 2:15 marathon this year at the age of 38.

Same with Paul Mwangi these guys love racing, and running. Gideon was ranked #1 in the world on the roads one year and in the top ten 2 other years.

Your absolutely right I was a professional kickboxer a few years back, onne of teh first things our coaches told us was no milk! #1 REASON WAS THAT AFTER THE AGE OF 12 THE BODY NO LONGER PRODUCES THE ENZIME FOR DIGESTING MILK! Hmmm"S link tells all the other reasons.

Wrong thread, fleetfoot. Thanks for the support though.

Ah say finally someone in sport who have common sense. Very difficult for college coach to develop high school runner who over-race. Over-race runner have no base necessary to adapt to college training quickly.

Ah say you won't see American at world-class level with Kenyan runner until you see junior level program at world-class level. You never see junior level program at world-class level until high school system die for distance runner and club program with professional level coaches and doctor with corporate support take over.

Thanks catman!! I was hoping you would come up with something a lil more original, but I went with the odds and won a little office pool about what tribe you would claim! Its kinduva inside Indian joke, because 99.9% of the time a white person will claim Cherokee, and then proclaim that their great great great grandma or some other long lost female relative was a Cherokee princess. not doubting your claim but,that is a classic answer,just in case your curious the only place you will ever find an Indian princess is at a MODERN DAY pow wow(dance/celebration) or maybe India? I also read that comedy page you broadcast, you might want to keep your Cherokee claim on the DL(down low) They don't think too highly of, how did they put it? Oh yeah INJUNS. Don't sweat the small shit though, I am sure that the Cherokee's or any other tribe for that matter will not miss you. Again nice conversating with ya!

I am glad I could help you win some money. And what does it matter how Indijuns is spelled? It's a misnomer anyway.

OK catman, I'll bite, what's with the parody websites?