Its simple really. We always hate the most in others what we fear most about ourselves.
Its simple really. We always hate the most in others what we fear most about ourselves.
Conundrum wrote:
Its simple really. We always hate the most in others what we fear most about ourselves.
Even simpler. Most people hate most other people.
Even simpler wrote:
Conundrum wrote:Its simple really. We always hate the most in others what we fear most about ourselves.
Even simpler. Most people hate most other people.
Especially so for fat, old ladies!
I was around when races had 40-50 competitors, yeah it was cool, but I like it better now. The after race atmosphere is cool. Plus, I have a lot of friends who run and "race" to stay in shape and they really appreciate what the faster runners do. I don't know why there is so much hate.
You can bet the elite don't hate them, just the wannabes.
the only thing that annoys me is that I cant use the bathroom - cough portapotties - within 30 mins of a race if I want to warmup
The frustration is with the public perception of running as a sport rather than with slow runners. At a company soft ball game, if you dropped three fly balls and threw one away letting a runner score, no one would pat you on the back and say great job but an equivalent performance in running is applauded and even celebrated. Participation means more than achievement in running and that sucks.
kartelite wrote:
Swingline wrote:Exactly. Time is not the issue, if you compare "competative runners" to the real elites you quickly realize all of us except about 30 people on the planet should really be "runners".
What exactly are you saying, Vizzini? I do not think it means what you think it means.
Vizzini? WTF is that?
Im saying that when the "local elites" are compared to the top 30 or so runners in the world they quickly look more like the "hobby joggers" they hate.
deeper thoughts wrote:
The frustration is with the public perception of running as a sport rather than with slow runners. At a company soft ball game, if you dropped three fly balls and threw one away letting a runner score, no one would pat you on the back and say great job but an equivalent performance in running is applauded and even celebrated. Participation means more than achievement in running and that sucks.
This kind of sums it up nicely. I have no hate for anyone, but it does kind of annoy me how effort is lauded over performance. If two people put in the same time, and one runs 15:00 and the other runs 15:05, the former will be applauded. But if the 15:00 puts in 10 hours per week and someone else puts in 3 hours per week to run 25 minutes, but is fat, they get an article about changing their lives... which they are, and that's great, but how about a little perspective. They time the races for a reason.
Swingline wrote:
kartelite wrote:What exactly are you saying, Vizzini? I do not think it means what you think it means.
Vizzini? WTF is that...
Go watch the movie "The Princess Bride".
Sheeesh...higher culture is just lost on kids these days.
I got it, great reference.
not the same guy wrote:
What exactly are you saying, Vizzini? I do not think it means what you think it means.
Vizzini? WTF is that...[/quote]
Go watch the movie "The Princess Bride".
Sheeesh...higher culture is just lost on kids these days.[/quote]
yeah saw the movie, hated it, didnt get the reference. BUT I guess you said that because you thought it was applicable to what I posted. You didnt just randomly quote a bad comedy from the 80's.
dpmrunner wrote:
I am not fast at all, don't expect to be at the top of the standings, and just aim for success by my own definition (i.e. improved times, consistent pace, etc.). But I belong to a couple of clubs that have some very fast runners.
None of them treat me with disdain. They are encouraging, supportive, offer helpful tips, and are a overall quite a friendly bunch. I know that sometimes they'll refer to the Penguin mindset with some disdain and will wonder why people would want to run marathons over four hours. But I don't take these things personally. I know to some extent where they're coming from. I also know that everyone present has abilities that others don't have whether running or in some other field.
And I feel that the runners in my club respect that I'm making an effort, even if my speed doesn't match theirs.
Interestingly, in one race, a 5k, in which I won a first woman over 50 award, the people cheering the most enthusiastically were some nearby Kenyan runners who finished in the top five. They actually had received their awards, so didn't even need to wait for the older age groups. Yet they stayed and cheered for the rest of us.
All depends--and I think those most secure about their running are less likely to look down on others.
But I also don't like the reverse snobbery that assumes that fast runners are elitist who do everything naturally and effortlessly while slower runners work harder to finish a race. It doesn't square with what I see at the interval workouts with my club. I know that the faster runners are pushing to the max and doing often twice the number of repeats that I am--and know that they earn their fast times.
This was an excellent summary. I found myself bitching about my 32:59 10k last weekend to a slower runner. I was truly annoyed about my performance and couldn't hold it in. He probably thought I was a jerk. Oh well.
Message:
The frustration is with the public perception of running as a sport rather than with slow runners. At a company soft ball game, if you dropped three fly balls and threw one away letting a runner score, no one would pat you on the back and say great job but an equivalent performance in running is applauded and even celebrated. Participation means more than achievement in running and that sucks.
I agree and that does suck. Although, at the soft ball game they would prolly joke about how bad you are because it doesn't really matter since it's not a "real" game. That could be the equivalent of the "just finish" attitude for running.
On the other hand, I think RW should be highlighting the accomplished runners and how hard what they do is to the slow, plodding masses.
Some people think finishing a 28:00 5k is the same as racing a 28:00 10k and that is wrong.
The negativity you both feel is a fear that others don't appreciate or see you as true athletes. If anything the first example shows most people feel anybody can go out and play softball and that its more of an accomplishment to run a race. That should be a source of pride.But really your feelings are misguided. Would Derek Jeter feel frustrated if some weak softball players are praised. No he is too secure. Would an elite runner feel frustrated that some one who just finishes a race is praised? No, they too are too secure. So why does it bother you?Think deeply on this.
themanontherun wrote:
deeper thoughts wrote:The frustration is with the public perception of running as a sport rather than with slow runners. At a company soft ball game, if you dropped three fly balls and threw one away letting a runner score, no one would pat you on the back and say great job but an equivalent performance in running is applauded and even celebrated. Participation means more than achievement in running and that sucks.
This kind of sums it up nicely. I have no hate for anyone, but it does kind of annoy me how effort is lauded over performance. If two people put in the same time, and one runs 15:00 and the other runs 15:05, the former will be applauded. But if the 15:00 puts in 10 hours per week and someone else puts in 3 hours per week to run 25 minutes, but is fat, they get an article about changing their lives... which they are, and that's great, but how about a little perspective. They time the races for a reason.
wanna know wrote:
people who are slow, hobby-joggers, people who run for fun, etc. People who aren't trying to win races or who don't care too much about times. Why the disdain for this type of runner?
I think much of the hatred is not so much towards the slower runners themselves, but towards those that cater to them like Runners World, the Penguin, Galloway, TnT, RnR races, or marathon maniacs. I mean, is there another sport or area of life where someone can make a decent living being the worst at something like the Penguin does, and being satisfied with that without making any reasonable effort to improve?
Derek Jeter probably wouldn't feel bad about rec. softball players getting praise. He would probably be a little upset if the day after he led the Yankees to a World Series title, the front page on every newspaper was about some guy in the Yankees' triple A program who got called up to the roster, and even though he didn't end up playing and contributing to the win, was a real trooper just for being there.