I saw his post-USAs interview where he said in training, he's more of a 4/8 guy than an 8/15/16 guy.
He also said he went from a 100 or 150-meter kick to now feeling confident holding that speed for 200.
It's likely he gets at least slightly bigger and stronger.
His best open 400 is 46.3, and that was at the high school level when he was at 1:45 for the 800.
Even if he can go under 46 now, which doesn't seem crazy, I doubt he would have made the Worlds team this year in the open 400. But his ability in the 400 at 16 isn't so far away from his 800 ability to dismiss all possibility that it could at some point catch up.
What do you think very long-term? In six, seven, eight years from now, is there a world in which he becomes better at the 400 than the 800?
Note: His 46.3 was run out of lane 8 just an hour after his 1:47, in what I would describe as a hot and humid day. I don't think he ran any 400s in competition after that. I think he has the ability to excel in both events if he really wants to, but obviously he has exceeded everyone's expectations in the 800 - probably including himself. People need to keep reminding themselves he is just 16. I have been around him, and contrary to many of the posts, he does not look like someone in their 20s, he looks like a 16 year old teen - and is remarkable polite and respectful to everyone around him.
most of the analysis here, is typical of normal elite runners.
this is not a normal situation.
of course you do not throw the fundamentals by the wayside without cause.
given that this lad has run 46 low at a time he was in 145 shape and not so far away from his 15th birthday, and has
saying he might be capable of 45.9 isn't much of a stretch. is in fact very weak.
jeremy warriner ran 46.7 at age 17 and 45.6 age 18, and 44.0 age 20. and peaked at the peak years per natural development curve. rather the doper profile where you are average and jump in a year or so to goat times. aka blatant Katir, which everyone singled out right away.
that said, it would be unprecedented for an athlete to run 43 and have a decent mile in them. so we don't go there.
and it would be unprecedented for a probable 45 high guy at age 16 to NOT develop to 45 flat, or 44 high.
it seems bicarb and other hacks have thrown the calcs out of wack. by a second per lap.
anyway, it's unprecidented.
and as a 400 / 800 guy self stated, we shall see a real effort put into the 4 at some point, so there is reliable data.
in the past, of course, guys would seldom run the shorter distance, and if they did, it was in a training block, or for speed work, rather than a concerted specialized training / peaking effort. in these cases you had 1500 guys listed at 400m 48 high to 49 low that were easily 1.5 seconds faster, like Cram who said he could barely break 49. of course total rubbish, when you run a 52 plus a 50, and it's not even an optimal trip.
Only way he's "better" at the 400m is if he can go about 43.5 right now... I'm going to guess there is no chance that's the case. He's obviously an 800 man, thank goodness he didn't get pigeon-holed into a life of a 400m runner because America doesn't need another 44 second guy, we need what he's got in the 800m.
I saw his post-USAs interview where he said in training, he's more of a 4/8 guy than an 8/15/16 guy.
He also said he went from a 100 or 150-meter kick to now feeling confident holding that speed for 200.
It's likely he gets at least slightly bigger and stronger.
His best open 400 is 46.3, and that was at the high school level when he was at 1:45 for the 800.
Even if he can go under 46 now, which doesn't seem crazy, I doubt he would have made the Worlds team this year in the open 400. But his ability in the 400 at 16 isn't so far away from his 800 ability to dismiss all possibility that it could at some point catch up.
What do you think very long-term? In six, seven, eight years from now, is there a world in which he becomes better at the 400 than the 800?
I listened to the Citius Podcast interviews with Cooper and his coach. He runs 30 miles a week and his longest run ever is 8 miles.
Unless he is German Fernandez and can’t do mileage, he is going to be very competitive from 800 to 10,000.
I saw his post-USAs interview where he said in training, he's more of a 4/8 guy than an 8/15/16 guy.
He also said he went from a 100 or 150-meter kick to now feeling confident holding that speed for 200.
It's likely he gets at least slightly bigger and stronger.
His best open 400 is 46.3, and that was at the high school level when he was at 1:45 for the 800.
Even if he can go under 46 now, which doesn't seem crazy, I doubt he would have made the Worlds team this year in the open 400. But his ability in the 400 at 16 isn't so far away from his 800 ability to dismiss all possibility that it could at some point catch up.
What do you think very long-term? In six, seven, eight years from now, is there a world in which he becomes better at the 400 than the 800?
I listened to the Citius Podcast interviews with Cooper and his coach. He runs 30 miles a week and his longest run ever is 8 miles.
Unless he is German Fernandez and can’t do mileage, he is going to be very competitive from 800 to 10,000.
This thread isn’t about Cooper Teare and you left out the steeple.
He is tied for the 18th fastest 800 all-time. The 18th fastest 400 is 43.81. Even if he ran sub 46 now he is far away from 43.81. Even if you think he improves to that it, assumes he does not improve in the 800.
This post was edited 2 minutes after it was posted.
Is it insane to think Cooper Lutkenhaus' best event could be the 400?
Yes, it is insane.
This is a guy who just ran 1:42.27, and he is only getting started as an elite; he would need to be 43.8 or faster over the 400 to compare with that. He isn't. Not remotely.
If he had the speed for his 400 potential to be greater than his 800 potential, it would already be apparent. EVERY runner gets found out as to their speed pretty early on, and EVERY runner ends up in the longest/slowest events where they find success. ALWAYS.
There are not "secretly fast" people who run the 800 and discover their sprinting ability later on. Actual sprinting baseline talent is inborn, not something you train into like jogging 100mpw until you can run a decent marathon.
This is why high school 400m and 800m runners go up in distance, MUCH more often then they go down to become 200/400 sprinters.
Yes it is insane for one reason and one reason only...................................................HE IS WORLD FU**ING CLASS IN THE 800m!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! He does not need to move to a completely different event. If he somehow runs 43 something before he graduates high school then we can all come back here and talk about it then.
I would say he can run 45 low right now. 800m runners are either distance oriented or speed oriented. He is speed oriented. Nobody is running 1:42 off 46.3 and 4:05 mile. More likely here are his stats: 1500 3:40 400 45.0 . In his 46.3 race he paced poorly by being in the outside lane and was catching up to the leaders the last 120m.
I don't think it's impossible for him to.run close to the 400m WR in future.What I know for sure is that he will be first man sub 1:40 if he comes down to sub 45 at 400m.
I saw his post-USAs interview where he said in training, he's more of a 4/8 guy than an 8/15/16 guy.
He also said he went from a 100 or 150-meter kick to now feeling confident holding that speed for 200.
It's likely he gets at least slightly bigger and stronger.
His best open 400 is 46.3, and that was at the high school level when he was at 1:45 for the 800.
Even if he can go under 46 now, which doesn't seem crazy, I doubt he would have made the Worlds team this year in the open 400. But his ability in the 400 at 16 isn't so far away from his 800 ability to dismiss all possibility that it could at some point catch up.
What do you think very long-term? In six, seven, eight years from now, is there a world in which he becomes better at the 400 than the 800?
this kid is better than Webb. God knows his ceiling in the mile it could be 3:39. it's also easier to move up in distance than other way. mile gonna be a jog fest for him.
No. He ran a 4:06 mile. This is not done by 400m specialists. He has the ability to eventually run 45.2 or so. This wouldn’t make him a 400m runner. He is an 800m runner.
I saw his post-USAs interview where he said in training, he's more of a 4/8 guy than an 8/15/16 guy.
He also said he went from a 100 or 150-meter kick to now feeling confident holding that speed for 200.
It's likely he gets at least slightly bigger and stronger.
His best open 400 is 46.3, and that was at the high school level when he was at 1:45 for the 800.
Even if he can go under 46 now, which doesn't seem crazy, I doubt he would have made the Worlds team this year in the open 400. But his ability in the 400 at 16 isn't so far away from his 800 ability to dismiss all possibility that it could at some point catch up.
What do you think very long-term? In six, seven, eight years from now, is there a world in which he becomes better at the 400 than the 800?
I dont think so. He wouldnt have the short sprint speed to be a truly brilliant 400 runner.
The kid already looks like he’s in his 20s. Everyone needs to pump the breaks and just let him run. He cares about racing. He trains to race and to win. Even if this 1:42 is the fastest he ever runs, he’s got the attitude to always rise to the challenge and the potential for many medals. I doubt he’ll be interested in time trialing for many years to come.
While fun, all this speculating about times doesn’t have much point.