Yeah man, Hocker’s ability to change his rate of acceleration is really good. He lost momentum after being cut off by Jakob, but revved it back up in such a short distance. It was beautiful.
Rate of acceleration? What is that - the rate of change of the rate of change of speed? Pretty sure that's not a thing
Rate of acceleration does exist! I’m a physics savant and I know best.
Increasing acceleration is rate of change of acceleration and increasing rate of change of acceleration is the rate of rate of change of acceleration!
However we normally stop at 2 as it’s good enough to describe motion in space and time!!
I can hardly wait to see how Jakob claps back on Hobbs:
'I will take him seriously when he wins any medal in any outdoor championship, whether Olympics or worlds. Or a Diamond League. Or even wins his own national meet.'
Has Hobbs ever won ANY major race, other than the one-mile at the "World Road Running Championships"? 😆 (A "world record" that an 800m man Wanyoni easily smashed by two seconds the next year, in his first and only run at the distance.)
No. Hobbs has not done any of these things. This guy, who has never won a major race, is talking crap about a multiple 1500m/5000m WC/OG winner's kicking ability. Remarkable.
Has anyone found an example of Hobbs actually winning a major race, ever?
Yeah man, Hocker’s ability to change his rate of acceleration is really good. He lost momentum after being cut off by Jakob, but revved it back up in such a short distance. It was beautiful.
Rate of acceleration? What is that - the rate of change of the rate of change of speed? Pretty sure that's not a thing
In physics, the fourth, fifth and sixth derivatives of position are defined as derivatives of the position vector with respect to time – with the first, second, and third derivatives being velocity, acceleration, and jerk, re...
you are correct. Kessler is an idiot, the same as Kerr would be to say this. The difference is that Kessler isn't really at a level where this is worth responding to. But I will anyway.
Funny thing is, despite leading the whole race and being at a tremendous disadvantage for it, Jakob still had a faster final 400 than Kessler. He had a faster final 300. He had a faster final 200. He had a faster final 100.
If you watch the interview, Kessler says as much. I think even in the intro to the interview one of the clips that plays is him saying "They put 2 seconds on me in the final 150m" but he was saying how this year it's going to be different.
I agree with the person that said Jakob's last 400m kick is as good as or better as anyone's. It's the last ~100m acceleration that he's lacking in (compared to the other top 5 guys in the world), but as Hobbs said, most of the time he's far enough ahead that it doesn't matter. With that said, I think Hocker has something special in the last 120m that no one else has, and that's what won him the Olympics, and that's what'll make him incredibly hard to beat going forward.
If you watch the interview, Kessler says as much. I think even in the intro to the interview one of the clips that plays is him saying "They put 2 seconds on me in the final 150m" but he was saying how this year it's going to be different.
I agree with the person that said Jakob's last 400m kick is as good as or better as anyone's. It's the last ~100m acceleration that he's lacking in (compared to the other top 5 guys in the world), but as Hobbs said, most of the time he's far enough ahead that it doesn't matter. With that said, I think Hocker has something special in the last 120m that no one else has, and that's what won him the Olympics, and that's what'll make him incredibly hard to beat going forward.
No one??
Geordie Beamish can out sprint Hocker in a atraight up foot race at sprint distance.
He closed his final 200 of indoor mile WCs over Hocker and Kessler in 25.xx with a 12.xx final 100. And he did it from 8th place out to win. Absolutely blistering the field.
...of course that wasn't anywhere close to 3:27.xx pace but if there is an actual faster runner in max speed and acceleration it's Beamish. Hocker probably reluctantly knows this.
BTW, Kessler is still a kid and the words he speaks are without malice, but from his own observation and reenforced by talking with his fellow competitors. He shouldn't be labeled as an idiot or other nonsense. Jakob literally is slower than everyone else in a 100, 200, 400 and 800...and probably not until 1200 can he surpass all others. He's simply able to run consecutive 55s and 54s better than anyone. ...but he's not going to hit 12s or 25s at the end of any race. Kessler could've explained himself further but he's a kid...and really, most people understand what he's saying. The only offended ones are know schlobbin Jakob worshippers on LRC
If you watch the interview, Kessler says as much. I think even in the intro to the interview one of the clips that plays is him saying "They put 2 seconds on me in the final 150m" but he was saying how this year it's going to be different.
I agree with the person that said Jakob's last 400m kick is as good as or better as anyone's. It's the last ~100m acceleration that he's lacking in (compared to the other top 5 guys in the world), but as Hobbs said, most of the time he's far enough ahead that it doesn't matter. With that said, I think Hocker has something special in the last 120m that no one else has, and that's what won him the Olympics, and that's what'll make him incredibly hard to beat going forward.
No one??
Geordie Beamish can out sprint Hocker in a atraight up foot race at sprint distance.
He closed his final 200 of indoor mile WCs over Hocker and Kessler in 25.xx with a 12.xx final 100. And he did it from 8th place out to win. Absolutely blistering the field.
...of course that wasn't anywhere close to 3:27.xx pace but if there is an actual faster runner in max speed and acceleration it's Beamish. Hocker probably reluctantly knows this.
BTW, Kessler is still a kid and the words he speaks are without malice, but from his own observation and reenforced by talking with his fellow competitors. He shouldn't be labeled as an idiot or other nonsense. Jakob literally is slower than everyone else in a 100, 200, 400 and 800...and probably not until 1200 can he surpass all others. He's simply able to run consecutive 55s and 54s better than anyone. ...but he's not going to hit 12s or 25s at the end of any race. Kessler could've explained himself further but he's a kid...and really, most people understand what he's saying. The only offended ones are know schlobbin Jakob worshippers on LRC
LOL. Nobody takes you seriously my friend. You can’t even provide any data for your claims.
Here is Jakob, one day after a 3:43.73 mile. He ran 7:23.63 with get this, a 25.8 final 200m. Imagine how much faster he would have closed if the pace was slower than top 3 all time in the event. Yet here you are saying he can’t run 12’s or 25’s. So much for being a “schlobbin Jakob worshipper.”
you are correct. Kessler is an idiot, the same as Kerr would be to say this. The difference is that Kessler isn't really at a level where this is worth responding to. But I will anyway.
Funny thing is, despite leading the whole race and being at a tremendous disadvantage for it, Jakob still had a faster final 400 than Kessler. He had a faster final 300. He had a faster final 200. He had a faster final 100.
If you watch the interview, Kessler says as much. I think even in the intro to the interview one of the clips that plays is him saying "They put 2 seconds on me in the final 150m" but he was saying how this year it's going to be different.
I agree with the person that said Jakob's last 400m kick is as good as or better as anyone's. It's the last ~100m acceleration that he's lacking in (compared to the other top 5 guys in the world), but as Hobbs said, most of the time he's far enough ahead that it doesn't matter. With that said, I think Hocker has something special in the last 120m that no one else has, and that's what won him the Olympics, and that's what'll make him incredibly hard to beat going forward.
There is no proof of anything you said regarding Jakob in the final paragraph.
An admittedly vibes based assessment, but until he runs 1:43 or outkicks Hocker, Nuguse, and Kerr in a slower race, I'll stick by it. Maybe if he was running Millrose he could prove me wrong, but alas, he's dodging the competition.
An admittedly vibes based assessment, but until he runs 1:43 or outkicks Hocker, Nuguse, and Kerr in a slower race, I'll stick by it. Maybe if he was running Millrose he could prove me wrong, but alas, he's dodging the competition.
Many in this thread act as if Jakob races the way he does because he does not have a kick...it is very much not that. He wants to win in the best way possible which is running the fastest time and gapping his competitors. Outkicking someone by a few hundredths of a second is not as impressive as flat out gapping them by over 20 meters by making the others hurt the whole way. No other form of running is as excellent as that, especially in middle distance to distance running. I can see an argument for him not having the best acceleration/sprinter build, but that is almost insignificant in races that go faster than 3:40. It is usually who ran the best race (expended the least amount of energy, ran the least amount of distance, lowest lactate at the bell, strongest runner), that's what it comes down to.
I'm a big Hobbs fan, but I'm not sure I buy that his kick is any better than Jakob's. The narrative that Jakob can't close races well is way overblown.
Jakob does not have the acceleration that some of these guys have. He can kick OK if he wants to follow because of his supreme fitness, but his acceleration is not truly elite. These guys who race him know this.
everyone here is debating speed over final 400 but i dont think that's the real focus. I think we're talking the final 120 where it's all turnover and mechanics. In this, Jakob is probably not even top 7. But his ability to close over 5-400m is good enough that in most of his races the final 80m doesn't matter
I agree with this. When he's outkicked, it's in the last straight, and I don't see a final gear like a Hocker has. But flat out last 400, yeah, he is as fast or faster than anyone.
I'm a big Hobbs fan, but I'm not sure I buy that his kick is any better than Jakob's. The narrative that Jakob can't close races well is way overblown.
this. A 3:26 guy can almost certainly close a 3:34 in 51 seconds. Which he has done. Is that not a good kick?
A kick is relative to your peers. He constantly gets outkicked by his peers so therefore he does not have a good kick.
.....and how quickly we forget that he outkicked Timothy C. to win the 2020 (2021) Olympic 1500 meter title, which should settle the matter of being able to kick when it really matters once and for all (and not even getting into the 5000 meter subject matter), even if he's maybe not the kicking GOAT in the 1500
Has anyone found an example of Hobbs actually winning a major race, ever?
Anyone?
Anyone?
Mile world champ was a win, plus a world indoor bronze, Olympic 5th, and 1:43/3:29 pbs before the age of 22. Who in history has matched that resume before age 22? There are some, but there aren't many, and Id' bet they're all some of the greatest ever.
In the 2021 OG 1500 Jacob sat and kicked for the win over the #1 in the world at the time and ran away from the field. in a fast race.
other times he kicked in 25x last 200 in fast 3k,
let hobbs set the pace with the boys up to the straight, then do the math.
If Hobbes sets the pace, Jacob would probably be 5th or 6th. There is a reason why Jacob doesn’t let him set the pace. It is because Jacob knows he is getting rocked in anything but an all out time trial. He lucked out in 2021 where a couple other people wanted a time trial. And then got crushed the last 3 championship races.
jacob knows leading is idiotic. Why do you think he doesn’t do it in the 5000m. He knows he is just limited as a 1500m runner.
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