Grant Fisher/Shelby Houlihan disconnect?

I want to believe this is true. But what’s so difficult here is that how has an operation of doping that is so big and all encompassing not been blown up yet? Why is everyone so dang quiet about everything? Wouldn’t any disgruntled athlete figure out what’s going on and report it?

Most of the Nike athletes being doped have no idea this is happening. That certainly helps. Add to this a typical elite athlete's ago, that if they work hard and see incredible progress they figure it's because of their hard work, and it's unlikely any will have any reason to suspect something's amiss. Even Shelby when she tested +ive never considered the possibility that Nike could have been responsible, especially after their labs "tested" and ruled out her supplements.

Someone in or connected directly with Nike's labs would have to blow the whistle. Everyone working in or with has one signed a strict NDA. I would be surprised if someone with first hand knowledge risked their career/life to violate the NDA and blow the whistle, unless they secured considerable protection legal or otherwise.

But even after the bust, assuming a lot of Nike athletes were on these supplements, would they not then suspect something..?

Maybe they did but still don’t want to say anything about it? Idk, I guess if you turn a blind eye you can really fool yourseld

Bust? One athlete tested positive, appealed, but was banned. That's not a bust.

No, they wouldn't be suspicious at all, unless a bunch of them also tested positive at the same time, which is probably not going to happen.

Yawn

this is just how it is

Grant is cool

Shelby sucks

the end

There have been whistle-blowers and it never goes well for them. Think of Jose Conseco, Floyd Landis, Kara Goucher. We all dismiss them as bitter losers with an agenda when it gets too close to home.

These conspiracy theory idiots have no clue, no evidence - just pure conjecture. I am no corporate apologist and actually my job is in the field over corporate governance. I've seen the good, the bad and a lot of ugly.

The number of people that would have to be involved or aware of such a program is probably at least 30 or 40 people within and most importantly on the outside of Nike.... And it would go all the way to the top. Doctors, trainers, coaches, athletes, as well as brand managers, business unit managers all the way up to the C-Suite. That many people don't keep good secrets. And the amount of money that would make it worth it for some random doctor or trainer is probably more than they're actually paying Grant Fisher in the first place!!! Would 30 to 50 people risk their career for an extra $50k or $100k?? Maybe a few would but someone would crack.

Anyway - yes, you're right... it's a "wilful blindness" policy. Why would Nike (or people within Nike) risk so much of their brand image and spend Millions on cover-up and lawyers, when they can simply 'outsource' or 'down source' the doping to the athletes themselves??

Besides, recent history has revealed that 'grey area' doping can be nearly as effective anyway.

Anyway, nice try on your little conspiracy theory... at least it's entertaining.

Right, and Mary Cain just won her case against Nike... so much for your theory.

Definitely nowhere close to that many. It only needs to be known by less than a dozen relevant parties, not including whichever 3rd party lab they involve. And they can absolutely keep it a secret from most of the Nike executives.

Good last ditch effort there to plausibly shoot it down though, Nike employee. Might still want to look for a better job, though.

Basic contract law: a contract cannot contravene the law. Usually when an NDA is signed it's in conjunction with a settlement - e.g., in a sexual assault allegation. The accuser accepts a settlement that the case has been adequately adjudicated privately, and that the case is settled out of court. The NDA is just simply prohibiting (under the threat of financial penalty) the accuser from making public statements about the case - particularly public statements that contradict what they signed in the settlement.

Whereas, if there's a live unadjudicated accusation against Nike, the NDA can't prevent someone from being subpoenaed. Further, although the witness can plead the fifth, they are permitted to testify against Nike (despite the NDA) if they desire and are willing to cooperate.

So anyway, shut up about NDAs.

Right, so you're saying this is a bunch of rogue Nike employees then? And they conspire together to risk Nike's brand, risk their careers, for what??? What do they get out of it? Since they're acting rogue, clearly their salary and year-end bonus does not benefit from it if they're keeping it a secret from management.

So it's just a dozen rogue employees with an elaborate scheme to help an Olympic bronze medalist that probably less than 1% of America will even recognise on the street?

Also, the NBA, NFL, MLB etc., all have VERY lax anti-doping policies and are much more lucrative from a brand perspective. So why risk everything on a skinny 10,000m bronze medalist.

And again, why take that risk when they can just quietly suggest to the athlete that the 'go see that doctor' and 'do what they need to do'... That option is far less expensive, equally effective and gives Nike plausible deniability.

You're a dolt.

If you go back to the weeks before the 2021 Olympic trials - in the US and the YK and other places - you may recall that a number of Nike athletes in track and field suddenly reported vague injuries and announced that they wouldn’t be at the trials or their ‘Tokyo journey’ was ending to care for their body. Or whatever.

What those athletes had in common was likely that internal testing showed the presence of certain metabolites and to go forward was to risk joining Shelby on the podium of infamy.

no idea how this was handled at the corporate end but I’m sure it was interesting.

I just want to chime and say I'm shocked that 3 pages into another Shelby/doping thread we have yet to see armstronglivs or rekrunner.

Also how can Kara cry tears of joy for grant, and tears of rage for Galen? Is it a “mean girls” thing where Galen isn’t cool enough to know his place?

So not a single person is gonna mention the WADA lab giving examples of 2 over the counter nandrolone products that matched the exact carbon isotope signature in her sample?

Pretty likely she used these types of "nandro boost" supplements and hoped they wouldn't trigger a test.

Whereabouts is Yared in terms of this?

You guys have too much time on your hands.

So this is what I've been waiting for. An explanation, one explanation for what the heck might be going on. Because it was never just Shelby. I never believed the sport was clean of course, but there was a time when I thought (some) Americans were clean-er than others, and then all of a sudden, ushered in by Bowerman, we got faster and faster and unbelievably faster, and yet unlike in Kenya, no one, until Shelby, got caught.

They are so obviously cheating, but no one seems even worried about getting caught.

And no one seems willing to talk about it. Even after Shelby was caught, just radio silence and carrying on. No cries of lifetime bans, or calling her out for cheating, and also, no stop to what seemed like obvious consistent cheating from so many others.

Older athletes are setting american and world records...3:55 was the time to make the Olympic women's 1500 team...athletes are medaling that I never thought I'd see medal...massive PRs every year....it just never seems to stop. I have a hard time believing everyone is just injecting EPO, it has to be something more discreet. This explanation makes total sense.