USATF Indoors - Josh Thompson - DQ'd??

Rule suggestion for the losers in this thread:

if you’re rolled af, move to lane 5 and get out of the way of the boys who are racing.

classic hobby jogger energy from Brooks. They should just have their elites race in a ghost 15 to drive more couch-to-5k sales, because they’re going to get gapped anyways.

my dos pesos:

1) rarely do you see this call, but that doesn't mean it shouldn't be made.

2) while it may (and i disagree with anyone claiming 100% certainty of this, though i'd very unscientifically put it at 99%) have not impacted who would have won, it is a strong possibility it impacted 2nd/3rd, and that has to matter (in dollars, there is a $1500 difference between 2nd and 3rd). as a non-armchair critic, having run similar races, at that speed and at that point in the race it is near impossible to recover momentum, both physically and mentally (my defense for 99% above: most of the time it's easy for the athlete to think, "well, there goes the win," but occasionally the infraction may actually give energy to the person being cut in on, energy they may not have had if the person going by had done so legally).

my third peso: if i were the athlete, i would not have wanted my coach to call the protest, and i certainly wouldn't have asked him to (for the record, i was the beneficiary of a protest in '92, but did not ask for the protest). but if i were the coach, i would have called the protest, mainly because my job is to protect and defend my athlete (for the record, i'm glad my coach did in '92, though the situation was much different than this one)...

that's my story and i'm sticking to it,

cush

Answer one question, and that will put this to rest.

what would you be saying if Winn did not break stride to accommodate the infraction, and firmly planted his spike plate into Josh’s Achilles, ankle, or calf, and they both crashed to track?

can’t wait to hear a response.

He did cut in to lane 1 without giving him proper clearance. This was minor in comparison to many I've seen them not call, and the only thing that changed the outcome was the call.

Bernard Lagat was the worst at this.

It would be great if the call were made immediately, but practically speaking that can be hard unless you have lots of officials (at nationals there are a lot of them).

It is an age old argument and one that just occurred in the Super Bowl. Do you call an infraction or not? It seems even some of the people who think that it did not determine the outcome of the race accept that the rule was violated.

My take is to call the infraction, but to say it only matters if the outcome is changed is sort of bogus as well.

At least they didn't DQ the "wrong" guy. Salazar once got Bumbalough DQ'd after Ryan Hill impeded Rupp. It took USATF several months to confirm they misidentified the impeding runner. (And Hill shouldn't have been DQ'd either, because Rupp finished ahead of him anyway.)

DQ feels harsh, but it deserved some sort of penalty, he clearly broke Wynne's stride

It would be good if the rulebook allowed some way of reordering the results instead of complete DQ, similar to what I believe is done in cycling. For example he would be given 3rd place here.

Additionally on these marginal calls it would be good if the runner is allowed to keep their time if the infraction did not involve lane violations -- not that time mattered in this particular race, but it has in other cases, such as Eric Jenkins NCAA DQ in a fast race

Danny Mackey trying to keep his job perhaps?

very lame infraction that didn’t change the situation of his athlete nor change the inevitable outcome of the race.

If Thompson was obviously going to win, why did he cut off Wynne? Why the two orders, Colonel Jessup?

Thompson cut off Wynne because it was a competitive advantage.

That level (very minor) of cut off happens often in races.

If you want to watch a recent and much more blatant cut in look no further then to last years WC when Krop cut in (or down) on Grant Fisher who then barely maintained his balance.

Did Mackey really protest that? I was under the impression that the call was made on the field.

If it was made on the field, why did no one know on the broadcast that the race was under review? Was this done after NBC went off the air?

Thompsons IG post indicates there was a protest.

By that logic, at the start of the 2023 Worlds final, three runners should immediately just make sure they surround Jakob Ingebrigtsen. One get in front. One get on his side and one get behind him. There will be zero chance for him to get out and he won't win.

People have to make contact all the time in indoor track. If you are looking to take out the person next to because they come in without a stride and a half, then you'll plenty of options to fall down.

I'm not saying what Josh did was great. If he did it to someone equal to him in fitness, it would have been probematic. I'm just saying it had zero impact on the outcome of the race.

If Wynne had run like an idiot and had tried to draw a foul like you insinuate, then I'd think that was a somewhat just response that he's on the track getting a DNF. He wasn't going to win, so he's out. And Thompson is out for his tiny foul. That would be better than what happened.

So it's ok to cut someone off if you are sure they not equal to you in fitness? How sure? He had no need to cut in when he did rather than wait another 5-10 meters. He was going faster. Wynne had earned the better position on the rail. Thompson did not have the right to cut him off and disrupt his stride. This should be called more often imho.

You get cut off with 100 to go where you are going all out which is what basically happened here you lose several meters easy. You were at max speed, slowed, must get back up to speed. Good call and I wish they would enforce the rules more when certain cheats move out to lane 4+ trying to block as well. If this wasn't the final turn, the impact would be minor, but here it wasn't, in my opinion of course.