Editor's note on 7/2/2024- This old thread is getting a lot of clicks as lots of people are googling Nikki Hiltz after NBC published an article "Transgender runner Nikki Hiltz is headed to the Paris Olympics" on her making the Olympic team. The article should have noted that Hiltz's is biological female and not on testosterone as World Athletics forbids that. Hiltz does not have an unfair advantage over the other competitors.
Hitlz got a huge profile on CNN and this caught my eye.
“When the people that are calling the race misgender me and then they apologize, I can’t just be like, ‘Oh, no worries, it’s okay.’ Because it’s not,”
“I think there’s definitely been awkward moments with that. But, overall, the longer that I’m out and the more people that know my pronouns and use them, it has been really rewarding.”
Stop! Please. Just. Stop. Doesn't it seem ironic that everyone screams for more inclusion, yet as we try to be more inclusive, we must segment and separate everyone into smaller groups, thus accomplishing the exact opposite. I think I am going to 'identify' as a talking squirrel. Is there a race category for that....?
If I understand correctly, she was born a girl, but often thinks she is a boy? There is no question of unfairness to other women while competing -- it is just a question of pronouns.
I can accept that she feels the way she does, that her feelings are genuine, and can empathize with her psychological struggle to fit into a society that wants all things to be binary for society to feel comfortable.
As an educated native English speaker, it is awkward for me to use the plural pronouns for a singular person (although there are common instances where they are used that way). It makes me think she has multiple personalities, and it is up to society to help her feel better about that.
Grammatically, the neutral singular pronouns are it/its, which to me sounds worse.
Grammatically, the neutral singular pronouns are it/its, which to me sounds worse.
This has been pointed out and instantly deleted by the very people at LRC who claim to be sick and tired of all the wokeness. You are correct, that the correct term is "it." As has been pointed out, the word "it" has long been used to refer to human beings when gender is unknown. Every day babies are born and before knowing the gender, people ask, what is "it?" Parents don't seem offended for calling their baby an "it" then do they? When they announce what "it" is, they say, "it's" a boy and from then on, "it" becomes a he, or if "it's" a girl, "it" becomes a she. If it doesn't want to be either, it remains an it. "They" doesn't like the word "it" so they want everyone else to reinvent the English language to conform to their narcissism.
I've said I don't like using 'they' to refer to one person before, as it's confusing, it sounds like it refers to a group, and got downvoted to oblivion for saying that.
Hitlz got a huge profile on CNN and this caught my eye.
“When the people that are calling the race misgender me and then they apologize, I can’t just be like, ‘Oh, no worries, it’s okay.’ Because it’s not,”
“I think there’s definitely been awkward moments with that. But, overall, the longer that I’m out and the more people that know my pronouns and use them, it has been really rewarding.”
This is the epitome of narcissism. A person expects everyone else to contort the English language to use an awkward plural pronoun for one individual that doesn't conform perfectly to antiquated male/female stereotypes.
This makes English completely unworkable. Can you imagine if everyone was so woke that we all had to memorize an infinite number of pronouns to everyone's choosing? Xem/Xyr, Ver/Vis etc. This is madness. Nikki is obviously a female with a lot of "masculine" characteristics. Who cares? Women can be masculine. Men can be feminine. Everything in between. She's still a female no matter how feels...as if there was one particular way to feel like a female anyway.
This is the epitome of narcissism. A person expects everyone else to contort the English language to use an awkward plural pronoun for one individual that doesn't conform perfectly to antiquated male/female stereotypes.
This makes English completely unworkable.
I agree this will take it while, but I'm quite sure the singular they will stay with us. Plus, that's nothing new of course, and goes back over 600 years, see wiki:
This use of singular they had emerged by the 14th century,[3] about a century after the plural they. It has been commonly employed in everyday English ever since and has gained currency in official contexts. Singular they has been criticised since the mid-18th century by prescriptive commentators who consider it an error.[4] Its continued use in modern standard English has become more common and formally accepted with the move toward gender-neutral language.[5][6] Though some early-21st-century style guides described it as colloquial and less appropriate in formal writing,[7][8] by 2020 most style guides accepted the singular they as a personal pronoun.[9][10][11][12][excessive citations]
This doesn't make "English completely unworkable", rather we go back to the roots. Why the uproar?
Any Republican politician out there needs to double down on trans issues. Don't be fooled by the corporate media or the fake election results. What the people are really concerned about are the tiny handful of trans and nonbinary athletes out there. They are a real threat to our democracy. Every waking hour for every Republican should be spent on making the 2024 election about trans issues. Our children will come home covered in cat litter if we do not do something. This issue is a proven winner for Republicans. Keep at it. Doin' a heckuva job, Republies.
Dude...You just lost the House....you call that a victory?...lol
I've said I don't like using 'they' to refer to one person before, as it's confusing, it sounds like it refers to a group, and got downvoted to oblivion for saying that.
I know, when I got IT band syndrome, my woke doctor said it was because my lateral quad band was angry at being objectified with a neuter pronoun.
Politics aside, isn't this an example of how gender identity distinctions can coexist with equal advantage in sports? Hiltz doesn't identify as female but doesn't have a physical advantage over women, right?
You could say this to anyone complaining about anything that isn't climate change, war, or some other huge global problem. Like I know your car broke down, but is it lost on you that this is nowhere near as pressing as slowing CO2 emissions? It seems beyond selfish that you would care about your car at times like these.
Nah, that's not true. When your car breaks down, CNN doesn't cover it...and you don't get offended when people don't address your transportation issue as you want them to. Big difference.
Right, it’s only selfish because CNN covered it. Amazing argument. How could I be so silly to not recognize this important distinction?
I think it's a safe assumption that most Non-binary activists are also liberal. Is it lost on them that there are other social issues far more pressing than "pronouns?" It seems BEYOND selfish.
This is a learning experience for me but the one thing I can't accept is non-binary. You can be a woman who feels masculine (aka a tomboy) or a man who feels feminine, or you can use this label to describe yourself, but to expect everyone else to bend over backwards for that label strikes me as ridiculous. Especially because people can get fired in liberal atmospheres for doing it.
Just because a certain generation has claimed it's a thing doesn't mean it's a thing: We need a certain number of categories for gender for practical purposes, like your driver's licence or the census or voting statistics or sports or whatever. Hiltz is proof of that because she's racing int he women's division. .
If I understand correctly, she was born a girl, but often thinks she is a boy?
Here is her quote
"Hi I’m Nikki and I’m transgender. That means I don’t identify with the gender I was assigned at birth. The word I use currently to describe my gender is non-binary. The best way I can explain my gender is as fluid. Sometimes I wake up feeling like a powerful queen and other days I wake up feeling as if I’m just a guy being a dude, and other times I identify outside of the gender binary entirely".
So some days she wakes up and she feels like a "powerful queen" other days like a guy being dude.
Can't we just admit to ourselves she is delusional or dishonest.
A girl identifies as a boy...okay, I accept that happens.
But this fluidity nonsense. Does it really exist? If it does, is it not just mental illness?
And this expectation/demand that we know her pronouns?
Are those fluid as well? Do they change depending on what she wakes up feeling that day?
Nikki Hiltz's outdoor mile PR is a 4:17. I think the only valid opinions in this thread are by LetsRun posters who are faster then Nikki. I'm tired of people who self-identify as "fast runners" some days but race slow AF on other days.
She's a biologic woman, racing in the women's category and is mad that people are calling her by "she." I don't think it's the commentators who are the ones in the wrong here.
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