Lots of talk about the start. No you don’t have to run 28 to be in the front the first 200. Just slow down and move up. What are they going to do in a real race when they are not the fastest in the field? There is no reason to go out that hard, just relax and be confident enough to move around after 400. That is a learning moment, but not if your only thought is blaming the field.
One HUGE opportunity missed by Newbury Park tonight. Last year they were the first team ever to put 4 under 9:00 in the same race. Tonight they could've put 5 and fell a little short. I don't know what happened to Leo Young, but I know he will rebound.
According to Lex in an interview, he was very sick for a few days before this race. Maybe he caught whatever Lex had a couple weeks ago, it’s hard for one person in a household to get sick without spreading it to the rest of the family.
Well there you go then and from how he was reacting in the race I was wondering if he might be sick. The kid is sick and still runs 9:02. Not bad at all.
The 3x1200 @3200 (1min) and then 3x400m @1600 (3 min) was way too hard. That looked like an nearly impossible workout, and it was probably a harder effort than many of their races. Bronsan pushed way too hard.
3x1200 @3200 with 1 minute rest is INSANE and unnecessary. even if you want to run that pace for 1200 meters, why not give at least 1:1 rest. which would still be an INSANE workout.
i respect brosnan and love what he has done with these kids. but that doesn't mean everything he does is right.
You know what though....how can you say that? You have to try workouts before you now. And just because it does not work out the first time an athlete does a workout does not mean he/she will not adapt the next time. I know what is insane....them kicking everyones' arses and then people judge their workouts because Colin Sahlman does not run 8:27 and Leo Young is sick. Sam McDowell ran AWESOME! Big PR for Dev Doshi! In that tough pace Appleford still PRs. Are we going to say 8:35 sucked for Lex Young? Or 8:48 was turrible for Aaron Sahlman? Make me understand, because I would say it's working, because if we are to compare NP to the field (every other team in the country) and history.....it's NP.
How many sub-1:49 / sub-8:50 guys are there in history?
Colin Sahlman
Aaron Sahlman
Alan Webb
Drew Hunter
Jim Ryun
Ryan didn’t break 9 for 3200 or 2 miles in high school. I think your list is complete minus him. I found an old thread talking about sub 1:50/9:00 and the list was just Webb and Jim Spivey until recently with Ches, Craig Engels and a few others doing it. Andres arroyo is the next closest I can think of. 1:47/8:51
Ryun could have easily broken 8:40 in HS and possibly 8:30. Did anyone run a 3200 during the 20th century?
Lots of talk about the start. No you don’t have to run 28 to be in the front the first 200. Just slow down and move up. What are they going to do in a real race when they are not the fastest in the field? There is no reason to go out that hard, just relax and be confident enough to move around after 400. That is a learning moment, but not if your only thought is blaming the field.
Kids going out to hard at any invites and especially Arcadia is nothing new. Just watch their splits and 100m for any race. Not many girls can handle a :15 the first 100 of any distance race. When I've taken athletes there I would more often than not say just jump in the back and you still went out to hard. The field will come back to you. But that 3200 field last night had LOTS of kids on the same ability level trying to occupy the same spcae and they came to give NP their best shot and boy did they. Great race, but Rich Gonzalez wants lots of kids breaking 9 in the same race, yet he wants fast times. I would like to see that race rerun with maybe only 16 kids and perhaps this will alter his way of thinking. We've seen what NP can do at these small Sundown track races with few people in them and what happened last night.
It retrospect German's double becomes even more impressive. It wasn't set up as fast race in great conditions. It was just the state meet and the weather is typically hot. He just went out and ran 4:00 and 8:34 by himself.
It is not ideal either way, but if your choice is going out in 28 or having to move through traffic you choose to move through traffic. Would a smaller field with a pacer be better? Sure, but that is not the race they lined up for yesterday.
They did great but there's no excuse to open a 3200 going with near sub 4 mile pace. The national record is easily there just don't fly to close to the sun.
Agreed. This thing was over after 550 meters for the 4 of them. Leo paid the hardest as he took over pacing after 300 and kept pushing over the next 200. the fact that the other 3 held on for such respectable times shows how much faster they were capable of running. it’s a shame. coach needs to shoulder some of blame here. That much lactic, that early on, is a heavy burden to carry for 6.5 more laps.
It is not ideal either way, but if your choice is going out in 28 or having to move through traffic you choose to move through traffic. Would a smaller field with a pacer be better? Sure, but that is not the race they lined up for yesterday.
I just rewatched the start, NP had control of the front by 100m. It wasn’t even necessary to go nearly as hard as they did the first 100. There is just no reason for a 28 and 60. That was just bad pacing.
Lots of talk about the start. No you don’t have to run 28 to be in the front the first 200. Just slow down and move up. What are they going to do in a real race when they are not the fastest in the field? There is no reason to go out that hard, just relax and be confident enough to move around after 400. That is a learning moment, but not if your only thought is blaming the field.
^^^^^THIS!! Thank you for not being stupid like many others here.
It retrospect German's double becomes even more impressive. It wasn't set up as fast race in great conditions. It was just the state meet and the weather is typically hot. He just went out and ran 4:00 and 8:34 by himself.
And he was only 17
I agree with this fully. German's the man! The state meet break between events is rather short in the CA masters state meet. But it was neither hot or windy that day. Christine Babcock ran 4:36 that day and set the NF High School Record and Jordan Hasay punched it out with Lauren Chetalat and ran 9:52 to 9:53 in the 3200m. All of these times were much bigger deals back then than they are today. But conditions did not hinder German that day. That state meet was also at Cerritos and not in Fresno.
There has to be a point where they are past their peak, and have to have a break before re-establishing aerobic base.
That’s what it looks like to me. They have been going hard all year. They are still doing crazy hard anaerobic workouts (risking injury…).
The vast majority of athletes ran PRs at Arcadia (3200m). Not the NP runners.
Cantu ran 9:32. He ran 9:23 back in Feb.
Martinez was DNS (injured/sick?)
Doshi ran 9:02 (5s PR). He’s a soph (pretty standard to PR every time out when you are a soph)
Colin did not run a PR
Lex ran a 3200m PR, but that performance is inferior to his 3000m from Feb
Aaron ran a 3200m PR (but that was his first ever 3200m race), but that performance is also inferior to his 3000m from Feb
Appleford ran 8:52, which is a PR. However, he started training hard after everybody else since he was injured when school started.
Leo of course was sick and far from his PR
It feels like it’s time to shut it down. Just do maintenance work and race for a few more weeks. They are training hard (and risking a lot) to maintain (at best)
With crazy, fast depth, they really need to split these fields into two. Two “elite” heats of 16 kids. So two extra races for boys and girls. Yes, the meet will go a little later but not much later. Like 20 min. Big deal.
Only on Letsrun can a team run 8:34, 8:35, 8:48, 8:52, 9:02, 9:02 at a single meet and get told by no-names that they need to shut down the season because they arent pr'ing in 10 consecutive meets.
It retrospect German's double becomes even more impressive. It wasn't set up as fast race in great conditions. It was just the state meet and the weather is typically hot. He just went out and ran 4:00 and 8:34 by himself.
And he was only 17
I think he was perhaps the most talented prep ever, which he reinforced w his 3:55 and 13:25 as a college frosh. Too bad he couldn’t avoid injury. Yes, Webb ran that ridiculous mile at Prefontaine in a pro field, but German was younger for his grade. 4:00 & 8:34 solo in not optimal conditions is ridiculous. Pre-super shoes too.
Only on Letsrun can a team run 8:34, 8:35, 8:48, 8:52, 9:02, 9:02 at a single meet and get told by no-names that they need to shut down the season because they arent pr'ing in 10 consecutive meets.
It was a big disappointment when they and their coach talked about 4 breaking 8:30. While still impressive to the rest of us mortals, it is definitely a performance that should be concerning. Appleford ran well, but the rest were significantly off their game.
Only on Letsrun can a team run 8:34, 8:35, 8:48, 8:52, 9:02, 9:02 at a single meet and get told by no-names that they need to shut down the season because they arent pr'ing in 10 consecutive meets.
I was only pointing out the obvious. They had an amazing year. Who knows, they may have a couple of good races in them also. Just lay off the hard intervals. It’s done.
Let’s compare them to others:
Bergen (8:44) 13s PB
Caudillo (8:45) 6s PB
Puffer (8:46) 3s PB
Maiorano (8:46) 5s PB
Sgouros (8:47) 14s PB…
These guys are starting their season…
NP has been red lining it for a while.
As I said, NP had an amazing year. Why ruin/risk it? Is it that important to go sub 4 as a junior? Is that the end game?
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