Good morning! How are all you LRC stable geniuses doing this fine am?
Good morning! How are all you LRC stable geniuses doing this fine am?
Kavanaugh will be confirmed. So suck on that, you hillary loving pieces of trash.
I'm going on record here to say that what the dems are doing on Kav is wrong and counterproductive. The Dems are winning. Don't mess it up with carnival scenes and crfazy demonstrations. Do your jobs well and show that gov't is good.
On Fox all they are showing are crazy angry, really ugly Dems screaming and protesting. It's an image of chaos and disorder. Fox can now run that for 8 weeks, rather than the news.
Remember, Trump thinks Southerners are stupid, lazy and talk funny.
Fat hurts wrote:
Flagpole wrote:
An unconventional President ends with unconventional means. I say that's above board if lawyers and all involved say it is. Perhaps they will say they not, but I don't think we can say that just yet.
So you are saying that it's OK to subvert the constitution as long as it gets rid of Trump?
Surely you don't mean that. Legitimacy in government is paramount.
You are oddly focused on this one topic. Not every scenario is crystal clear in the Constitution which is why things are challenged and tested frequently. If it is determined to be unconstitutional, then of course I wouldn't want that to happen, and then I would expect they wouldn't allow it to happen.
We will see what happens. I have not drawn a line in the sand on this. I have said and will say again, if it benefits Trump in some way to resign rather than be convicted by the Senate, then I think he will do that. Now for some new stuff...Even if there isn't a great benefit to him, I think that if the Senate comes to him like they did with Nixon and tells him that they have the votes to convict to remove, I think he will get the same advice from his legal team and that he will resign...if for no other reason than to hope that he is treated with kid gloves by Mueller and/or Pence. I will be surprised in that scenario if he goes kicking and screaming and makes the Senate vote him out.
agip wrote:
I'm going on record here to say that what the dems are doing on Kav is wrong and counterproductive. The Dems are winning. Don't mess it up with carnival scenes and crfazy demonstrations. Do your jobs well and show that gov't is good.
On Fox all they are showing are crazy angry, really ugly Dems screaming and protesting. It's an image of chaos and disorder. Fox can now run that for 8 weeks, rather than the news.
Remember, Trump thinks Southerners are stupid, lazy and talk funny.
Remember, Hillary thinks all blacks are super predators.
Flagpole wrote:
Fat hurts wrote:
So you are saying that it's OK to subvert the constitution as long as it gets rid of Trump?
Surely you don't mean that. Legitimacy in government is paramount.
You are oddly focused on this one topic. Not every scenario is crystal clear in the Constitution which is why things are challenged and tested frequently. If it is determined to be unconstitutional, then of course I wouldn't want that to happen, and then I would expect they wouldn't allow it to happen.
We will see what happens. I have not drawn a line in the sand on this. I have said and will say again, if it benefits Trump in some way to resign rather than be convicted by the Senate, then I think he will do that. Now for some new stuff...Even if there isn't a great benefit to him, I think that if the Senate comes to him like they did with Nixon and tells him that they have the votes to convict to remove, I think he will get the same advice from his legal team and that he will resign...if for no other reason than to hope that he is treated with kid gloves by Mueller and/or Pence. I will be surprised in that scenario if he goes kicking and screaming and makes the Senate vote him out.
You're just odd, in general.
1100 wrote:
Clintonettes are NOT Americans! They are RACISTS!
True!
Sad Epic wrote:
Down goes the establishment wrote:
That is indeed quite scary. We had actual collusion between one campaign and foreign officials, paid for through a commercial research company (GPS Fusion), funneled through a law firm (Perkins Coie). The unverified allegations were then used to start spying on the other campaign. If the preferred candidate wins, then nothing comes out. If the preferred candidate loses, then the unverified allegations would then be used to start a collusion hoax that puts a cloud over the undesired candidate's image and could possibly result in impeachment proceedings.
The preferred candidate lost. But the execution was terrible, and now the jig is up.
Clinton and Trump should both face consequences for their crimes.
Either Bernie Sanders or Rand Paul should become the next President.
This statement alone is as honest as it gets. Too bad the lying liberals can't see that:( Clinton was a HUGE crook and for seemingly educated people to not admit that shows their bias and true agenda...only their side counts.
Fat hurts wrote:
L L wrote:
A Trump resignation avoids a Senate trial and conviction and any testimony or evidence that comes out of that.
Of course Pence will pardon Trump of any indictments/ convictions related to anything in office. Exactly what Ford did for Nixon.
Trump’s doesn’t need to make any deal with the Senate or DOJ at all.
You are correct in that there is no deal to be made with the Senate. I don't know where anyone gets the idea that Trump could begin to make a deal like that.
I still think Trump will not resign. It's not in his character to do that.
As for Pence pardoning Trump, I think the odds are that he won't grant that pardon. It is widely believed that Ford's pardon of Nixon cost him the election against Carter.
Pence believes that God intends for him to be His president. Pence will not do anything to subvert God's will.
1) A deal would not be made with the Senate. A deal would be made with lawyers and/or Mueller about whether or not they indict him after he is out of office. When making a deal with lawyers for reduced prison time or no prison time, anything is up for discussion.
2) Pence would pardon Trump IF he also has been involved in some shady dealings this whole time that haven't come to light just yet. A stewing Trump in prison would surely let everyone know what Pence knew if Pence didn't pardon him in that case.
3) If Trump resigns or is booted from office, Pence will be President then. Did Pence say God intends for him to be ELECTED President? I'm not challenging you on that. I actually do not know.
non Flagpole wrote:
Throw all 4 of them in a room together and combined you'd be lucky to get the equivalent of one normal brain!!!! 4 years of their lives, wasted on this thread, dying to be heard and agreed with to stroke their fragile egos. Embarrassed for them!
That's ridiculous. People who want to be heard create a blog or start a YouTube channel. Message boards are for discussion.
This particular topic is the most interesting political US topic in my lifetime and one of the most interesting topics of any sort in my lifetime. Not only interesting but incredibly important. We have a criminal in the White House who is threatening American democracy. If that's not worth discussing, then I don't know what is.
Flagpole wrote:
We will see what happens. I have not drawn a line in the sand on this. I have said and will say again, if it benefits Trump in some way to resign rather than be convicted by the Senate, then I think he will do that. Now for some new stuff...Even if there isn't a great benefit to him, I think that if the Senate comes to him like they did with Nixon and tells him that they have the votes to convict to remove, I think he will get the same advice from his legal team and that he will resign...if for no other reason than to hope that he is treated with kid gloves by Mueller and/or Pence. I will be surprised in that scenario if he goes kicking and screaming and makes the Senate vote him out.
You and I simply disagree on that. We read Trump's psyche differently. I don't think Trump will do what most of us would do.
If Trump goes down fighting then he still keeps a base of support. If he resigns, then like Nixon, nobody will love him.
Down goes the establishment wrote:
Sad Epic wrote:
Clinton and Trump should both face consequences for their crimes.
Either Bernie Sanders or Rand Paul should become the next President.
This statement alone is as honest as it gets. Too bad the lying liberals can't see that:( Clinton was a HUGE crook and for seemingly educated people to not admit that shows their bias and true agenda...only their side counts.
She was investigated and found NOT to be a crook. If you believe something hasn't been investigated that needs to be, go hire and lawyer and start the process. Do you not believe in the rule of law and jurisprudence? I agree that if she committed crimes she needs to be held accountable, but we haven't seen any evidence of that yet. You saying she did doesn't make it so.
Fat hurts wrote:
L L wrote:
A Trump resignation avoids a Senate trial and conviction and any testimony or evidence that comes out of that.
Of course Pence will pardon Trump of any indictments/ convictions related to anything in office. Exactly what Ford did for Nixon.
Trump’s doesn’t need to make any deal with the Senate or DOJ at all.
You are correct in that there is no deal to be made with the Senate. I don't know where anyone gets the idea that Trump could begin to make a deal like that.
I still think Trump will not resign. It's not in his character to do that.
As for Pence pardoning Trump, I think the odds are that he won't grant that pardon. It is widely believed that Ford's pardon of Nixon cost him the election against Carter.
Pence believes that God intends for him to be His president. Pence will not do anything to subvert God's will.
It would be hilarious if Pence steps down expecting a Pence pardon and Pence doesn't grant a pardon.
But I disagree that the odds are against a Pence pardon.
Refusal to pardon Trump would mean he loses Trump's base. Then he'd have a tiny base and no still moderate support to try to be elected.
The other choice of not looking for a Pence pardon would be to risk losing re-election to a Democrat and then facing charges later.
He's not going to get a pardon from a Democrat president.
Down goes the establishment wrote:
Sad Epic wrote:
Clinton and Trump should both face consequences for their crimes.
Either Bernie Sanders or Rand Paul should become the next President.
This statement alone is as honest as it gets. Too bad the lying liberals can't see that:( Clinton was a HUGE crook and for seemingly educated people to not admit that shows their bias and true agenda...only their side counts.
You are too sweeping with your lying liberal claims. Clinton was not popular. Many non-Republican anti-Trump people are also not keen on her. Some didn't vote and others voted for her, but not in the Primary. The case against Clinton does not absolve Trump.
agip wrote:
I'm going on record here to say that what the dems are doing on Kav is wrong and counterproductive. The Dems are winning. Don't mess it up with carnival scenes and crfazy demonstrations. Do your jobs well and show that gov't is good.
On Fox all they are showing are crazy angry, really ugly Dems screaming and protesting. It's an image of chaos and disorder. Fox can now run that for 8 weeks, rather than the news.
Remember, Trump thinks Southerners are stupid, lazy and talk funny.
We know Kavanaugh will be confirmed. At least it's very likely.
What the Democrats are trying to do now is shed a light on the kind of Justices that this Senate makeup will confirm.
If there is no resistance, then the public doesn't learn what a partisan hack Kavanaugh is.
They are trying to motivate their base to change the Senate in November so no more Justices like this can be confirmed.
Fox is always going to find red meat to make their viewers dislike Democrats.
Most of the media is displaying a Republican party that is withholding documents and nominating and an extreme conservative.
There are women in red states that are concerned about how this could affect them.
Fat hurts wrote:
Flagpole wrote:
We will see what happens. I have not drawn a line in the sand on this. I have said and will say again, if it benefits Trump in some way to resign rather than be convicted by the Senate, then I think he will do that. Now for some new stuff...Even if there isn't a great benefit to him, I think that if the Senate comes to him like they did with Nixon and tells him that they have the votes to convict to remove, I think he will get the same advice from his legal team and that he will resign...if for no other reason than to hope that he is treated with kid gloves by Mueller and/or Pence. I will be surprised in that scenario if he goes kicking and screaming and makes the Senate vote him out.
You and I simply disagree on that. We read Trump's psyche differently. I don't think Trump will do what most of us would do.
If Trump goes down fighting then he still keeps a base of support. If he resigns, then like Nixon, nobody will love him.
Fair enough. However Trump is removed from office, as long as it is legal, I am all for it. If we get to the point that he is sitting at his desk in the oval office and they (police? military?) have to come in and remove him to his refusal, I hope there is video of that, not just for my own enjoyment, but as a deterrent for other like-minded individuals.
L L wrote:
agip wrote:
I'm going on record here to say that what the dems are doing on Kav is wrong and counterproductive. The Dems are winning. Don't mess it up with carnival scenes and crfazy demonstrations. Do your jobs well and show that gov't is good.
On Fox all they are showing are crazy angry, really ugly Dems screaming and protesting. It's an image of chaos and disorder. Fox can now run that for 8 weeks, rather than the news.
Remember, Trump thinks Southerners are stupid, lazy and talk funny.
We know Kavanaugh will be confirmed. At least it's very likely.
What the Democrats are trying to do now is shed a light on the kind of Justices that this Senate makeup will confirm.
If there is no resistance, then the public doesn't learn what a partisan hack Kavanaugh is.
They are trying to motivate their base to change the Senate in November so no more Justices like this can be confirmed.
Fox is always going to find red meat to make their viewers dislike Democrats.
Most of the media is displaying a Republican party that is withholding documents and nominating and an extreme conservative.
There are women in red states that are concerned about how this could affect them.
yeah I know all that..it's crazy statements from Pelosi: “Once again, the President is using his nomination as a destructive tool on a generation of progress for workers, women, LGBTQ Americans, communities of color and families, and to radically reverse the course of American justice and democracy."
and the insane accusations of white supremacist hand signals and the crazy protesters...it's like dems are fulfulling the caracature of them as easily triggered and quick to riot.
True that fox viewers will never vote Dem so that's a non event.
I just think the dems need to hold themselves up as the only party that can govern, and make that contrast to the awful republicans.
agip wrote:
I'm going on record here to say that what the dems are doing on Kav is wrong and counterproductive. The Dems are winning. Don't mess it up with carnival scenes and crazy demonstrations. Do your jobs well and show that gov't is good.
They don't have many options and Kavanaugh will be confirmed one way or the other.
All they have is to continue to remind the electorate that the Senate majority Republicans, representing a minority of the voters and who refused to consider Merrick Garland just two years ago, are rushing to push through a judge nominated by a president representing a minority of the voters. They need to remind the electorate that this is a judge who was essentially picked to support corporate interests over the general populace for decades to come. They need to keep this in the news cycle to remind the electorate that democracy is being subverted.
They need to continue to remind the people that we got here because more crazy angry conservatives showed up to vote in 2016 than did crazy angry liberals. They need to remind the people that democracy works only if the public is fully engaged.
Flagpole wrote:
Fat hurts wrote:
You are correct in that there is no deal to be made with the Senate. I don't know where anyone gets the idea that Trump could begin to make a deal like that.
I still think Trump will not resign. It's not in his character to do that.
As for Pence pardoning Trump, I think the odds are that he won't grant that pardon. It is widely believed that Ford's pardon of Nixon cost him the election against Carter.
Pence believes that God intends for him to be His president. Pence will not do anything to subvert God's will.
1) A deal would not be made with the Senate. A deal would be made with lawyers and/or Mueller about whether or not they indict him after he is out of office. When making a deal with lawyers for reduced prison time or no prison time, anything is up for discussion.
2) Pence would pardon Trump IF he also has been involved in some shady dealings this whole time that haven't come to light just yet. A stewing Trump in prison would surely let everyone know what Pence knew if Pence didn't pardon him in that case.
3) If Trump resigns or is booted from office, Pence will be President then. Did Pence say God intends for him to be ELECTED President? I'm not challenging you on that. I actually do not know.
1) Correct. No deal with the Senate. As for a deal with Mueller and DOJ, it would have to be no more than a gentleman's agreement. I don't believe it is possible (or legal) to draft a plea deal that includes presidential resignation. Would Trump go for a non-binding gentleman's agreement? I'm skeptical that he would trust Mueller enough do it or if it would even be a wise thing to do.
2) Yes, if a pardon of Trump helps keep Pence out of trouble then obviously, he would do it. Otherwise, it's politically risky.
3) I don't know exactly what Pence thinks about that. I do believe that Pence sees himself as America's Moses. Right now, he's waiting in Midian until it is time to come and lead God's children to the promised land.
Fat hurts wrote:
. . .
3) I don't know exactly what Pence thinks about that. I do believe that Pence sees himself as America's Moses. Right now, he's waiting in Midian until it is time to come and lead God's children to the promised land.
Thank God for Christianity!