Rojo understands the good old "if it's too good to be true".
Really? So how then do you explain his staunch unyielding support of an also banned runner who claimed to eat a burrito? because one is black female and one a white female?
Popped for a masking agent and provisionally suspended.
The AIU wrote:
The Athletics Integrity Unit (AIU) has provisionally suspended marathon world record-holder, Ruth Chepng'etich, for the Presence and Use of Hydrochlorothiazide (HCTZ) relating to a sample collected from her on 14 March this year. A Notice of Charge has been issued against Chepng'etich regarding the detection of the Prohibited Substance – a diuretic – following an investigation into the Kenyan athlete’s positive test which was reported to the AIU on 3 April this year, at an estimated concentration of 3800 ng/mL in urine.
Will the members of the Kenyan Parliament apologize to yours truly?
And I didn't even say she was on drugs. All I did was ask her what would she say to the people who thinks she's on drugs?
I had a dream last night that it was Faith Kipyegon who got dinged instead. Then everyone piled on Nike for the sub4 event when they certainly knew about the positive test.
i am often down on rojo, but this time he has nailed it.
Secondly, why is everyone assuming the fact that the drug is both a diuretic and a masking agent are related? The two items may be completely unrelated.
But if it is genuinely just a flushing agent, she must have been told she was getting tested and was very desperate. How many missed whereabouts was she on?
Turdly, do diuretics really work in this situation? Surely if wada or whoever believes something is a diuretic, then wouldn't there simply be a procedure to lower the threshold?
NXN individual is hard. Something about it just equalizes the field in some ways. Maybe the new course changes that.
Nico was obviously predictable. Since than, none of the three winners (Sahlman, Jourdon, Vause) have won their regional meet the same year. Only Jourdon won his state meet. It was also all three of their first races at NXN.
It also doesn't appear to get any easier the second time. Simmons was 2nd as a junior, 13th as a senior. Grevious moved from 12th to 11th. Putz from 5th to 28th. Middaugh from 6th and than essentially stopped running.
With that all being considered, I'm taking Nauman. I think he's far and away the best athlete in the field
I used to agree with it - this instance has turned me. This performance was so stupid and obvious when it happened and we all had to uncomfortably just sit on it because speaking up was "racist" and "sexist" and "typical white person oppressor behavior" - every smokescreen croc of sh-t possible, and now we are here.
The reason why "testing out the wazoo" isn't enough anymore is because of two things
1) cheats will always be ahead of the testers and this dynamic has not changed since doping was created
2) it doesn't change the culture of doping and wanting to cheat in Kenya.
"Testing out the wazoo" catches the ramshackle dopers - it catches the desperate athletes buying EPO from tinted window pickup trucks in the carpark of Nairobi shopping malls. It doesn't catch those operating with advanced stuff from scumbag European coaches and agents (most of them Italian for some reason). Yes they got her this time but I will tell you how they (the AIU) got her - after that performance she would have been on the watchlist and they would have had an informant or someone monitoring her close enough to know when to jump and test her. Game of cat and mouse and back to the most important point - they have to really want to get you and it's not cheap to do it or utilized en masse.
Change the culture. And if that means clean athletes suffer (just like some did in Russia) and need to find a different avenue to compete (just like some did in Russia), then that's what needs to happen. The nation needs to fix itself from the inside now because just bandaiding with a high volume of testing simply doesn't work. As evidenced by this.
I think this is a valid take. I wonder if another measure is to simply make agents pay heavily. Imagine if Rosa now paid a massive fine that financially ramped up targeted testing of his best athletes. Think he might take closer order of his athletes then?
Because the response from the agents (like Rosa) is quite simple and kind of impossible to logically debunk:
"How can we be personally responsible for what the athletes are taking?" (shrug shoulders)
And this is the crappy loop-hole that is unfortunately kind of valid. Now full disclosure, do I think that is the case with Rosa et al? No. I think he knows, I think he is part of the conspiracy. But until there is hard proof of that (which would get him tossed from WA's accredited agent list anyway) there is almost no basis to even fine him.
The coaches are far closer on a day to day basis than even the agents are, and honestly, I think many athletes cheat without direct knowledge from their coaches. Say for example you wanted to experiment with a nandrolone/testosterone precursor supplement ready available online which entailed taking two capsules in the morning, two at night - how would a coach know that? So how would an agent know that?
Don't get me wrong, I'm certainly not defending this blight (Rosa) - but I guess I'm trying to reason why despite all these busts with his athletes he's still out there functioning and I think it all starts with the "we can't control...." narrative which I bet you has come out of his mouth word for word many times before.
The only solution now to is to cut off his "supply" - the athletes. Kenya has to go, and they can start a "team" like they did with the Russians to enable certain criteria athletes to continue. It is very drastic but it's so out of control (and I've been told by AIU informants even worse than the biggest skeptics think it is) it just has to be done.
Surprised no one has mentioned this, but massive props to the AIU. So many of these organizations are too scared to drag down their stars, especially one who has brought so much publicity to the sport. Kudos!
Financial motivation is poweful, but plenty cheat for glory.
Chepngetich was on the top of the likely list before this because 2:09 was such an outlier time for her and history. Kipchoge or Jakob may be doping, but what they've done or are doing fits with what they've always done. With slow incremental improvements mostly in line with super shoes and evidence of crazy talent in their teens. Kipyegon is the same. Hassan, well maybe not so much I'm afraid.
Dropping your time by 5 min at age 30? It was just a matter of time until it all fell apart it seems.
Not defending her, but her 2:09 was not so much an outlier based on her history.
Her history indicates that she was a very successful and accomplished runner that had never failed a drug test before running 2:09 in Chicago. She had won 8 prior marathons, including the World Championship marathon. She had a more recent history of going out very hard and fast in marathons (sub world record pace) but then fading.
In addition, she had run 15 half marathons. This included setting a world record in the half marathon of 1:04:02 in 2021. She won 8 of the half marathons she ran and broke 1:07 six times.
Both her marathon and half marathon times indicate a general progression/trend of faster and faster times.
Again not defending her, but Chepngetich did not come out of nowhere and she generally lowered her half and full marathon times as she became more experienced.
It seems likely that she was targeting world records in both those distances as she went on and it took her a few attempts to get there. Note how she ran the four Chicago Marathons in 2021-2024 below which indicated that she was likely targeting the world record in those races. Her splits during the 2024 races were not much of an outlier based on her approach to the three prior years.
Every world record can be viewed as an outlier to a certain extent.
Her major race history:
2018 won Istanbul Marathon in 2:18
2022 2nd Paris Marathon 2:22
2019 won Dubai Marathon in 2:17:08
2019 won World Championship Marathon in 2:32. This was in Doha and run in incredibly hot and humid conditions
2020 third in London Marathon in 2:22
2021 won Istanbul Half Marathon in new world record time of 1:04:02. She had run 15 half marathons in the 5 years before this. She won 7 of those other half marathons and her times indicated a normal progression of improvement until she ran 1:04. She broke 1:07 six times.
2021 won Chicago Marathon in 2:22, but she did so by going out really fast (67 min at half marathon) before fading.
2022 won Nagoya Women only Marathon in 2:22. Ran negative splits.
2022 won Chicago Marathon in 2:14:18. This was a personal best by 2:50 and only 14 seconds slower than the world record. She went out incredibly fast and well under world record pace (49:49 at 10 miles, 65 at the half) before slowing.
2023 won Nagoya Women only Marathon in 2:18
2023 2nd in Chicago Marathon in 2:15:37. She again started incredibly fast (31:05 at 10k, 65 at the half) before slowing and being passed by eventual winner Sifan Hassan.
2024 won Chicago Marathon in 2:09:56 a personal best by 4:22. She started faster ( 30:14 at 10k and 64 at the half) and slowed less.
Thats insane: "She's not a doper because she's so fast". Reminds me of Froome doing an ergo test with massive watts to prove he can ride massive watts. wtf?
Popped for a masking agent and provisionally suspended.
The AIU wrote:
The Athletics Integrity Unit (AIU) has provisionally suspended marathon world record-holder, Ruth Chepng'etich, for the Presence and Use of Hydrochlorothiazide (HCTZ) relating to a sample collected from her on 14 March this year. A Notice of Charge has been issued against Chepng'etich regarding the detection of the Prohibited Substance – a diuretic – following an investigation into the Kenyan athlete’s positive test which was reported to the AIU on 3 April this year, at an estimated concentration of 3800 ng/mL in urine.
Will the members of the Kenyan Parliament apologize to yours truly?
And I didn't even say she was on drugs. All I did was ask her what would she say to the people who thinks she's on drugs?
It sounds like it would cause a marathoner substantial problems?
One of the most commonly used medications in America because as you get older and have hypertension it's utilized to essentially make you pee a lot. Would you take it just for the heck of it? probably not, almost all of my patients hate taking HCTZ because you're in the bathroom all the time.
Ok, that's true, but she's an athletics pariah, you agree, right? Just pointing out that Bonds remains royalty. Not only in SF. They had video messages from Maddux and Peavy, etc saying that Bonds was the goat as far as they are concerned. Just pointing out the double standard and lauding most serious track and field people as being less accepting of cheating.
It's bizarre. I usually abhor cheats, but I finally caught up and watched the Wimbledon final and found myself even rooting for Jannik Sinner despite his very recent 3 month ban for clostebol, as I rooted for Alcaraz during Roland Garros (and luckily got to watch him live).
In other major sports like baseball and football, most fans just don't care at all. I'm a rabid fan of an NFL team, and people don't understand why someone isn't in the Hall of Fame (even though the play is well deserved), and I think, "duh... the dude got caught red handed doping," but they don't think that's anywhere close to a valid reason to keep him out.
I think this is a valid take. I wonder if another measure is to simply make agents pay heavily. Imagine if Rosa now paid a massive fine that financially ramped up targeted testing of his best athletes. Think he might take closer order of his athletes then?
Because the response from the agents (like Rosa) is quite simple and kind of impossible to logically debunk:
"How can we be personally responsible for what the athletes are taking?" (shrug shoulders)
And this is the crappy loop-hole that is unfortunately kind of valid. Now full disclosure, do I think that is the case with Rosa et al? No. I think he knows, I think he is part of the conspiracy. But until there is hard proof of that (which would get him tossed from WA's accredited agent list anyway) there is almost no basis to even fine him.
The coaches are far closer on a day to day basis than even the agents are, and honestly, I think many athletes cheat without direct knowledge from their coaches. Say for example you wanted to experiment with a nandrolone/testosterone precursor supplement ready available online which entailed taking two capsules in the morning, two at night - how would a coach know that? So how would an agent know that?
Don't get me wrong, I'm certainly not defending this blight (Rosa) - but I guess I'm trying to reason why despite all these busts with his athletes he's still out there functioning and I think it all starts with the "we can't control...." narrative which I bet you has come out of his mouth word for word many times before.
The only solution now to is to cut off his "supply" - the athletes. Kenya has to go, and they can start a "team" like they did with the Russians to enable certain criteria athletes to continue. It is very drastic but it's so out of control (and I've been told by AIU informants even worse than the biggest skeptics think it is) it just has to be done.
The rules should be modified so that Chepngetich is offered a deal. 2 year ban if she cooperates fully and exposes any and all elements of a cheating conspiracy. So, provision of bank records, emails, texts, prescriptions, etc etc. The investigators will determine if her cooperation has been fulsome and transparent. Otherwise, lifetime ban. Any others implicated by her, get a 4 year ban or lifetime ban based on their degree of culpability. If they come forward before the investigation identifies them, same deal 2 yr ban if they cooperate.
This post was edited 3 minutes after it was posted.
Good riddance!!! I personally am NOT a fan of the people who accuse everyone of doping, or say the sport isn’t fun anymore before everyone’s doping. But even I knew Ruth’s 2:09 HAD to be drug-induced. Especially after her sub par race that followed (not even being able to run a HM in her marathon world record time).
As for her marathon WR standing, something HAS to be done about that as well! No [clean] woman will EVER break that!!! It might stand as long or longer than the current womens 100-800m record have…..
an idea for people who fail drug tests could be to have all their results an equal amount of time as the suspension time, before the suspension took place, be erased. So if Ruth is being suspended for 2 years starting March 2025, all her results from March 2023 till 2025 are erased. That way people serving short bans for stimulants only have their results erased for a short period of time. Just an idea!
"No [clean] woman will EVER break that!!!"? I don't quite see the point. Ruth ran 2:09:56 last year. So what if she got caught now? There will be other dopers sooner or later breaking that WR. Same as with all the other world records.
Maybe those others will be smarter, and lay low after their WR...
For the records, this was the THIRD Kenyan world record holder banned in 2025!