Amby Burfoot says it out loud - Chepngetich is doping

I guess that would include Amby Burfoot: "For the record, I didn't write that Chepngetich is/was doping." What kind of mush for brains can't understand that?

WITH blood-doping, too many things still don't add up.

Wouldn't the men's marathon also be similarly impacted by "2005 (better Epo test) or 2009 (ABP)"? Their times dropped significantly between 2006-2016, when things "got harder", and then again from 2017-today, when things got even harder still.

The high variability in blood values is confounded by inconsistent standards in blood collection, before increased standardization in 2007, and again in 2009. This is well documented.

If we consider that highly talented high responders should run sub-2:20 (~1 minute faster than Ingrid Kristiensen in 1985, and within 4m35s of Paula's record), we find:

By 2005, in your "free-for-all blood doping era", only 6 women had run sub-2:20. Three of them were Japanese (~0% blood doping suspicion). The second fastest was Ndereba's 2:18:47, only 2m19s faster than Ingrid Kristiensen.

This is not very many candidates for high responders in the "free-for-all" blood doping era.

Then, when things "got harder", by 2016, 14 more women had run sub-2:20, including 5 Kenyans, 5 Ethiopians, and 4 non-Africans.

Then, when things got even harder still, with the creation of the AIU, and increased East African testing, an eventual creation of a local lab, we started seeing 2:17s, 2:14s, 2:13s, 2:11s, and now a sub-2:10. Since 2017, Buzenesh Deba's 2:19:59 slipped from 29th fastest performance in 2016, to 166th fastest performance.

Thanks HRE.

By cherry-picking and isolating one sentence you misrepresent what he is saying in his article, you fail to understand the piece in its entirety and you of course ignore the example I quoted where he makes his views plain where he says he knows she is doping. But you simply show that combination of mental incompetence and denial of what is actually stated that is your unvarying method here.

I do have some idea what he knows, because he told us: 1) the "truth" about Rosie Ruiz, and 2) the tautological "we know what we know".

From his newsletter, no one really has any idea what he "knows" about Chepngetich. What I do know is that he "didn't write that Chepngetich is/was doping" and that he "doesn't have a clue" -- because he said so directly.

He also said what he "feels" and what he "thinks", which is not the same as what he "knows".

His newsletter, and this thread, is really all about what he said he "thinks" and "feels", or as you correctly put it earlier, what he "believes".

That wasn't cherry-picking, but that was Amby himself fact-checking the title of the thread.

The newsletter did not say "he knows she is doping", as you suggest.

I see that "marathonhandbook" put a link to a companion piece:

"Here’s Why Ruth Chepngetich’s World Record Is Completely Plausible: A Data-Driven Analysis"

marathonhandbook.com

Here’s Why Ruth Chepngetich’s World Record Is Completely Plausible: A Data-Driven Analysis

@marathonHB

While the Kenyan has come under scrutiny and speculation, a look at the research suggests otherwise.

Open link

"Knows" is a poor choice of words here but it's commonly used as Amby does, i.e., to express a very strong belief. A better thing to have written would have been to say something like "absolutely convinced." I'm a bit surprised someone with his editing experience made this mistake.

That's a very informative article. Thank you for posting it.
Shame our antipodean friend will refuse to read it and educate himself.

I read it earlier. Can't say it was really compelling but probably worth a look.

Ha! It was my attempt to be generous!

Burfoot improved 4.6% over a 2 year period from 1970 to 1972 in Manchester. He's being a hypocritical jackass by claiming, without proof, that the 1.3 sigma (3.3%) improvement from Chepngetich warrants skepticism.

There, I'm no longer being generous.

Honestly, do you really not think Chepngech's performance warrants skepticism? I'm not saying it warrants outright accusation. But if you had to bet your house, if you have one, on her performance being clean would you do it?

I wasn't referring to Amby Burfoot. I was referring to the meltdown this message board had after every Paris distance event where a white person didn't finish in the medals. And Norway is a country of proven dopers. England is a country of proven dopers. The US is infamously a proven doper country. It's funny how this sport can go from being glorious and finally clean one night to complete bs the next depending on how spanked the top white runners get.

Please tell us you think she actually won this race?

Who? Rosie Ruiz? No, I don't think so.

"From his newsletter, no one really has any idea what he "knows" about Chepngetich."

You're the only one who has no idea.This thread isn't a f*cking 'whodunnit'. There is no enigma in what Burfoot is actually saying. He is saying he "knows" - a simple word that has the infinite capacity to confuse you - but it essentially means here he is convinced she is doping, without presuming that he can prove it. That's it. Your doping denial even extends to trying to say Burfoot isn't saying Chepngetich is doping, when he is saying nothing else. The thread is utterly meaningless if he isn't. But that's what you reduce all argument to. Always. Meaningless garbage.

I read it. Only you and rekrunner have no idea what he is saying.