My quest for sub 1:50 in the 800m

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1 year ago 04/02/2024 2:40am EDT

re: ThatAverageRunner

ThatAverageRunner wrote:
Bumping this thread for fun. I'm back! (on letsrun).
I have been running to some degree the last few years. I have certainly had ups and downs with life / training balance and motivation, but have gotten some stuff more on track the last 6 months and am healthier and more motivated than I have been in a while.
Ran 2 indoor track races off of pretty chill training (~50mpw + some threshold workouts and semi consistent lifting) this winter. Mile in 4:30 (2:18 / 2:12 splits) and a 5k in 15:55 in which I went out a little quick and didn't have my best day, but is still my 2nd best 5k ever and fastest in like 6 years.
I have signed up for my first marathon recently, which will be in early October. I'm not fully transitioning to slow road races, though. I plan to give Mile-5k PRs a go again in track after my marathon, and barring injury, I am pretty confident I'll be able to crush some PRs. I'm not too worried about my speed, I have more than enough to run sub 4:20 in the mile and have been lifting well lately, and plan to lift most of the marathon block as well.
I am doing the marathon for a couple of reasons:
1) I know that it'll get me to train more consistently and with an aerobic focus, and I know that will get me in great shape at shorter events based on my physiology.
2) It's more exciting to give something new a try.
3) I have some friends in my running group who are marathoners and would like to get my name in the hat haha
4) I think I can do better than some people think. I have been practicing fueling on long runs and some longer workouts already for recovery purposes, and think that is an area I can really excel at compared to some of my peers in the marathon. That and the lifting aspect.
My goal for the marathon is going to be conservative. I would rather leave minutes on the table and finish strong than go for broke my first time out and blow up / run tens of minutes slower than I'm capable. I will refine my goal closer to the race, but for now we're just going to aim for 2:45-2:50.
Recent training: I ran that 15:55 5k 2 months ago and have been slowly building mileage since, with a focus on keeping the HR under control and being consistent with lifting, not too worried about workouts for now, but I have done a few threshold / tempo workouts. The last 4 weeks have been: 61, 60, 62, 66 miles, with the first 3 of those weeks being done in 6 days of running (1 day off). This is probably my biggest 4 week block in years tbh. I am taking a down week of 45-50 miles this week then aiming to build slowly to low 70s and am going to try to maintain that for a bit while I build the long run and focus on consistency. I'll get more specific with workouts 3 months out, but am most concerned with building mileage and the long run currently.
My rough weekly plan will look like:
Sunday - Long Run
Monday - Active recovery, most likely bike ride (no running)
Tuesday - AM short run + Lift
- PM Workout
Wednesday - AM medium length easy run
- PM medium length easy run
Thursday - AM short double
- PM longer easy run
Friday - AM short run + Lift
- PM Workout
Saturday - Medium easy run
The schedule might change slightly depending on life and weather, but this is my current ideal schedule. When I get more specific there will likely be a longer mid week run / workout instead of two workouts + long run, but we'll see as we go.

So much for a sub 1'50 runner.

1 year ago 04/02/2024 2:59am EDT

re: ThatAverageRunner

I didn't sense the willingness years ago to shred your Achilles chasing sub-1:50 800m. I am not surprised you threw in the towel. I would rather you post on Gaza Conflict, Russia v. Ukraine, Biden & Trump, etc.

Is this a thread about Centrowitz?

1 year ago 04/02/2024 9:12am EDT

re: mclovin96

mclovin96 wrote:
ThatAverageRunner wrote:
Bumping this thread for fun. I'm back! (on letsrun).
I have been running to some degree the last few years. I have certainly had ups and downs with life / training balance and motivation, but have gotten some stuff more on track the last 6 months and am healthier and more motivated than I have been in a while.
Ran 2 indoor track races off of pretty chill training (~50mpw + some threshold workouts and semi consistent lifting) this winter. Mile in 4:30 (2:18 / 2:12 splits) and a 5k in 15:55 in which I went out a little quick and didn't have my best day, but is still my 2nd best 5k ever and fastest in like 6 years.
I have signed up for my first marathon recently, which will be in early October. I'm not fully transitioning to slow road races, though. I plan to give Mile-5k PRs a go again in track after my marathon, and barring injury, I am pretty confident I'll be able to crush some PRs. I'm not too worried about my speed, I have more than enough to run sub 4:20 in the mile and have been lifting well lately, and plan to lift most of the marathon block as well.
I am doing the marathon for a couple of reasons:
1) I know that it'll get me to train more consistently and with an aerobic focus, and I know that will get me in great shape at shorter events based on my physiology.
2) It's more exciting to give something new a try.
3) I have some friends in my running group who are marathoners and would like to get my name in the hat haha
4) I think I can do better than some people think. I have been practicing fueling on long runs and some longer workouts already for recovery purposes, and think that is an area I can really excel at compared to some of my peers in the marathon. That and the lifting aspect.
My goal for the marathon is going to be conservative. I would rather leave minutes on the table and finish strong than go for broke my first time out and blow up / run tens of minutes slower than I'm capable. I will refine my goal closer to the race, but for now we're just going to aim for 2:45-2:50.
Recent training: I ran that 15:55 5k 2 months ago and have been slowly building mileage since, with a focus on keeping the HR under control and being consistent with lifting, not too worried about workouts for now, but I have done a few threshold / tempo workouts. The last 4 weeks have been: 61, 60, 62, 66 miles, with the first 3 of those weeks being done in 6 days of running (1 day off). This is probably my biggest 4 week block in years tbh. I am taking a down week of 45-50 miles this week then aiming to build slowly to low 70s and am going to try to maintain that for a bit while I build the long run and focus on consistency. I'll get more specific with workouts 3 months out, but am most concerned with building mileage and the long run currently.
My rough weekly plan will look like:
Sunday - Long Run
Monday - Active recovery, most likely bike ride (no running)
Tuesday - AM short run + Lift
- PM Workout
Wednesday - AM medium length easy run
- PM medium length easy run
Thursday - AM short double
- PM longer easy run
Friday - AM short run + Lift
- PM Workout
Saturday - Medium easy run
The schedule might change slightly depending on life and weather, but this is my current ideal schedule. When I get more specific there will likely be a longer mid week run / workout instead of two workouts + long run, but we'll see as we go.
So much for a sub 1'50 runner.

It was an already ambitious goal. I won't rule out giving the 800m another go at some point, and this 'marathon' block I'm doing won't be drastically different than the base phase I did the summer before I ran 1:52, but I'm also 30 with some nagging achilles issues (haglands I think), so I am just being realistic. I'd muhc rather knock down some of my PRs Mile-5k while it's still relastic to do so. I'm probably stronger now than I've ever been, so I don't really think it would take long to get some speed back. But grinding through the anaerobic work solo won't be fun. But if I can run mid 4:1Xs next winter, I may drop down during the outdoor season and see what I can throw down.

1 year ago 04/02/2024 9:16am EDT

re: mclovin96

mclovin96 wrote:
ThatAverageRunner wrote:
Bumping this thread for fun. I'm back! (on letsrun).
I have been running to some degree the last few years. I have certainly had ups and downs with life / training balance and motivation, but have gotten some stuff more on track the last 6 months and am healthier and more motivated than I have been in a while.
Ran 2 indoor track races off of pretty chill training (~50mpw + some threshold workouts and semi consistent lifting) this winter. Mile in 4:30 (2:18 / 2:12 splits) and a 5k in 15:55 in which I went out a little quick and didn't have my best day, but is still my 2nd best 5k ever and fastest in like 6 years.
I have signed up for my first marathon recently, which will be in early October. I'm not fully transitioning to slow road races, though. I plan to give Mile-5k PRs a go again in track after my marathon, and barring injury, I am pretty confident I'll be able to crush some PRs. I'm not too worried about my speed, I have more than enough to run sub 4:20 in the mile and have been lifting well lately, and plan to lift most of the marathon block as well.
I am doing the marathon for a couple of reasons:
1) I know that it'll get me to train more consistently and with an aerobic focus, and I know that will get me in great shape at shorter events based on my physiology.
2) It's more exciting to give something new a try.
3) I have some friends in my running group who are marathoners and would like to get my name in the hat haha
4) I think I can do better than some people think. I have been practicing fueling on long runs and some longer workouts already for recovery purposes, and think that is an area I can really excel at compared to some of my peers in the marathon. That and the lifting aspect.
My goal for the marathon is going to be conservative. I would rather leave minutes on the table and finish strong than go for broke my first time out and blow up / run tens of minutes slower than I'm capable. I will refine my goal closer to the race, but for now we're just going to aim for 2:45-2:50.
Recent training: I ran that 15:55 5k 2 months ago and have been slowly building mileage since, with a focus on keeping the HR under control and being consistent with lifting, not too worried about workouts for now, but I have done a few threshold / tempo workouts. The last 4 weeks have been: 61, 60, 62, 66 miles, with the first 3 of those weeks being done in 6 days of running (1 day off). This is probably my biggest 4 week block in years tbh. I am taking a down week of 45-50 miles this week then aiming to build slowly to low 70s and am going to try to maintain that for a bit while I build the long run and focus on consistency. I'll get more specific with workouts 3 months out, but am most concerned with building mileage and the long run currently.
My rough weekly plan will look like:
Sunday - Long Run
Monday - Active recovery, most likely bike ride (no running)
Tuesday - AM short run + Lift
- PM Workout
Wednesday - AM medium length easy run
- PM medium length easy run
Thursday - AM short double
- PM longer easy run
Friday - AM short run + Lift
- PM Workout
Saturday - Medium easy run
The schedule might change slightly depending on life and weather, but this is my current ideal schedule. When I get more specific there will likely be a longer mid week run / workout instead of two workouts + long run, but we'll see as we go.
So much for a sub 1'50 runner.

I've broken 1:54.3 exactly 1 time, and sub 1:56 exactly 4 times. It was already a long shot for a 18min and 5min high school 5k / miler. Might have been more doable had I not gotten achilles issues immediately upon graduating, but I wanted to keep the dream going. Like I said, I'm more motivated now than I have been since college, so I'm just excited to see how this plays out.

1 year ago 04/02/2024 12:26pm EDT

re: ThatAverageRunner

It seems like you’ve lifted pretty consistently throughout your career. Has it been mostly the same this whole time or has it changed? What do you do for your gym work?

1 year ago 04/06/2024 9:48am EDT

re: Flo’da boy

Flo’da boy wrote:
It seems like you’ve lifted pretty consistently throughout your career. Has it been mostly the same this whole time or has it changed? What do you do for your gym work?

I got into lifting with some of the football team my freshman year of high school and have lifted at least semi consitently since then. I've had periods of many months off, and i've never went all in on lifting, but I have learned a lot along the way, espeically the last few years.

I do a more traditional lifting plan than some distance runners might do. Currently it goes roughly like this:

1) Hang cleans (warm up up to doing 3-5 sets of 2-4 reps, decent weight but not straining)

2) Heavy compound lift ( warmup to 3-5 sets of 3-5 reps of back squat, front squat, hex bar DL or occasionally regular deadlift, box squats, heavy quarter squats, etc)

3) Upper body push (bench, incline bench, shoulder press, etc)

4) Single leg, usually targeting an 'opposite' muscle group to my heavy compound. For example, if I did front squat I'll often do single leg RDLs, or BG split squats or step ups.

5) Upper body pull (rows, pull ups, etc)

6) and depending on current goals and stuff I'll toss a machine upper and lower body lift in, such as leg extension, chest press, etc

I think the most important thing is to not overthink it too much. It's a compliment to running, not the end all be all. I make sure to focus and take my time with the explosive stuff (cleans) and the heavy compound lifts, and make sure to do them first, then I'll superset some of the upper and lower body stuff after just for times sake. I don't often go above 8 reps for anything except maybe a machine lift at the end. Proximity to failure matters much more than rep number. I'd rather lift relatively heavy for 3-6 reps than pump out 12-15 reps for the same general benefit. More reps at a lighter weight also usually means more fatigue, which you don't want if you're trying to run at a decently high level.

If I were going into a middle distance block or trying to get better at sprinting I'd periodize the lifting to go from what I have above to more explosive and plyometric type lifts as I go to help transfer the strength into functional speed/power. That might involve removing some of the upper body lifts, or just having a lifting day that is solely focused on plyos and cleans, jumps, etc.

I've tried to take a 'body building' type approach as a 'base phase' for lifting and found that I just carry too much fatigue to do so while running, so the (generally) heavier lifts and lower reps have helped a lot. Just make sure you warm up well up to a good working weight and don't skimp on rest between sets.

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