What is everyone's problem with the US Army runners being Kenyan?

The standard comes from an army regulation. Regulations are not laws, and each regulation has language allowing for an exception to that regulation. So if someone is close to the standard a waiver of such may be granted

The WCAP site does not support your supposition of flexible standards.

Direct copy from site:

"2. In furtherance of this mission, only Soldier-athletes who meet the criteria below will be considered for admittance into the program. Any athlete applying to the WCAP who fails to meet the criteria should expect to have their application denied. Furthermore, merely meeting the entry standard does not guarantee admittance into the program. The standards laid out are the minimum for consideration of a potential applicant."

So a non-Kenyan should not waste their time applying does the word "ONLY" be replaced with "Only Kenyan or"

Would think the Army would be more precise in its "regulations" to not discourage a non-Kenyan Olympic Trials qualifier from applying.

If I have a 2:15:01 marathon time I should expect my application to be rejected.

Seems like someone is making up their own rules in direct conflict with the intent of the WCAP guidelines.

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VAcoach wrote:

fogremover wrote:

1. They don't look American.

2. They speak Kenyan, not English.

1. The national language of Kenya is English

2. There is no such Language as Kenya (most runners speak swahili and kalenjin)

This is an excellent representative of the anti-Kenyan sentiment in the US...uninformed. It is because of these Kenyans that we are relevant. Americans have to compete with kenyans consistently earlier and earlier...in the college ranks and even from time to time in the HS ranks. Our standard is now much higher...UK runners have not shown the same level of improvement across the board in the past 20yrs like the US has...they do not face the same number of foreign challengers. So...we can have an "ethnically pure" Trials where our winner comes home in an irrelevant 13:55, or we can compete in the global "market"--so to speak--and develop competitive runners.

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- You mean like Matt Tegenkamp's "irrelevant" 13:54 5K OT victory in 2008?

- So why aren't you arguing for more WCAP "cowbell" from Ethiopia, Northern Africa? Let me guess, you would be against that for it pollutes the current WCAP Rift Valley Foreign Legion gene pool that's proved so successful to date. Sound ridiculous? Yes, definitely satire -- so Dr. --- Tell me how far do we take this WCAP Foreign Legion recruiting effort so that we can become "relevant" compared to talent walking away because the Army changes the goalposts every 4 years?

Amen!!

- You are flattering me .....

- He probably said "Why Bother?" & based on the deal the WCAP guys get in the US Army -- they said "Why not?"

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- Giggle! LoL!

"None of these runners were recruited for the WCAP program...they were recruited to be soldiers and if their times met the WCAP standard, then they were given the opportunity to represent the Army as an athlete."

- Old News ... already personally given Sgt Kibet props

"Elkanah Kibet served in a finance btn (enlisted I believe despite having a college degree in finance) while training for the marathon trials...only after did he qualify for the WCAP program."

- Yeah, screw judgment ... everything's binary: tell that to Cpt Pennington & crew kicking out 2:19s while in a line unit.

"The Army, like running, is as close to a meritocracy as it comes in this world. You meet a standard and you're good...you fail to meet the standard and you're not good."

- C'mooon Man .... that's the point -- he won't get the chance thanks to WCAP's Rift Valley Foreign Legion.

"How is he going to fare against Kamworwor and Karoki much less Farah (assuming the Kenyans can finish the race this time around)?"

- Really .... just train harder to beat the Kenyans? Please don't tell your athletes that just started running around 9th grade that if you JUST TRAIN HARDER one day you'll beat all these Kenyans. Have you lost your mind? Think how long it took Ritz, Ryan, Galen, Meb, Teg, Solinksy to be competitive in international competition .... it's a developmental process when you're taking on a genetically gifted tribe, born & raised at 8K, who commute-by-foot to class, & this is their national sport. WCAP parachuted these guys into the game --- FOUL!

"These Kenyans earned their American citizenship, they earned their WCAP standard, and they earned their place on the Olympic team. You don't like it, then Americans should train harder (which many of them are doing thanks to these Kenyans)."

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QSI: Colonel LIRunner isn't wrong. That said, given his role as a WCAP Apologetic, he just doesn't ask the right questions on how the team's made-up.

For Example: When did the WCAP begin establishing standards so high that there is little opportunity to do the hard work --- develop potential national class soldier-athletes into world-class ones?

ANS// Around the time that Major Dan "the Scam" Browne begin hitting these times .... for even fresh out of West Point as I've discussed earlier -- he couldn't hit these times.

ANS//In preparation for the 2012 Olympics, when WCAP folks linked immigration opportunities w/WCAP times standards & began to recruit --- Why do the "hard work" on developing soldier's for these opportunities when I can get them from Day #1 from the NCAA Kenyans? Why deal w/the Cpt Pennington's of the world?

Qualifying Standards Ignored??

Do you honestly beleive the entire WCAP is based on a website? It just came ou tof thin air and a website was created explaining all? You have no idea how the Army operates.

You have Laws and DoD Directives

From Laws you get things such as the UCMJ

DoD Directives are implemented by the Services through regulations - all regualtions have waivers as they are not laws (laws can not have waivers).

Regulations can then by capsulized in a website, poster, training film (such as POSH) etc to explain them to Soldiers. However every Soldier knows websites and such do not contain all the information on a program and you must go to the regulation to get the entire picture.

Lickety I am not a WCAP Apologetic

I am just a person rather annoyed that you who have never served and know nothing about the Army continually make outrageously wrong statements about a program you know nothing about

- I know enough to know that it would take me a at least a month to find a naturalized citizen from Kenya that ran track at a Division I college at your largest post .....

- I know they only exist at Fort Carson and Major Dan "The Scam" Browne's digs at Beaverton.

How about the largest post in the Army? Took me 5 minutes. Ran at New Mexico.

Would you like me to find you more?

Your ship is still sinking.

I don't know what your beef is with MAJ Browne, but your conduct is juvenile.

You have obviously never been in the Army yet you make comments about what the Army is all about or what it should be about. You are incompetent.

Alan

Runningart2004 wrote:

http://m.kdhnews.com/fort_hood_herald/sports_and_leisure/fort-hood-s-kipruto-takes-second-at-army-ten-miler/article_e505f42c-71dc-11e5-bc35-3783af0babd7.html?mode=jqm

How about the largest post in the Army? Took me 5 minutes. Ran at New Mexico.

Would you like me to find you more?

Your ship is still sinking.

I don't know what your beef is with MAJ Browne, but your conduct is juvenile.

You have obviously never been in the Army yet you make comments about what the Army is all about or what it should be about. You are incompetent.

Alan

SSG Alan X:

- Shocking! you found a Kenyan runner in the Army that ran collegiately at a Division I school ...

- Curious! Please find me a Kenyan at a major post that DOES NOT fit the WCAP model? Ex. didn't run in college, not a college graduate, not from the Rift Valley ... you know, general criteria like that. I'm sure they're all over the place:)

- Fascinating! After all these posts you can't figure out what my beef is with Maj Browne.

Don't throw your back out moving those goal posts around.

You're moving the goalpost. I found you one of many D1 Kenyans who joined the Army not on WCAP as that is what you asked for.

To answer your new question....

Here's a few:

In my 5.5 years in the active duty Army I've met with and worked with Iraqis, Mexicans, Guatemalans, Kenyans and others who joined the Army as a path to citizenship and folks from California to New York to Texas to Florida and all roads in between.

What else ya got?

Alan

My guess is that you have a personal and professional issue with him.....he beat you in a race? Steal your girl? Maybe it goes back to HS since your arguments are very juvenile.

Alan

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" I'm proud to be an American where at least I know I'm free ... even if it's been less than a year ..."

Hooah! Specialist Kipchirchir

Cool story bro.

Alan

Runningart2004 wrote:

Cool story bro.

Alan

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Parachute Olympians ... legally trafficked by WCAP: that's the story!