Sir Bastion Newbold wrote:
"Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is, perhaps, the end of the beginning."
Winston Churchill
It's the end of TuE'S.
TuE in track and field is pretty much like doping, but with the control of WADA and/or USADA.
ijenns318 wrote:
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-32877702Look at the 2nd video down, which describes "a runner" coached by Salazar. If you watch the video, it's almost entirely obvious that it's Cam Levins (if you've ever watched an interview of Levins talking, you can tell that it's him by the way he speaks) with maybe something that altered the audio of his voice a bit so people wouldn't know it was him.
Good on him though; I'm glad he's speaking out about this and even though he requested to remain anonymous, it's good to know that he's a good guy and actually questioned drug use. I think he should speak out about this un-anonymously because I'm like 90% sure it's Levins in the interview.
I agree it 100% sounds like Cam. If that's the case, a current athlete speaking out then that's trouble for Al Sal et al.
ftrack critic wrote:
Anyone gone to flotrack today? It's official that they are just a shrill PR company for the shoe companies. This story has been out for what 4 hours and they have zero up on it on their site.
LOL.
What I heard about two years ago:
Flotrack had some dirt on NOP doing shady things.
They were going to air it.
Salazar stopped them from doing it, gave them access to follow them and do a long video series following their training in return for them not showing their dirt (possibly only gray area dirt, but still bad image for Salazar).
Flotrack has had to keep their mouths shut since to appease Darth Vader. I mean Alberto Salazar.
First let me state I am a huge Rupp fan. Actually I'm a fan of all the top US runners.
I read a lot of the articles/info out there today (Might have missed some).
The Koucher stuff just seems kind of lame and unimportant.
However the Magness stuff seems pretty damning. I'll be really bummed if it turns out to be true and indicative of a systematic doping system.
To me best case scenario is they are living completely in the gray area which really isn't a great place to be.
If some of the gray area stuff doesn't give much of an edge, why go there.
One other thing i had told myself was, well if NOP was break the rules why has no one gone to WADA, spoke out etc. You can't keep that much a secret. But it seems many have actually gone to WADA... The question htough is could WADA not prove anything, did they investigate?
Be curious how it all turns out...
Methinks Magness is still stinging from the fact he was fired from NOP and he never broke 4 min in the mile.
agip wrote:
I work in an industry focused on compliance. When the compliance officers smell a rat, they start digging. They find a thread here and pull it. Usually it leads to a much longer thread. They apply pressure.
That's what is going to happen here - Tygart or someone Tygartlike will make this a personal mission, and they will find something. Or Phil Knight will be the hammer here.
It will be interesting to see how NOP does at USAs and Worlds - if they bomb out it will be fascinating.
I respect your opinion and perspective. But here aren't you assuming that there is a Big Nasty behind all of this? Something to find in the first place.
I have no real information here, inside or otherwise. As such I am not assuming anything. But perhaps you have more information than me. I don't know.
orbitboy wrote:
Link wrote:And just for the record, I've always been a really big fan of Rupp. Somehow, I thought, that he was just this talented kid (13:37 in hs!! - afterall Salazar would never endager the health of a minor, even Salazar!) who, probably was doing some shady things, but no more than the Africans and who was inspiring kids to some of the best hs performances ever in this country.
I'm about as cynical as they come, but even I am shocked by the allegations here. I don't know why I am... maybe I'm just experiencing flashbacks from my time in Eugene. I was sooo disappointed then when I learned what was going on, how these guys were beating me so easily (or, at least one of the reasons they were...). It's like Breaking Away:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DJETB-MfpnQGrrrrrrr!!
If you think track and cycling are dirty, take a look at the sports where the REAL money is made. The greater the financial incentive to succeed, that's where you'll find the cheaters in the greatest numbers.
There really is no speculation as to PEDs in the NFL.
Look at footage of them now and 30 years ago. They are moving in slow motion and are nearly half the size.
The Dingo wrote:
ijenns318 wrote:http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-32877702Look at the 2nd video down, which describes "a runner" coached by Salazar. If you watch the video, it's almost entirely obvious that it's Cam Levins (if you've ever watched an interview of Levins talking, you can tell that it's him by the way he speaks) with maybe something that altered the audio of his voice a bit so people wouldn't know it was him.
Good on him though; I'm glad he's speaking out about this and even though he requested to remain anonymous, it's good to know that he's a good guy and actually questioned drug use. I think he should speak out about this un-anonymously because I'm like 90% sure it's Levins in the interview.
I agree it 100% sounds like Cam. If that's the case, a current athlete speaking out then that's trouble for Al Sal et al.
"Actor's voice"
There really is no speculation as to PEDs in the NFL.
I seriously think almost everybody in the NFL is dirty. Even the punters. I mean, if cheating added a yard and a half to your average, and meant the difference between a nice ten year career, or selling insurance? Plus all the pressure from your team mates who you've never quite succeeded in impressing anyway...
It's human nature. Always has been.
The Dingo wrote:
ijenns318 wrote:http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-32877702Look at the 2nd video down, which describes "a runner" coached by Salazar. If you watch the video, it's almost entirely obvious that it's Cam Levins (if you've ever watched an interview of Levins talking, you can tell that it's him by the way he speaks) with maybe something that altered the audio of his voice a bit so people wouldn't know it was him.
Good on him though; I'm glad he's speaking out about this and even though he requested to remain anonymous, it's good to know that he's a good guy and actually questioned drug use. I think he should speak out about this un-anonymously because I'm like 90% sure it's Levins in the interview.
I agree it 100% sounds like Cam. If that's the case, a current athlete speaking out then that's trouble for Al Sal et al.
If that's Levins talking the talk, now he needs to need to walk the walk & leave the group. It will be interesting to see if anyone permanently leaves the group in the next month or so. Or, more likely, post-World's.
awww how cute wrote:
Methinks Magness is still stinging from the fact he was fired from NOP and he never broke 4 min in the mile.
Except the stuff he stated happened before he chose to leave the NOP. And it happened within the first few months of him working there.
Free NOP Training Diary. Just fill in your training:
Wednesday
Thursday
Friday
Saturday
Sunday
Monday
TUEsday
Tim Rowberry wrote:
So.. Are people just now realizing that Galen Rupp has serious asthma and is taking the same medicine anyone I know takes for it? That stuff can stunt growth, kill your hormone levels.. I just gained a little more respect for Galen.
On the other hand, it's a crazy coincidence that I was discussing how vile Kara acted towards Salazar the last time I saw them interacting. She has a grudge to say the least. Not phased even slightly by anything I read.
I vouch for how hard these guys, specifically Galen, put their bodies on the line. As a pacer over the last 3 years and a coach, I would vouch that Salazar did nothing more than protect his athletes basic health.
So your defenses are:
1) Rupp has asthma, so everything discussed in this report is okay.
2) Salazar and Kara don't get along
3) As a pacer/coach, you personally believe they do nothing wrong.
Is that about right?
Unlikely Cam in my opinion - have to assume this was taped weeks ago, and Cam was singing Alberto's praises at Pre.
More likely Dathan, O'Lionaird, or Ulrey.
I'm curious on why people are so confident these accusations are true because they are coming from the Gouchers and Steve Magness - as if they have no reason to be dishonest. The only physical proof we've been presented is a picture of a check with the memo "shipping expenses," a bottle supposedly given to Kara by Salazar labeled Cytomel, and a form filled out 13 years ago. That's it, even though Magness and the Gouchers were closely involved with Salazar's coaching for years - yet that's all the evidence we get. Of course despite Salazar doping all his athletes the Gouchers never did anything illegal - they are heroes for telling their stories 3+ years after the fact. Same with Magness - he was the #2 man to Salazar yet he has no physical proof other than one printout despite the alleged widespread cheating that was going on.
Again, I'm not debating that this may all be true - I think that cycling has shown us that everyone cheats if they think they can get away with it - but I'm not sure that this story is proof of anything.
Bigfoot Investments wrote:
agip wrote:I work in an industry focused on compliance. When the compliance officers smell a rat, they start digging. They find a thread here and pull it. Usually it leads to a much longer thread. They apply pressure.
That's what is going to happen here - Tygart or someone Tygartlike will make this a personal mission, and they will find something. Or Phil Knight will be the hammer here.
It will be interesting to see how NOP does at USAs and Worlds - if they bomb out it will be fascinating.
I respect your opinion and perspective. But here aren't you assuming that there is a Big Nasty behind all of this? Something to find in the first place.
I have no real information here, inside or otherwise. As such I am not assuming anything. But perhaps you have more information than me. I don't know.
Hey Bigfoot.
yes, I am assuming that there is a big nasty, and what the Gouchers and Magness and the 'actor' are saying are true. Those are clear violations. using testosterone on his son and testing him? using unprescribed prescriptions? surreptious mailing of pills? a chart saying rupp was using peds?
Maybe I miss your point...
Have you read the epstein piece?
Chet Manly wrote:
The only physical proof we've been presented is a picture of a check with the memo "shipping expenses," a bottle supposedly given to Kara by Salazar labeled Cytomel, and a form filled out 13 years ago. That's it...
LOL, destruction of evidence. Keep no records, and tell no traceable lies.
Chet Manly wrote:
I'm curious on why people are so confident these accusations are true because they are coming from the Gouchers and Steve Magness - as if they have no reason to be dishonest. The only physical proof we've been presented is a picture of a check with the memo "shipping expenses," a bottle supposedly given to Kara by Salazar labeled Cytomel, and a form filled out 13 years ago. That's it, even though Magness and the Gouchers were closely involved with Salazar's coaching for years - yet that's all the evidence we get. Of course despite Salazar doping all his athletes the Gouchers never did anything illegal - they are heroes for telling their stories 3+ years after the fact. Same with Magness - he was the #2 man to Salazar yet he has no physical proof other than one printout despite the alleged widespread cheating that was going on.
Again, I'm not debating that this may all be true - I think that cycling has shown us that everyone cheats if they think they can get away with it - but I'm not sure that this story is proof of anything.
I honestly don't understand why Magness would just blatantly make up these various stories.
Interesting that Al Sal gave a heads up to Athletics Canada about the documentary because of the Levins connection. Erikkson also believes they are just "rumors".
http://panam.cbc.ca/news/article/alberto-salazar-nike-oregon-project-facing-accusations-doping.html
yup, i totally agree that it's cam levins. that's exactly how he pronounces "alberto".