Trumpers, if there are only two genders, why was Caster Semenya barred from competing? She was “female” at birth
They will say that Semenya was "born of the sex that produces sperm" and that this should somehow be determined for all people at birth.
Since they have no practical proposal as to how that would actually be done at birth, they endorse forcibly reclassifying people at such time as it becomes apparent.
That is to say, if their daughters, like Semenya, have female genitalia in childhood but turn out later in life to actually be XY due to various conditions, they would forcibly reclassify them.
This is why the POTUS definition does not apply in all cases. There are also XX individuals with male genitalia who are raised as male.
I’m pretty sure as a “doctor”you’d recommend testicular cancer and prostate cancer screenings to those with Y chromosomes, despite their gender identity.
If he's a doctor I'm Usain Bolt.
It may be true that you are a runt who can't break 12.0.
They will say that Semenya was "born of the sex that produces sperm" and that this should somehow be determined for all people at birth.
Since they have no practical proposal as to how that would actually be done at birth, they endorse forcibly reclassifying people at such time as it becomes apparent.
That is to say, if their daughters, like Semenya, have female genitalia in childhood but turn out later in life to actually be XY due to various conditions, they would forcibly reclassify them.
This is why the POTUS definition does not apply in all cases. There are also XX individuals with male genitalia who are raised as male.
And Trump et al would have the government forcibly reclassify such a person as female.
Enough of these gender discussions. We're all sick of it. Many kids were harmed because of this craziness. I can't believe the crap they were told at school. Back to science and let's never discuss these stupid pronouns ever again!
So you finally acknowledge biological sex is absolutely relevant, regardless of gender identity.
Huh?
"Finally"?
I don't hear anybody saying that biological sex isn't "relevant." Of course it is, medically and otherwise.
I do hear Trump et al saying that biological sex is the only thing that is relevant: that there are only two genders and that these always map directly to biological sex. This is absurd inaccurate.
Hope that's clear. (Consider reading more slowly if that helps you?)
Still, if forms are to exist, they will exist to impose a certain order on things, not to reflect all of reality.
For example, I have hazel eyes as green as they are brown. Most forms only give an option for brown. It does not match reality. I tick brown and get on with it. No dignity lost. It is just a dumb form.
You are comparing gender identification to checking 'brown eyes' on a form when your eyes are hazel.
You are comparing gender identification to checking 'brown eyes' on a form when your eyes are hazel.
This really says all that needs to be said about your ignorance of the issue.
Nobody is comparing gender identification. We are talking about identification of sex. The EO relates to sex and not "gender identification."
Did the standardized test folks remove analogies from the exams for your benefit?
Sure, we're talking about different physical attributes on the form. But they are imperfect descriptions of physical attributes. The only difference is that some folks make a big stink about it and want to make it all about them.
You are comparing gender identification to checking 'brown eyes' on a form when your eyes are hazel.
You are comparing gender identification to checking 'brown eyes' on a form when your eyes are hazel.
This really says all that needs to be said about your ignorance of the issue.
Nobody is comparing gender identification. We are talking about identification of sex. The EO relates to sex and not "gender identification."
Did the standardized test folks remove analogies from the exams for your benefit?
Sure, we're talking about different physical attributes on the form. But they are imperfect descriptions of physical attributes. The only difference is that some folks make a big stink about it and want to make it all about them.
Please tell us what "biological sex" this person belongs to.
Nobody is comparing gender identification. We are talking about identification of sex. The EO relates to sex and not "gender identification."
Did the standardized test folks remove analogies from the exams for your benefit?
Sure, we're talking about different physical attributes on the form. But they are imperfect descriptions of physical attributes. The only difference is that some folks make a big stink about it and want to make it all about them.
Please tell us what "biological sex" this person belongs to.
Why the obsession with creating systems for outliers?
in my neighborhood where hardly anyone walks tens of millions of dollars were spent digging up the sidewalks and putting ramps on every corner. This is despite the condition of the sidewalks in many places being unfit to walk on, never mind wheeled traffic. But that is another story.
Anyway, now without curbs at corners cars are driving off the roads and into homes, fences, shop fronts. And the amount of unlawful and dangerous wheeled traffic (bikes and scooters which are not allowed to use sidewalks) has increased. Since the roads were not cambered to accommodate retrofit ramps, many of the corners now pool water, flood, and cause the roads to wear prematurely, making them worse for everyone.
It’s not at all clear what compelling interest the government has to force labeling of intersex people into a binary classification. It’s a lot easier to just let them be, give them the dignity of their identification, and not subject anyone to intrusive inspection procedures. (Unfortunately, you won’t find much sympathy for this view on these boards.)
As for sport, the regulatory bodies are doing fine without the intervention of US law, and at least at the global stage, US law is mostly irrelevant.
I don't think the US federal government has a compelling interest in forcing people with rare DSDs to be socially labelled, medically and legally classified, and/or designated on government-issued ID documents like BCs and passports in ways they're not happy or comfortable with - or to be subjected to any other kind of unfair treatment.
I don't think that's the aim of theis EO, either.
The compelling government interest behind this EO is protecting the hard-won rights of women and girls in the USA by clarifying that US laws and policies meant to provide girls and women with protection against unfair sex discrimination, sex abuse, sexual harassment, etc are based on biological sex - not on gender identity or gender expression. That's obvious from the title: Defending Women from Gender Ideology Extremism and Restoring Biological Truth to the Federal Government.
The aim of the EO is to set in motion a series of changes across the federal bureacracy that will have the end result of preventing bog-standard males with totally normal male sex development from being able to use gender identity claims to horn in on federally-funded and federally-run programs and facilites for girls' and women that are supposed to be single-sex - and which have been made single-sex for the purpose of insuring safety, security, fairness, equal opportunity, privacy, dignity, health, hygiene, comfort, convenience and peace of mind for the female half of the population - as well as for the small number of XY, genetically male people with DSDs such as CAIS whooutwardly appear to be female like Alicia Weigel.
This EO lays down the gauntlet against sexist, misogynistic gender identity ideology and says that this harmful ideology - which was embraced by the Obama-Biden and Biden-Harris administrations and has been embedded in policies and regulations throughout the federal government - will no onger be promoted by the US government and threaded through US government policies.
The EO gets the ball rolling on bringing about a set of policy reviews and overhauls - and clarifications of existing laws - meant to stop men and boys with totally normal male sex development from being able to "identify into" a host of federally-funded programs and places they don't belong in. Such as girls and women's school sports; girls and women's school toilets and locker rooms.women's homeless and disaster-emergency shelters; women's domestic/intimate partner violence refuges aka "battered women's shelters;" services and centers for girls and women who've been raped/sexually assaulted; women's prisons, halfway houses, detention centers - and sections of those facilities such as showers that are supposed to be off-limits to males.
I believe that the final regulations, policies and legislation that will come down the pike as a result of this EO can written and implemented so that no injustice will be done whatsoever to people like Alicia Weigel. And I hope they will be written that way. Which is why I've already joined with other people with considerable experience crafting policy documents dealing with these topics to come up with languge that carves out exceptions for people with certain DSDs like Alicia Weigel - whilst still meeting the overarching objective of preventing men and boys who don't have DSDs from being able to use gender identity claims to get into women's and girls' sports and spaces where 99.999% of the male population have no business inserting themselves.
The EO says that in 30 days, the White House office of Legislative Affairs is to produce final wording clarifying and and codifying the defintions in the EO.
So if you and the other gents moaning, groaning and harrumphing about how people with rare DSDs might be negatively affected are really, truly, honestly, genuinely concerned about people with DSDs,I trust you'll all be getting in touch with the staff at the WH office of LA in the coming days to let them know of your worries - and to suggest substitute wording that will insure that people with rare DSDs like Alicia Weigel get the due consideration and proper accomodations I think we all agree they should get.
If you don't do that, then it will just go to show that all your handwringing, kvetching and Chicken Little catastrophizing is just more of the hollow, histrionic and wholly performative virtue-signalling that social media is full of.
This post was edited 15 minutes after it was posted.
Nobody is throwing anyone under anything. There is a difference between catering to every person individually at any cost, and harming people.
How is anyone "harmed" if Kimberly Zieselman is legally recognized as a woman?
Aside from her husband and her doctor, does it matter to anyone else what chromosomes she has?
Pray tell how people like Kimberly Zieselman and Alician Weigel benefit by the policies and laws that you and other gender identity ideologues have pushed for which now make it possible for oodles of creepy, dangerous, malevloent men across the USA like Richard Cox here to be legally recognized as women.
A registered sex offender is facing a string of charges following multiple incidents at sports facilities and schools in Arlington County, according to police.
If you and other gender identity ideologues genuinely gave a rat's ass about people with rare DSDs like Alicia Weigel and Kimberly Zieselman, you wouldn't constantly bring them up and point to them and their rare medical conditions in the callous, exploitative way you do.
I get the impression that in your heart of hearts, you don't have an ounce of compassion or consideration for people like Weigel and Zeiselman and the difficulties they face in life due to having rare DSDs. You just bring them up again and again and again because you see them and their unusual medical conditions as handy props you can use as weapons in your war against the half of the human race who are female.
Taken as a whole, the steady stream of posts you make in which you trot out photos and footage of individuals with extremely rare DSDs and say "looky here, what about this one?" come off as all too reminiscent of the unsavory, sensationalist stunts of a sleazy sideshow barker shamelessly capitalizing on other people's unfortunate and highly unusual medical conditions for his own gain.
This post was edited 2 minutes after it was posted.
You are comparing gender identification to checking 'brown eyes' on a form when your eyes are hazel.
You are comparing gender identification to checking 'brown eyes' on a form when your eyes are hazel.
This really says all that needs to be said about your ignorance of the issue.
Nobody is comparing gender identification. We are talking about identification of sex. The EO relates to sex and not "gender identification."
Did the standardized test folks remove analogies from the exams for your benefit?
Wow, you really are slow.
You realize that your President said "As of today, it will henceforth be the official policy of the United States government that there are only two genders, male and female" ... right?
Genders. G. E. N. D. E. R. S.
And for the record, the last "standardized test" I took was a perfect SAT.
Nobody is comparing gender identification. We are talking about identification of sex. The EO relates to sex and not "gender identification."
Did the standardized test folks remove analogies from the exams for your benefit?
Sure, we're talking about different physical attributes on the form. But they are imperfect descriptions of physical attributes. The only difference is that some folks make a big stink about it and want to make it all about them.
Please tell us what "biological sex" this person belongs to.
Those "outliers" are human beings like yourself, and they don't deserve to be thrown under the bus.
Nobody is throwing anyone under anything. There is a difference between catering to every person individually at any cost, and harming people.
What "harms" are done by allowing people to identify their gender on a government form, rather than dictating it to them based on pee-pees vs no-pee-pees?
How is anyone "harmed" if Kimberly Zieselman is legally recognized as a woman?
Aside from her husband and her doctor, does it matter to anyone else what chromosomes she has?
Pray tell how people like Kimberly Zieselman and Alician Weigel benefit by the policies and laws that you and other gender identity ideologues have pushed for which now make it possible for oodles of creepy, dangerous, malevloent men across the USA like Richard Cox here to be legally recognized as women.
If you and other gender identity ideologues genuinely gave a rat's ass about people with rare DSDs like Alicia Weigel and Kimberly Zieselman, you wouldn't constantly bring them up and point to them and their rare medical conditions in the callous, exploitative way you do.
I get the impression that in your heart of hearts, you don't have an ounce of compassion or consideration for people like Weigel and Zeiselman and the difficulties they face in life due to having rare DSDs. You just bring them up again and again and again because you see them and their unusual medical conditions as handy props you can use as weapons in your war against the half of the human race who are female.
Taken as a whole, the steady stream of posts you make in which you trot out photos and footage of individuals with extremely rare DSDs and say "looky here, what about this one?" come off as all too reminiscent of the unsavory, sensationalist stunts of a sleazy sideshow barker shamelessly capitalizing on other people's unfortunate and highly unusual medical conditions for his own gain.
Huh?
This person's biological sex is male. They identify as male gender.
What on earth does that have to do with people identifying as a gender that isn't the same as their biological sex??
Nothing at all.
Your weak "arguments" are an embarrassment to your side.
Pray tell how people like Kimberly Zieselman and Alician Weigel benefit by the policies and laws that you and other gender identity ideologues have pushed for which now make it possible for oodles of creepy, dangerous, malevloent men across the USA like Richard Cox here to be legally recognized as women.
If you and other gender identity ideologues genuinely gave a rat's ass about people with rare DSDs like Alicia Weigel and Kimberly Zieselman, you wouldn't constantly bring them up and point to them and their rare medical conditions in the callous, exploitative way you do.
I get the impression that in your heart of hearts, you don't have an ounce of compassion or consideration for people like Weigel and Zeiselman and the difficulties they face in life due to having rare DSDs. You just bring them up again and again and again because you see them and their unusual medical conditions as handy props you can use as weapons in your war against the half of the human race who are female.
Taken as a whole, the steady stream of posts you make in which you trot out photos and footage of individuals with extremely rare DSDs and say "looky here, what about this one?" come off as all too reminiscent of the unsavory, sensationalist stunts of a sleazy sideshow barker shamelessly capitalizing on other people's unfortunate and highly unusual medical conditions for his own gain.
Huh?
This person's biological sex is male. They identify as male gender.
What on earth does that have to do with people identifying as a gender that isn't the same as their biological sex??
Nothing at all.
Your weak "arguments" are an embarrassment to your side.
You obviously didn't read the story:
Richard K. Cox, 58, who identifies as a woman, according to court documents, has no fixed address. Cox was arrested on December 6, 2024, at the Barcroft Sports & Fitness Center after police responded to a trespassing report.
Alleged exposures at Arlington schools, sports facilities
Following the Dec. 6 arrest, detectives charged Cox with two counts of sex offender loitering near schools, day cares, parks, or playgrounds and identity theft.
Investigators revealed Cox had entered the Barcroft facility on November 30 and, on December 2, allegedly exposed his genitals in the women’s locker room in the presence of an adult and two children.
These actions resulted in additional charges of indecent exposure and two counts of indecent liberties with children.
Further investigation connected Cox to an October 21 incident at Washington-Liberty High School. Police say a victim reported seeing Cox expose themselves in the women’s locker room around 6:45 p.m. before they left.
Here's another story about this person. He identifies as a transgender woman, and has booked as female or U:
Sex offender who identifies as transgender exposes himself to kids again at Va. school
ARLINGTON COUNTY, Va. (7News) — A male sex offender who announced last year in court documents that he now identifies as transgender is accused of using the girl’s locker room at Washington Liberty-High School and exposing his genitals.
The Arlington County Police Department told 7News that a victim entered the locker room on October 21, 2024, and observed Cox exposing his genitals.
Richard Kenneth Cox, 58, is now facing multiple charges in Arlington County, including several counts of intentionally making an obscene display of his private parts in a public place or in a place where others were present plus loitering within 100 feet of a high school after having been convicted of an offense prohibiting proximity to children.
Cox is listed as a female or “U” in the warrants of arrest.
