great job to Renato!
great job to Renato!
Why have Songkok and Kwalia left the 1500m?
Kwalia has 3:50 mile speed, Songkok 3:30 1500 credentials. That places them far better up there in the 1500 than in the grossly competitive 5,000, where Gebremariam, Bekele, Sihine, Dinkessa, Berhanu, Wendimu, and Geneti form an Ethiopian contingent that is nearly unbeatable, never minding Shaheen, Kipchoge, and Chebii.
awesome thread.
I think Songkok will surprise. He has beaten Kipchoge with a low 12.50 time and his 13.11 at altitude... Besides todays sub 12.50 5000m runners need that type of speed, Haile Gebrselassie has 3.31i, Kipchoge 3.49 and 3.32, Songkok is no different.
Tommie John wrote:
Why have Songkok and Kwalia left the 1500m?
Kwalia has 3:50 mile speed, Songkok 3:30 1500 credentials. That places them far better up there in the 1500 than in the grossly competitive 5,000, where Gebremariam, Bekele, Sihine, Dinkessa, Berhanu, Wendimu, and Geneti form an Ethiopian contingent that is nearly unbeatable, never minding Shaheen, Kipchoge, and Chebii.
Isaac Songok defeated Kipchoge, Gebremariam, Dinkessa, Berhanu, Wendimu, and Geneti, and is much faster than Chebii.
Isaac Songok will be in the top 5 in Helsinki, but yes he could have stayed in 1500m but oh well he has huge success this year in 5k
Helsinki 5k
1. El G
2. Bekele
3. Songok/Kipchoge/Shaheen battlin
Shaheen said he wanted to run the 5k also. Shaheen is pretty powerful, he could win, but I'm betting on Hicham! :)
Mike, what is up with El Guerrouj? He has not raced at all. I hoped to see him take down the 3K and 5K world records.
Also, when did Kipchoge run 3:49 and 3:32? I recall a 3:33 in Hengelo and a 3:50 mile, but never those times.
Also, does anyone have any information about what type of training all these Ethiopians are doing? This seems most heavily shrouded in secret among distance running lore. We all know what the Moroccans do, the Kenyans, but the Ethiopians do it all in secret. I have heard only small details of speed sessions from the team camp; Gebrselassie did 4 x 200 in 24 seconds as pure speedwork and pulled his hamstring.
The team also uses long, pace specific time trials, like 35km time trials at marathon pace. Gebrselassie purportedly did this at 4:49 mile pace before he had to pull out of London. Sihine, Bekele, and Gebrselassie did 7,000m on the track up in Addis Ababa before Athens hitting 5,000m in 13:22. That is simply insane.
The team also uses work specifically designed for improving finishing speed. A favorite has been said to be repeated 800 meter runs with the first 400 run in 64 seconds and the second in 53 for a final time of 1:57. This type of work was good for Million Wolde dawdling at 13:40 pace in Sydney before closing in 53 for the last lap to win in 13:35. Beyond that, it seems, little is known.
Sorry you are right. I got 3.32 and 3.49 off the top of my head, but 3.33 and 3.50 is not far off.
Tesfaye wrote:
Mike, what is up with El Guerrouj? He has not raced at all. I hoped to see him take down the 3K and 5K world records.
Also, when did Kipchoge run 3:49 and 3:32? I recall a 3:33 in Hengelo and a 3:50 mile, but never those times.
Also, does anyone have any information about what type of training all these Ethiopians are doing? This seems most heavily shrouded in secret among distance running lore. We all know what the Moroccans do, the Kenyans, but the Ethiopians do it all in secret. I have heard only small details of speed sessions from the team camp; Gebrselassie did 4 x 200 in 24 seconds as pure speedwork and pulled his hamstring.
The team also uses long, pace specific time trials, like 35km time trials at marathon pace. Gebrselassie purportedly did this at 4:49 mile pace before he had to pull out of London. Sihine, Bekele, and Gebrselassie did 7,000m on the track up in Addis Ababa before Athens hitting 5,000m in 13:22. That is simply insane.
The team also uses work specifically designed for improving finishing speed. A favorite has been said to be repeated 800 meter runs with the first 400 run in 64 seconds and the second in 53 for a final time of 1:57. This type of work was good for Million Wolde dawdling at 13:40 pace in Sydney before closing in 53 for the last lap to win in 13:35. Beyond that, it seems, little is known.
After the Athens 5k last year El G was entered in Brussels 3k but pulled out because of health problems. He ended up not running indoors or world xc champs 4km. He pulled out of Hengelo 3000m and Eugene 2 Miles because of health problems. Later same thing with Zaragoza 3000m. He may just wait until Helsinki, we'll see. He WILL be in Helsinki 5000 and maybe 1500. He'll be in shape trust me! Btw his 400 pr is 47-48 atleast and 10.8-11.4 atleast in 100m.
Kipchoge ran 3:33 Hengelo 1500 win in 2004 and 3:50 in London Mile last year. The Ethiopian training should be similar to Haile's training he's done
Bpence, if u read this, please post the link to the site on Geb/Bekele. Btw Kenyans have different training programs.
Fellows,
please stop imitating mr. Canova. Have some respect for the old man.
Michael Bautista wrote:
The Ethiopian training should be similar to Haile's training he's done
Bpence, if u read this, please post the link to the site on Geb/Bekele. Btw Kenyans have different training programs.
Yes but there is always more to it than the generic stuff they post like "60 min. easy." The Ethiopians have one of the most scientifically advanced protocols in the world and there are all sorts of plyometrics, weight work, hills, threshold work, etc. that is something that would need to be conveyed in the same detailed manner Renato gave the training of his Kenyans. Maybe he knows; I bet Renato knows Jos or Kostre or both.
They use a lot of similar Hill sprints like Canova and sprint drills
can you tell more about shaeens traning at the moment?
Tesfaye wrote:
Mike, what is up with El Guerrouj? He has not raced at all. I hoped to see him take down the 3K and 5K world records.
Also, when did Kipchoge run 3:49 and 3:32? I recall a 3:33 in Hengelo and a 3:50 mile, but never those times.
Also, does anyone have any information about what type of training all these Ethiopians are doing? This seems most heavily shrouded in secret among distance running lore. We all know what the Moroccans do, the Kenyans, but the Ethiopians do it all in secret. I have heard only small details of speed sessions from the team camp; Gebrselassie did 4 x 200 in 24 seconds as pure speedwork and pulled his hamstring.
The team also uses long, pace specific time trials, like 35km time trials at marathon pace. Gebrselassie purportedly did this at 4:49 mile pace before he had to pull out of London. Sihine, Bekele, and Gebrselassie did 7,000m on the track up in Addis Ababa before Athens hitting 5,000m in 13:22. That is simply insane.
The team also uses work specifically designed for improving finishing speed. A favorite has been said to be repeated 800 meter runs with the first 400 run in 64 seconds and the second in 53 for a final time of 1:57. This type of work was good for Million Wolde dawdling at 13:40 pace in Sydney before closing in 53 for the last lap to win in 13:35. Beyond that, it seems, little is known.
I don't think El Guerrouj will be in a position to medal. This time round. There are about 10 runners who have run a sub 13 min 5k and El G, by just sitting on his laurels will find it hard to cope with them let alone beat them.
Now, I know that that is a mouthful but that is jjust what I think.
I doubt El Guerrouj is "resting on his laurels."
It is more likely he is doing 20 400m hill reps up a steep forest in Rabat shining his car headlights up the dark hill and scaring some monkey out of its mind.
uh, no wrote:
I doubt El Guerrouj is "resting on his laurels."
It is more likely he is doing 20 400m hill reps up a steep forest in Rabat shining his car headlights up the dark hill and scaring some monkey out of its mind.
It is probable. Prior to Athens, he had a few races and was even indisposed and some of us like myself had written him of.
I am ready to take back my words.
Who is mr. Renato Canova
I have a question for Mr. Lindsay Dunn, if he reads this thread.
I saw on another thread some postings about British distance runners. Do you have information at all about the work of Tim Hutchings, Steve Cram, and/or Brendan Foster? I know Cram is still #4 ever at the mile with 3:46.32 and Foster held the WR at 3K and 2 miles (even Bekele never broke his AC record of 7:35). If you have information about their development I would be very interested to read it here.
I got some advice. Don't eat beans if you are planning on being in a closed area with no windows for a few hours. MAN it smells like a sulfur mine in here...
Hey questioner. All 3 of these folks have books, and the training methods / development are detailed.
It's wonderful that you ask this question. The Brits RULED middle distance in the late 70s / early 80s. It's supremely interesting to look at what those Greats did, and why things have changed in GB since.
Moorcroft ran a WR 5000m in 82. Coe / Cram / Ovett need no introduction.
Morroccan coaches looked at Britain, and copied many things. The results became clear in the mid 80s onwards.