Mr. Renato Canova: Could You Please Answer a Question About Effective Ways to Improve the Lactate Threshold?

bump! i can't get enough!!!

Jason, are you from St. Louis? I recognize your name.

Mr. Canova, Brad Hudson has said that you and other Italian coaches are his biggest influence. I was wondering what you thought of the current crop of American coaches? Can you tell me other Italian coaches that you respect?

In Italy, we had for long time a group of coaches working together practically for 15 days every month, in Italian Center of Tirrenia or in stages abroad.

The coaches were very much friends one another, sharing all their experiences and discussing about it. Of course, everyone in his mind thought "I want to demonstate that I'm the best", but this meaned more focus, more concentration, not jalousie about programs. Everyone well knew that it's not possible to invent anything, but only to use in different way what everybody knows.

I'm speaking about my friends that had the following victories :

1- Luciano GIGLIOTTI

He was for almost 30 years the responsible of Middle distances, or long distances, and in the last 15 years of Marathon. We shared this responsability for long time.

He was the coach of Grippo (finalist in 800m in OG 1976), Cindolo (first Italian Marathon runner of top level, 2:11 in 1974), Bordin (Olympic Champion in Marathon '88, European Ch. '86 / '90, winner in Boston), Lambruschini (bronze medal in 3000 steeple in WCh '95 and OG '96 after two 4th places in '88 / '92), Maria Guida (European Champion in Marathon 2002), and now Baldini.

2- Giorgio RONDELLI

He was the coach of Alberto Cova, World Champion in 10000m in the first edition of WCh in Helsinki '83, Olympic Champion in LA '84, and European Ch. in '82. He was also the coach of Francesco Panetta, winner in WCh '87 in steeple after a silver medal in 10000m, and of the marathon runner Danilo Goffi (2:08:33)

3- Gaspare POLIZZI

He was the coach of Salvatore Antibo, in my opinion the best in the world in 10000m in 1990/1991. Antibo won silver in OG '88, European Championships '90 in both 5000/10000m, was 4th in OG '92 and already was 4th in OG '84.

4- Giampaolo LENZI

Was one of the fundators of the Italian School of Marathon. He was the coach of Orlando Pizzolato, winning twice NY, of Salvatore Bettiol, of Laura Fogli, and responsible for long time of Italian middle distances.

5- Gabriele ROSA

He was always out of the group, preferring to work alone making his experiences. So, his contribution in the evolution of Italian Methodology was little thing.

However, I have a great appreciation for his knowledge, his passion and his intelligence (I cannot tell the same for his character....). He worked with good Italian Marathon runner (Poli, winner NY, was the first and the best, but also good were Barzaghi 2:10:57, Alliegro 2:12 and somebody else), but his main experiences were with Kenyans runners. He was the first to give a correct phylosophy of training and of tactics to Kenyan runners. His best atgletes were, of course, Paul Tergat, Sammy Korir, now Martin Lel, Margaret Okayo, but he trained also Wilson Boit Kipketer when beated the World Record of steeple (only 3 years later he came to me, already old) and some good track runner in long distance.

The real Italian problem is that our group closed the door for younger coaches, not because we didn't accept them, but because it was very difficult for everyone to compete with professional coaches that had the opportunity to build for long time their international experience, training the best national athletes, going around the world for competitions and stages, having in this way the opportunity to grow continuously while the other had to stay home. So, when I tried to teach to the other coaches what we learnt, very few young coaches accepted this type of life. For example, all our group (except Rosa) was of teachers of Physical Education, and we could have a special permit from our Ministry for working for Olympic Committee preserving our career. So, we could continue to have our salary, plus another salary from our Federation, and this made us professional coaches. But you know that in athletics there is very little money for coaches, and many times the best have to move to other sports (soccer, basket, volley, swimming) really richer.

So, we lost the best young coaches, and there was no turn over.

In the last 10 years, someone went also to train Kenyans.

Another very good coach, that now is the Responsible in Italy for 800/1500m, is my dear friend Gianni GHIDINI,

that is the coach of the best group in the world :

Wilfred BUNGEI (1:42.34), William YIAMPOY (1:42.91), Gregory KONCHELLAH or KAMAL (1:43.11), Joseph MUTUA (1:43.33, he was with me but I passed him to Gianni for having more omogeneus groups), Timothy KIPTANUI (3:30.04), Robert RONO (3:30.99). Before them, in Italy he was the coach of Andrea BENVENUTI (European Champion '94, 1:43.92) very talented but unlucky athlete due to a tendonitis that stopped his career.

So, the experience of Italian Coaches was always with athletes of top level, different cultures, and a good will to discuss about every technical project.

Without a good group of coaches working together, I think that it's very difficult to find the opportunity for learning how to manage the technical situation according to the needs of the athletes (that are professional and have to earn, don't forget). To coach is not something "dry", where only the theorical technical knowledge is important. At the end of everything, athletes have to reach results and to earn money, and if coaches are not flexible and able to arrange contionuously the technical road according to the situation out of control (for example, organizers that don't accept the athletes in the competitions previously planned by the coach), it's not possible to reach any result.

And, regarding the irony of True, I want to say that in this type of situation a Country doesn't need that type of democracy, but needs professionalism.

Of course, I don't decide 3 months before a race who is selected because they are sympatic or pay me, but because I had the opportunity to follow them ALWAYS and they could show me their attitudes, and I could prepare for them specific training for their goals.

Of course I decide. This is called organization, and there is in any type of Company. Who can decide the strategy of General Motors, for example : the Management Committee (with its branches, technical, echonomical, etc...) or every worker ? Who can decide the policy of a Country : the Parliament or every citizen ?

If an athlete want to reach his best, he has to plan technically his training, not in casual way, but with very precise goals. You cannot suppose that everyone can reach the top, in short time, expecially when already there is able to stay at the top, and we know that he's consistant.

I totally disagree with a system of trials very dry, where there is no technical appreciation for what the athletes were able to show in their career (not years before, but only during the last period).

You have to decide what you want :

1- I don't want to have any problem in my choices, because there are problems with lawyers, unhappy people, media etc. In this case, because I think that NOBODY IS OVER THE PARTS and people is not confident in this, I go for trials. This is the best way for not having problems, but also the worst way for selecting the strongest team possible.

2- I want to put together the strongest team possible. In this case, I preselect athletes that always showed better results than other (for example, who always wins a medal, who has the best 5 performances in a Country, who already was able to be the best in a set of competitions that I named at the beginning of the season for indicating the shape of the athletes, there are many systems), making rules that everybody has to know. So, this is not my decision, but the consequence of a rule. And after, I go for trials for the remaining places (can be 2 for each event, with 1 selected following the other system).

Do you think that, if Ian Thorpe could not compete in Athens in 400m, he had the same opportunities of the other swimmers ?

To recognize same opportunities it means to recognize the value of an athlete, not the value of ONE DAY.

For the title is different : of course, the winner in WCh, OG or US Championships is the best THAT DAY. But, if you are the best ALWAYS and you don't have the opportunity to compete, how is possible that you can win ?

I do them, but sometimes I don't know why. I know I should know.

This morning I did an Aerobic Threshold run for 8 miles at 50 seconds per mile slower than 5K race pace...Saturday, since I have no race, I'll do a LT run 18 seconds per mile slower than 5k race pace on the track....

Are there threshold runs that compliment each other, or shouldn't be run in the same week?

Renato i'm 23 years old and very little opportunity exists with knowledgable distance coaches like yourself. What you post on this board is my main source of information and the rest is left down to my own expierence. You say a gap exists in young coaches but some of us actauly want to learn but have no idea to go about it. It's not like many coaches are offering work expierence atleast not around my area so what can be done?

Renato I would be very intrested in what you have to say about training of Mario Fattore and other ultra distance events. Any chance of posting some past programs and explanations for training methods.

Anyone else with expierence for that matter!

Great Stuff!

Sounds a lot like America. Closing the door on Younger coaches. American coaches rarely share ideas.

Many people think they have a secret when in fact most of the coaches are no more than club standard when you consisder the standard of the africans. I spoke to a couple of coaches around my area and they read some of the stuff written by renato - they wrote off!!! Claiming they have coached so and so, done it for 20 odd years this way. Pretty the standard was higher 20 years ago. Hopefully one day i can change that but for now unless renato&co offer expierence its going to be a hard long road.

Renato Canova wrote:

I totally disagree with a system of trials very dry, where there is no technical appreciation for what the athletes were able to show in their career (not years before, but only during the last period).

.... because I think that NOBODY IS OVER THE PARTS and people is not confident in this, I go for trials. This is the best way for not having problems, but also the worst way for selecting the strongest team possible.

Renato,

You coach ALL of the athletes in the country where you coach, thus it is easy for you to have the absolute control of who goes and who doesn't. You are the coach of them all.

However, in the U.S. or Australia, for examples, there are many more athletes and coaches, not just one coach deciding for everyone. If so, that would be like the Kenyan system you despise.

Thus I want to give you 2 examples:

#1: You gave example of someone given a free ride who then won. There are also many examples of someone 3rd in the trials, then finished ahead of the other 2 in the championships. By your method of preselection, such athletes would not be taken to any Championship and given the opportunity they deserve.

#2: By your method, let's say you were the sole judge of the preliminary runs for the Championships, example the semifinals for the 1500 meters. Would you then say, "ah my athlete finished only 10th but I will put in him the final" because he had an upset tummy or sore toe.

If such is the case, why not just award medals to the runners you like, then we can do away with the races?

First time I've posted on this thread. Glad I could contribute.

I'd like to know why wejo, rojo, or JK have to respond to tinman. Anyone here can respond rather pithily for them. The response is: Wejo, 28:06. Now, I want to know, what is Tinman's response? Getting a few guys down to 16 minutes is not the same thing. Hell, we should be asking for Rojo's input, because he's done a hell of a lot more with Cornell's MD of late than Tinman's Army.

But I agree with others, the board is absolutely blessed with the presence of Canova and Cabral, and the focus should be on what they have to say. I mean, come on: N. Kemboi, 26:30. Say what you want, only Kostre and Rosa have a response for that.

Mr. Canova, Are you coming to America anytime soon?

Renato,

can you make a brief summary of your friend, Gianni GHIDINI

training philosophy with his 800m runners i.e. Wilfred Bungei?

Does he also use short sprint climbing sessions with his runners for improving speed and nervous capacity?

Many thanks!

Dunes, in Australia and US there are many athletes that can be selected, but I spoke about athletes like Lewis, Michael Johnson, Bubka, Isinbayeva, Jonathan Edwards, Bekele, Gebrselassie, etc. I don't think that these Countries ever had MANY of these athletes. I made the example of Ian Thorpe. How many Thorpe does Australia have ?

Don't forget that we are speaking about 3 opportunities. I think that 1 of 3 must be given thru a technical choice, leaving free for trials the other 2.

My case is different, because I decide ALL THE TEAM 3 months before, also because, after the 6-8 bests, in Qatar there is nobody strong, so the gap is very big.

But, looking for example at Ethiopia, NEVER Gebrselassie or Bekele went thru trials, this is completely stupid.

Tell me : after winning during last 4 years 8 titles of Cross short and long, World Championships in 10000, OG in 10000, having beated the WR of 5000 and 10000 and the WR indoor of 5000, do you think intelligent that Bekele has to put himself in competition with the other Ethiopian for finding a place in his team ? Or for him is better to have a precise plan of training, where the focus is the total shape for the main event ?

Believe me, it's not easy to be at top shape for two important event like Trials and WCh in a period of 5-6 weeks, and these athletes need to be already at their top for trials, that sometime are more difficult than WCh.

After trials, don't be surprised that many athletes can go out of shape for the main event.

Another solution can be to use trials for selecting not the final team, but the final rose (for example, 5 athletes). In this case, the final definition can arrive during the last 2 weeks before Championships, looking at the final shape that the athletes can show in their two last competitions, close to the Championships.

In any case, it's possible also to manage technically some difficult situation, if the athletes are intelligent.

For example, before WCh of Seville '99, I had the must to put Christopher Kosgei (elder brother of Shaheen) in 14 competitions of steeple during the last 41 days before the Championships. This was because he had already contracts with the organizers that was not possible to cancel.

In that case, using a big modulation after chosing the level of the competitions, I decided to go only in two meetings with a specific preparation (Paris S. Denis and Zurich), and to use the other meetings like part of training. At the end of all this problematical period, he was the winner of Gold Medal, and was the only Kenyan in doing it....

And you thought this thread finaly ended. NO CHANCE!!!