What I don't get is why so many pros let the Bowerman babes get away with controlling the race at such a slow pace. Especially with Schweitzer having run the 1500 the day before. At least make her work for this.
Who do you think could have stopped them? And how?
The sad fact is that the BB are so much better than anyone else in this field that nobody could stop them. Kelati tried, but couldn't.
Maybe if Emily Sisson had been in the race, she could have cranked it up early and run away from the BBs. But Sisson wasn't there, and nobody else was up to the job.
PS I'd say the BB worked for their victory. I'm sure they were hurting after running those last few laps. If you don't believe me, check out the look on Tuohy's face when she is asked whether she was ready for their kick.
What I don't get is why so many pros let the Bowerman babes get away with controlling the race at such a slow pace. Especially with Schweitzer having run the 1500 the day before. At least make her work for this.
I was thinking the same. What was Kelati's strategy? Did she think she could outkick Cranny and Schweitzer? It might have been a different race with Monson
What I don't get is why so many pros let the Bowerman babes get away with controlling the race at such a slow pace. Especially with Schweitzer having run the 1500 the day before. At least make her work for this.
I was thinking the same. What was Kelati's strategy? Did she think she could outkick Cranny and Schweitzer? It might have been a different race with Monson
Kelati is one I was thinking about. But also Henes and Rogers. And maybe Henes could have gotten Tuohy to go along with some sort of pact whereby if it turned slow they would work together at a 15:15-20 pace or something. But the 3200 m jog pretty much set up the top 3 although I give Kelati credit for being able to stay as close as she did.
That is the stark reality. No amount of natural takent can overcome chemistry. Look at Elle Henes. Trains at altitude. Solid pro. Can run in the low 15s. And she had no shot. There is a whole group (Henes, Orton, etc) that are in the same boat. Their times and progressions are clean. And they have no chance. Natural talent cannot beat EPO.
The joke is that in a few weeks these same BTC athletes are going to get mauled. As I alluded to, there is doping and then there is Doping.
The sad fact is when she goes pro Katelyn is going to have to play the game or be an also ran. The most naturally talented female distance runner in years, and that's the reality.
The things you mention. Their progression. Their ability to run times that are historically within the doping range. The ability to recover from hard efforts. Their associations. With someone like Schweizer not only did she run this super ambitious program and still had easily enough left to outkick the field in the 5000m, but she was Shelby's training partner. Hard to get more obvious, except that time Hassan fell in the 1500 at the Olympics, got up and ran the field down like they were standing still. LOL.
That is the stark reality. No amount of natural takent can overcome chemistry. Look at Elle Henes. Trains at altitude. Solid pro. Can run in the low 15s. And she had no shot. There is a whole group (Henes, Orton, etc) that are in the same boat. Their times and progressions are clean. And they have no chance. Natural talent cannot beat EPO.
The joke is that in a few weeks these same BTC athletes are going to get mauled. As I alluded to, there is doping and then there is Doping.
The sad fact is when she goes pro Katelyn is going to have to play the game or be an also ran. The most naturally talented female distance runner in years, and that's the reality.
I know people don't like this, but I think it's that they don't like HEARING this.
Guys--get a grip on reality. One of the brightest US distance runner is serving a doping ban while her teammates continue to run away with titles.
The question is...what IS possible clean? Do we even have a gage on what that is?
Karissa did the thing that always gives me side eye. She packed her schedule. 10-5-15. After rounds of the 15 where she finished 4th, she pulled away in a blustering final mile in the 5K. She nearly won the 5 as a result. So to her credit, the 10 was a while back. But most of these other women were running on rested legs.
Sifan Hassan is the most obvious doper ever. 10-5-15, and Olympic medals in all. That's an eye-roll, and you may remember, Shelby did a schedule back too. 10K cross, then mile-2 mile in indoors in 2019. Shelby is a ban.
So my question is...should athletes who pack their schedules and perform well get scrutiny or no?
After Shelby everything causes me side eye. Emily Infeld at 32 running a mile PR in the 5K? Weird. Elise Cranny's "fatigue" to come back and dominate the 5K? Weird. Courtney Frerichs performance jump in 2017 and continued improvement? Weird.
Let me ask you guys--how do you know when an athlete is doping and when one is not? what are reasonable expectations to put in Tuohy given her talent at the moment?
The bulk of your musings gave me a headache, but re the final question, I'd say top 10 at XC Nats and leave it at that.
Honest question: What do you think Kelati could have done differently that would have worked better? It looks to me as if she did the best she could, but her best just isn't good enough -- that is why the winners came into this weekend seeded ahead of her.
Guys seriously her season was over and she was just doing it to get some experience and train with her former teammate
But I mean people thinking that this is a meaningful effort in some way are out of touch with the reality that you can only train for so long and then... Anyway she was on a different season in the pros and she was looking to do good in the college championships
she always takes a break after the end of the school year so it's just a different training schedule than pros
it was just to get some experience and to bond with her former teammate and I'm sure they had lots of fun and will probably be focused on 2024
Let me ask you guys--how do you know when an athlete is doping and when one is not?
Call me a cynic, but I start with Wejo's Dictum: You only for sure about yourself. For everyone else, it's all about probabilities. I find this especially helpful when thinking about people I'm sure are clean, especially my friends and favorites. As Wejo says, I can't know for sure, and it's easy to cut my guys some slack.
Guys seriously her season was over and she was just doing it to get some experience and train with her former teammate
But I mean people thinking that this is a meaningful effort in some way are out of touch with the reality that you can only train for so long and then... Anyway she was on a different season in the pros and she was looking to do good in the college championships
she always takes a break after the end of the school year so it's just a different training schedule than pros
it was just to get some experience and to bond with her former teammate and I'm sure they had lots of fun and will probably be focused on 2024
Why didn’t you point all that out before the race so there wouldn’t have been all those predictions about her possibly making the team and what about Nur and Young?
If she was there at the national championships just to bond with her ex-teammate, she’s unlike any competitive athlete I’ve ever heard of.
Cranny and Karissa are mid 14 runners. No "pushing the pace" was going to drop them, hurt them, or do anything useful. In all reality a slow race was the best chance for almost anyone in the field.
You want to be with in 20m at 4.6K or do you want to be half a lap down?