That's a good idea. But, I think eventually, Footlocker will realize they are a relic of the past.
Cross-Country is a team sport and great individuals make great teams.
That's a good idea. But, I think eventually, Footlocker will realize they are a relic of the past.
Cross-Country is a team sport and great individuals make great teams.
Because of this wrote:
Around 2007 they were letting the top NXNers into footlocker.
Wejo’s idea would completely sink Footlocker. Not a single runner would want to run Footlocker regionals if they can go to NXN and qualify.
....
The problem for FL is that the top runners are already not going to FL.
Last year Oakley and Clinger were at NXN
This year Tuohy and Hasty will be at NXN...
Expect this trend to continue and increase with time unless something is done about it.
Uhddciji wrote:
Because of this wrote:
Around 2007 they were letting the top NXNers into footlocker.
Wejo’s idea would completely sink Footlocker. Not a single runner would want to run Footlocker regionals if they can go to NXN and qualify.
....
The problem for FL is that the top runners are already not going to FL.
Last year Oakley and Clinger were at NXN
This year Tuohy and Hasty will be at NXN...
Expect this trend to continue and increase with time unless something is done about it.
That’s because more and more coaches/athletes are realizing what Footlocker is...a meet that HAD some prestige that is held only to line the pockets of the event organizers. They don’t do anything special for the athletes like Nike does, the results are slow and antiquated, they could work with Nike to get the best athletes but choose not to. It’s a joke!
I think the tide is changing to where the NXN Champion will now be recognized as the National Champ.
"great solution"---twice.
Wow, I wish I had thought of that idea when NXN was started. Oh wait, I did...but simply couldn't implement it.
I guarantee you lot of others, including both parties involved, thought of it as well. Making it a reality is on them.
I don't get why this isn't easy enough to do. It would also draw more attention back to Footlocker and help cement it as THE final championship race for the season.
This solution is brilliant if implemented.
After suggesting that the top 5 NXN finishers get automatic tickets to FL, the article states: "Everyone wins. If Tuohy — or whoever wins NXN — chooses not to compete at Foot Lockers, that means they forfeit their chance at the individual national title. "
This is wrong. If Tuohy wins NXN she would already BE the individual national champion, and would forfeit nothing if she or her family choose to not travel to San Diego for whatever reason.
Here is how you fix the problem: move NXN back a week so it is on the same weekend as FL. Give the top 4 or 5 finishers at each FL Regional an automatic invite to NXN. Then, if those runners choose not to compete at NXN, that means THEY forfeit their chance at THE individual national title (to put a twist on it...)
XC is either a team sport or an individual one. Make it like NCAA and just have one championship (NXN)
Do those of you who say FL needs to be held after NXN think there should be two championships and separate regional qualifying races at the college ranks?
This is why: you're wrong. Everyone knows Claudia and Katelyn are the 2 best by far. We all knew this like maybe 6 weeks ago. It is natural for Claudia to stay with FL because she is the defending champion, and because it's a couple hour drive from Malibu. Katelyn should have started planning a trip to San Diego a month ago and racing the appropriate races to qualify for FL. Hell, it's still a 5 hour plane ride whether she goes to Portland or San Diego. Katelyn is the one ducking Claudia.
Nope wrote:
This is why: you're wrong. Everyone knows Claudia and Katelyn are the 2 best by far. We all knew this like maybe 6 weeks ago. It is natural for Claudia to stay with FL because she is the defending champion, and because it's a couple hour drive from Malibu. Katelyn should have started planning a trip to San Diego a month ago and racing the appropriate races to qualify for FL. Hell, it's still a 5 hour plane ride whether she goes to Portland or San Diego. Katelyn is the one ducking Claudia.
Gosh. You're talking about a HS girl as if she should plan her life around trying to beat some other HS girl at XC. This isn't a professional, it's a kid. I can think of 30 reasons why a HSer might prefer NXN that have nothing to do with "ducking" anybody.
Are Nike products sold at Foot Locker?
Just seems like they could and should work together more, although I like the fact that there are two separate events.
What would the world be without some drama and disagreement?
Here's an idea:
USATF grows some stones and decides to create a REAL national championship. Stick with the regional format, akin to what NXN has now, except no namebrand sponsor (free market, all of the big companies will have to pay USATF to get their gear on site).
Each of 4-8 regional meets hosted at convenient, well-established venues (Van Cortland, Woodward, etc)
-all HS comers welcome, including any eligible individuals and teams
-Top 3 teams advance, top 10 non-team individuals advance.
At national meet have essentially 3 championships:
-individual championship (the real allure of current Foot Locker)
-high school team championship with standard NCAA scoring (the real allure of current NXN)
-Regional championship with team scoring dictated by top 5 or 7 scorers from each region (the new fixture)
THE KEYS:
-the winning region gets to host nationals the next year at THEIR venue
-top 10-20 runners at nationals are automatic qualifiers for USATF juniors
But of course, this will never fly, because IT MAKES TOO MUCH SENSE
Runnerofruns wrote:
But of course, this will never fly, because IT MAKES TOO MUCH SENSE
You want to add a THIRD championship? You want to add USATF into it?
Doesn't make sense to me.
How about this: Footlocker holds the discretion to invite whoever they want to their meet in addition to their regional qualifiers. They could STILL do this for this year. It is their race, their rules. If they want to invite Katelyn Tuohy to run Foot Locker next week, IT CAN STILL HAPPEN!
Runnerofruns wrote:
Here's an idea:
USATF grows some stones and decides to create a REAL national championship.
USATF already has a national championship for juniors. It is not a scholastic organization.
Thinking so very far outside the box wrote:
How about this: Footlocker holds the discretion to invite whoever they want to their meet in addition to their regional qualifiers. They could STILL do this for this year. It is their race, their rules. If they want to invite Katelyn Tuohy to run Foot Locker next week, IT CAN STILL HAPPEN!
I've been told this idea was floated a while back ... Katelyn Tuohy would decline any invitation to Foot Locker at this time ... Tuohy is running NXN for two reasons, (1) she really is a team-motivated runner and North Rockland had an outside shot this season if their injured runners could get better quick enough and (2) Katelyn Tuohy said Jordan Hasay was her running idol ... next thing you know, Jordan Hasay was selected to be the Nike representative at the NXR New York race (maybe it was just a coincidence:)).
Have also been told by people I believe know the story, that the Foot Locker-Nike National XC Championship Race almost happened ... but a major disagreement on one issue caused a problem.
Nike required that the race by held in Portland so they could showcase their campus, etc.
Foot Locker did not object to this requirement ... However, Foot Locker demanded that the race be held at a better runner's location than Portland Meadows ... and no alternative location in the Portland area seemed acceptable to Foot Locker, so they tried to negotiate a move to another location ... as we know, the negotiations died for this and other reasons ... If the Nike campus was located in California near a decent XC course, who knows??
Thankfully Nike switched to the Glendoveer golf course ... Wonder if the golf course had been used once and it had been a "dry" season in Portland when the negotiations started?? ... Mary Cain was willing to race against Baxter, Cranny and Efraimson her senior year at Portland Meadows, but Alberto Salazar told Nike "No", she might get hurt in that mud-hole ... Quick switch to Glendoveer which has helped Nike attract more individual runners.
wejo wrote:
It's a shame some years the top boys and girls don't get to race all of each other at one true high school cross country national championship.
A great solution would be for Footlocker which is a week after NXN to let the top 5 or 10 athletes at NXN into their meet.
This seems to be like a great solution for everyone. NXN still has what it has, nothing changes.
Footlocker can ensure that it gets the best individuals racing each other year after year.
Then fans get the best athletes to race on another.
What are the drawbacks to this? Can anyone see why Footlocker shouldn't do this?
Two observations:
* I think you've lost perspective. This is High School. These are 17-18 year old kids. They don't need to entertain us. Simply making one of these meets as an individual is an awesome accomplishment and a virtual guarantee of a D1 scholarship. We don't need the NXN finishers to jump on airplanes a week later to prove that they're the best. As you mention, they'd be at a disadvantage, too, so what does it prove if they don't win FLN? Nothing.
* I think you're a closet socialist. This is capitalism. Two companies have created two meets and have put $$$ into them. I don't have inside info, but I'd be shocked if they're making $ off of them. They're investing in these meets to build their brands. In so doing, they've created excellent meets that give athletes an amazing opportunity to showcase their talents and compete on a national stage. That's enough. We don't need to 'fix' it.
So, I say thank you to Nike and Foot Locker! And bravo! to the kids who make it to these meets.
Oh? wrote:
They were doing that prior to the NTN/NXN Regional system, and stopped doing it because the NTN athletes were "only" team runners, and some of those team runners weren't as fast as the #9/10 finishers at the Footlocker Regional races
That was nice they tried to do this, but as you stated it deprived some runners who had qualified, so I understand why they stopped.
I thought the Nike team idea was okay, not great, but as it turns it I think it is fine, because it simply gives people more choices. What I disagree with is that they're being jerks about it and trying to call their team meet an individual championship. I don't like that they keep trying to compare themselves to the Footlocker Nationals which is entirely for the best individuals in the country. If they stopped trying to rule everything, then I'd be fine with people having the two different choices, and leave it at that.
I personally don't care which meet Tuohy or any other runner competes at and feel this is every person's individual choice. She can be the individual champion at the team meet and be satisfied doing that, as long as that's what she wants to do. What I don't like is Nike's push to try and tear down any young runners who don't go to their meet, regardless of how good they are.
To me that's just bad sportsmanship on their part.
Personally I feel that Footlocker Nationals is a great meet and is fine to keep doing exactly what they're doing.
And I'm okay with Nike's meet, feel it's a good opportunity for teams, but don't like their bad sportsmanship.
If they cleaned up their act and stopped trying to rule the world, then I think this would be much better for everyone.
Thanks for the perspective. Looks like you missed Denner from California in your NXN preview.
BMeylan wrote:
Thinking so very far outside the box wrote:
How about this: Footlocker holds the discretion to invite whoever they want to their meet in addition to their regional qualifiers. They could STILL do this for this year. It is their race, their rules. If they want to invite Katelyn Tuohy to run Foot Locker next week, IT CAN STILL HAPPEN!
I've been told this idea was floated a while back ... Katelyn Tuohy would decline any invitation to Foot Locker at this time ... Tuohy is running NXN for two reasons, (1) she really is a team-motivated runner and North Rockland had an outside shot this season if their injured runners could get better quick enough and (2) Katelyn Tuohy said Jordan Hasay was her running idol ... next thing you know, Jordan Hasay was selected to be the Nike representative at the NXR New York race (maybe it was just a coincidence:)).
Have also been told by people I believe know the story, that the Foot Locker-Nike National XC Championship Race almost happened ... but a major disagreement on one issue caused a problem.
Nike required that the race by held in Portland so they could showcase their campus, etc.
Foot Locker did not object to this requirement ... However, Foot Locker demanded that the race be held at a better runner's location than Portland Meadows ... and no alternative location in the Portland area seemed acceptable to Foot Locker, so they tried to negotiate a move to another location ... as we know, the negotiations died for this and other reasons ... If the Nike campus was located in California near a decent XC course, who knows??
Thankfully Nike switched to the Glendoveer golf course ... Wonder if the golf course had been used once and it had been a "dry" season in Portland when the negotiations started?? ... Mary Cain was willing to race against Baxter, Cranny and Efraimson her senior year at Portland Meadows, but Alberto Salazar told Nike "No", she might get hurt in that mud-hole ... Quick switch to Glendoveer which has helped Nike attract more individual runners.
Hasty will go down