yyy wrote:
Bekele was running in a time of EPO. The 5000m todays convinces me that there is less doping today than a decade ago.
Yeah, that´s why they ran the marathon so much faster 10 years ago...oh wait...
yyy wrote:
Bekele was running in a time of EPO. The 5000m todays convinces me that there is less doping today than a decade ago.
Yeah, that´s why they ran the marathon so much faster 10 years ago...oh wait...
That's why Dibaba should triple as all these championship races are going to the kickers.
"Also a guy who happens to have 12:48."
When I was a high school runner, my personal best in the two mile was in the 9:30's, but when I had to lead from start to finish, perhaps in not that great conditions? 9:50's. Point is, he's a 12:48 guy in good conditions, and probably not leading from start to finish. if he leads, he gets blown out of the water at the end most likely.
If I was MF I would win Rio and plan a couple of wr attempts at 5/10, then focus on winning world xc (which I think he could do) preferably more than once. Ignore the marathon. Then I'd call him GOAT. Even if he won xc and only got close to wr he still would be goat to me.
Ndiku is a 3:29 guy, but he has not shown that kind of form for quite a while, and he came the closest here. When you don't have athletes willing to sacrifice and trade laps, then you get slow races that perfectly suit his abilities. The 10k was a pretty good attempt, considering the conditions, to see whether he had the ability to kick off of a fast pace, but even there a 27:01 with a very fast finish means that it was on pace for considerably slower most of the way. Mo's never broken 12:53, so how about getting Kejelcha or the other Ethiopian to pace Gwet toward mid to high 12:40s and see what happens. Or have Kejelcha do what he did at Dubai to disrupt Mo by forcing him to go hard before he wanted to. But let's face it: Mo is by far the best guy at 5 and 10 right now. With Ndiku firing on all cylinders next year or the year after, there might be more of a challenge, though, because he has run 3:29 and has a very good kick when full strength.
This is how you run a 5000m race.
jjjjjjj wrote:
Ndiku is a 3:29 guy, but he has not shown that kind of form for quite a while, and he came the closest here. When you don't have athletes willing to sacrifice and trade laps, then you get slow races that perfectly suit his abilities. The 10k was a pretty good attempt, considering the conditions, to see whether he had the ability to kick off of a fast pace, but even there a 27:01 with a very fast finish means that it was on pace for considerably slower most of the way. Mo's never broken 12:53, so how about getting Kejelcha or the other Ethiopian to pace Gwet toward mid to high 12:40s and see what happens. Or have Kejelcha do what he did at Dubai to disrupt Mo by forcing him to go hard before he wanted to. But let's face it: Mo is by far the best guy at 5 and 10 right now. With Ndiku firing on all cylinders next year or the year after, there might be more of a challenge, though, because he has run 3:29 and has a very good kick when full strength.
Kejelcha just missed a bronze by .52 seconds and a silver by .68 seconds. Why in god's name would he blow up his chances to act as a rabbit for Gebrhiwet? No one who can qualify for a championship final would be willing to just rabbit for another runner. The best bet is going to be a country like Kenya that can qualify 4 in a WC agreeing to work together, and we saw how successful that was in the 10,000. I also don't understand why so many people seem to think that a runner with a better PR would do well to take it out fast. It didn't work for Bekele in 2003 when he finished third behind Kipchoge and El G.
You can't win a championship race from the front, with hard steady pace, unless your shape is 10 sec better than the entire field (5000). Clarke never pulled it off in a champs, Pre only when running against collegiates and slow Americans. Since Mo is always in mid-12:40s (maybe 12:50 if tired from 10K), that is too tall an order for anyone running nowadays.
Hence, it becomes a sit-and-kick, until a 12:35 guy comes along.
Yes, this. The slower the pace the more Farah's strength advantage is neutralized. That leaves his speed advantage and guys will take their chances with that rather than be run off their feet before the last lap. People say go hard from the gun but NOBODY is going to sacrifice their own chances at a medal, particularly if they think they have a good kick, just to try a tactic that won't work. If Ndiku went hard from the gun he wouldn't have medaled. Now he has a silver medal and this will bring him a lot of $$.
Yes, but it's not the Tour de France is it, there are not domestiques sacrificing themselves for a team leader. For these East Africans it's a tilt at their own glory and a possible escape from poverty in many cases.
Iri wrote:
What...? wrote:. Anyone who thinks you can beat him in a fast race is a fool. Look at the stats.
What stats??? No one has ever tried to run a fast race against him since before 2011. It's always a slow race. His competition is completely stupid. Unless you have 3:28 1500m ability, don't try to outkick him off of a slow pace! I don't understand what these guys are thinking. The obvious best chance too beat him is a fast pace.
The Kenyans should just enter Kiprop, Kiplagat, and/or Manangoi to the Rio 5000m race next year if they want to make a real challenge for the gold medal.
They could be running 66 seconds all the way instead of 72.
Front running doesn't mean running a suicidal pace like 60 or 61 seconds.
But running 72 seconds for 2000m meters is converting the race into a 3000m which really only started in the last km. They just signed their death sentence by doing that.
Decisions wrote:
Altough he has potencial he lacks balls.
Did you see prefontaine classic 10km? He was so reluctant in maintaining the pace when he realized it depended on him. He wouldn't even stay there for more than 200meters!
After drafting half the race!
And then afterwards he even has the audacity to complain than no one pushed like someone owned him anything! What a wimpy baby!
How can you expect me to like a guy like that?
Needless to say, I've been waiting some time for a fast race, I think we all have been. Then I will understand, you're right.
There was a Diamond league race in New York some years ago where it was quite windy and rainy and even then Gebhriwet just sucked it up and ran from the field, just giving his best. 13 low with such conditions is certainly more impressive than Farah's jogging in Lausanne if you ask me.
Not than I'm really fond of Gebhriwet or really anybody actually.
The point of the race is to win, not beat the clock. I think Mo is very good tactically and he wins races partly due to this tactical approach.
Re: the way to beat him in a 5000m
Wait till there is 3000m left and mo is jogging 15m behind in the back of the pack... Then surge on a straight away and gap him by 30m.
Isn't there anyone that thinks they can run a 3k within 3-4s of mo? Mo's dropped back in a number of championship races... I'm surprised no one had this as a backup race plan.
Bubbadeeboo wrote:
Re: the way to beat him in a 5000m
Wait till there is 3000m left and mo is jogging 15m behind in the back of the pack... Then surge on a straight away and gap him by 30m.
Isn't there anyone that thinks they can run a 3k within 3-4s of mo? Mo's dropped back in a number of championship races... I'm surprised no one had this as a backup race plan.
Did you watch the race? it looks like Mo anticipated just that sort of stratagem.
Decisions wrote:
How to beat a 3:28 guy in a 5000m race?
To be fair, Ndiku has run 3:29.
He struggled with some injury and acted more like in favor of Farah (not intentional) helping the field string out the last 3 laps and allowing Farah not to get boxed and get even more drafting.
If he didn't push the last km, it would be a 2:30 instead of 2:19.
At least he showed some iniciative. The others were just plain retarded.
After they saw him run 27 and ran a heat in a not so shabby 13:20 they just threw that effort away.
They just deserved the loss.
Bad Wigins wrote:
themanontherun wrote:BW, I think you've hit upon something critical here. Can you post height weight, and exact bodyfat percentages for all athletes in the 10k and 5k so we can give this topic the attention is deserves?
too late. He has confirmed it himself.
[Citation needed.]
mo was in more like 3'27- flat entering meet
in monaco he ran 3'28.9 solo for virtually whole race as Asbel had run away up front
mo led the pack in a vacuum the whole away
if camp had paid for 2nd set of pacers for mo, drafting him perfectly to bell, he wouda been looking at gain of 0.7s/lap for drafting
~ 3'27-flat !!!
the question shoud be more like : how to beat a 3'27 guy in a 5k