part of the problem is having it in Edmonton in the first place. Having a championship at altitude on a track thats exposed on all sides is certainly great for fast running. additionally, its about 1 to 4 hour plane ride from anyone in Canada who is actually good at running (in quebec, ontario/ BC).
Acblows wrote:
part of the problem is having it in Edmonton in the first place. Having a championship at altitude on a track thats exposed on all sides is certainly great for fast running. additionally, its about 1 to 4 hour plane ride from anyone in Canada who is actually good at running (in quebec, ontario/ BC).
So every championship meet in Canada should be in Toronto, huh? Also, in the mid distances, how many standards have been run at Nats in recent years? Very few.
It's unfortunate that these guys didn't hit the standard in time, but the good news is they have the Rio standard now. The rules were quite clear and AC is sticking to thei guns ... which is a positive change.
AC always sticks to their guns when it comes to standards, unless the athlete has connections. Ask Shelia Reid about her unearned vacation to London...
GTA = Centre of the Universe? wrote:
So every championship meet in Canada should be in Toronto, huh?
Classic non-Ontarian, have you ever run a distance race in Toronto in late June? Hot/humid as sh*t, made worse by the infinite concrete sprawl. Might as well have the meet in Alabama or something. Pan Ams distance results are indicative of why that would be a bad idea if fast times were to be the priority.
So 51 athletes in a variety of events managed to make the standard. Yes every event is different but there are far fewer opportunities to run 3000m steeple and 5000/10000, yet Canada is sending 5 steeplers, 4 5000m runners and 3 10000m runners. It's too bad the 1500m runners couldn't make it but hey, at least they got the Olympic qualifier out of the way.
Also, while the IAAF deadline may be Aug 9, think about the logistics of it. How far out from a trip to China would you need to plan for it to be a successful trip? The IAAF deadline is likely designed for nations to be able to make last minute substitutions due to injury, and also to fill the athlete quota if necessary. Flights need to be booked, visas acquired, reservations made. Yes, they could be made July 6th or July 18th but you have to draw the line somewhere and the national championship is a reasonable place to draw that line.
But the Internet is not reasonable so keep complaining.
Hate to be the meanie bringing his up but aren't a few of the close-to-standard 800m and 1500m runners with the Victoria National Training Centre?
it just doesn't make sense that they would have a deadline earlier than necessary. As a country, wouldn't you want to send your very best athletes if at all possible?
I suppose it would be one thing if other guys were going in their place, but Canada is now sending no one even though Brannen has the standard? You can say "well that's the rule", but the rule is stupid.
Athletics Canada, just wait until you guys are sad watching the Beijing 1500 with no Canadians in it. They're setting an early deadline as if they're as quality at distance running as Kenya or Ethiopia. Cmon now, that's the stupidest rule ever
Nate finished 5th at the Nationals. Even if he had standard on time he's not going, correct? Thought it was standard and top 3?
Let's be honest ... Canada does not have any competitive 1500m runners at the moment.
1. Brannen - washed up ... to be very honest his best years were when at Michigan? If he was running like Nick Willis I would have a different opinion.
2. CPT - 3:34 ... great for Canada .. sucks at world level (has potential for better)
3. Rae, Riva, Proudfoot and other wannabes ... still in development
Now let's look at our other mid/distance athletes
1. Cam Levins - Legit
2. Mo Ahmed - on his way up in 10,000m and (road racing/marathon future) - legit
3. Matt Hughes - Canadian Record holder with potential for 8.03/5 min steepler - legit
4. Brandon McBride - legit potential
Make the standard or get another job. Every runner growing up had to face this reality sooner or later.
With that being said Athletics Canada really have to get their stuff sorted out as they look like fools on a yearly basis (need a major housecleaning at AC -- bunch of pedantic condescending jerks from what I have seen over my 18+ years in the sport) . I am amazed that such smart people can screw up so much .... obviously Kevin Sullivan cannot bring reality to these people.
It's insulting to the athletes and their coaches who achieved the standard before the deadline and qualified for Beijing to suggest that AC should make exceptions. And it would be especially insulting to the 3000m steeple chase, 5,000m, and 10,000m athletes going to Beijng who who used to run the 1500m but put the work in to move up in events. AC wants to send competitive teams to these events and the reality is that guys in 3:39 shape during qualifying period who recently ran the standard will be eliminated in the 1st round when the top runners in the world were running 3:35 in June and 3:30 now.
Boohoo wrote:
It's insulting to the athletes and their coaches who achieved the standard before the deadline and qualified for Beijing to suggest that AC should make exceptions. And it would be especially insulting to the 3000m steeple chase, 5,000m, and 10,000m athletes going to Beijng who who used to run the 1500m but put the work in to move up in events. AC wants to send competitive teams to these events and the reality is that guys in 3:39 shape during qualifying period who recently ran the standard will be eliminated in the 1st round when the top runners in the world were running 3:35 in June and 3:30 now.
Agreed AC's rule is stupid.
Third and fourth "all time" performers, in a very popular event, should never be left home if something can be done about it.
AC should do away with dumb rules...
I find it incredibly ironic that American Olympic silver medalist Leo Manzano gets a qualifier and punches his ticket to Bejing at the 1500m in Monaco,..
AND Canadian PT beats him in that very race BUT does not get to punch his ticket. AC is really missing the boat on this one. Does Canada have better athletes than the U.S.?
PT's consolation of knocking me down one in the all time Canadian list is insignificant consolation. I feel bad for him and Brannen.
I may have to advise my dual citizen kids to climb the bigger USA mountain than to deal with AC should the situation ever arise.
SAD. We need change, please !!
You missed DAVE REID!
Standard during the qualifying period, which started January 1st and ended on the last day of the Nationals meet in Edmonton. Top-three at nationals.
Edmonton is not located at serious altitude, whoever said that it is at "altitude" it is not high enough.
Whatever the hell happened in nationals is straight from the twilight zone. Although in defense of the athletes it was very, very windy anyway....
Not speaking on behalf of AC, but I would assume that the earlier cut-off date to coincide with nationals is to make nationals exciting - a real competition. But I would argue that making nationals mandatory and top-three is fine, but have some sort of flexible deal where athletes clear the standard afterwards and in a case like the men's 1500m where no one is going anyway, send them after running the standard afterwards. After all, they did do the mandatory nationals race and before the IAAF timeline ran under the AC standard.
Mind you, perhaps AC's is thinking, "try to perform at nationals next time." Not speaking on their behalf as I have not had that conversation with anyone....
But ya gotta wonder, eh.
AC doesn't need an overhaul, they just had one after 16 years. There are a lot of positives to take from Canada's current middle/long distance crop of athletes and the leadership.
There is some fine tuning that all the Monday morning quarterbacks can agree on: Declaration, timing of achieving standard and a few other niggles. But there is a lot of good that is going on too.
What about this idea:
Keep nationals mandatory. Must be top-5 at nationals and under the IAAF standard then you are on-deck. Then by the IAAF deadline, be under the AC standard and be top-three in the nation. Brannen and CPT would be going for sure then. Gives them an opportunity to demonstrate their fitness and nationals gets their race - I mean 4-oh at nationals - if the competition was the idea by having deadline at nationals - then it backfired for some reason anyway.
Hi Doug. What was your user name in 1990 for these forums?
The US system is pretty simple and straightforward, but the larger issue might be the bureacracy (egs Sport Canada) that AC has to deal with. There are many rules which do need to be taken out, tweaked, etc... that really don't make sense if it is truly an athlete centered model, but I'd also say it's somewhat unfair (given the current rules) that those who could've met the requirements in a different manner (egs had standard and then didn't have to worry about placing at Nationals such as the US model).
I'd actually like to know the rationales for being so convoluted in team selection over the years. As noted the USA makes way too much sense....have just the standard go, top three with standard trumps just the standard, no standard stay home....who can argue with that!!??
Humpty dumpty falls down again wrote:
I'd actually like to know the rationales for being so convoluted in team selection over the years. As noted the USA makes way too much sense....have just the standard go, top three with standard trumps just the standard, no standard stay home....who can argue with that!!??
Nobody. No reason to do anything else than that.
It would make too much sense...
Sorry, but the "we need to announce the team to make things interesting" is BS. The people that actually cares are on boards like letsrun. Nobody else actually cares... Don't be delusional.
Let the best athletes compete. That's what the people on the boards want to see. More chances that top level athletes stay in the game that way...
At least AC has done away with the repeat performance test (thought than actual standard) in random time periods.
I know for a fact that some of these rules are pure paperwork (not sure about announcing things to make it interesting). This is bureaucratic mechanism/centered and not athlete centered.
Even the training plans that are required to be sent in amongst other areas are red tape (simple rule should be a requirement to show up fit and uninjured or you'll be billed after the fact). Make it simple, transparent and athlete centered (with even the accountability clause be athlete centered) and then everything takes care of itself.
No Canadian women in the 1500 either.
Did Dave Hill run 3:35 back in the day?