jerry_seinfeld wrote:
Their ability to live and train at altitude is effectively a PED. They should win every year.
What about CSU, WYO. How come they don 't come close.
jerry_seinfeld wrote:
Their ability to live and train at altitude is effectively a PED. They should win every year.
What about CSU, WYO. How come they don 't come close.
jerry_seinfeld wrote:
Their ability to live and train at altitude is effectively a PED. They should win every year.
What about CSU, WYO. How come they don 't come close.
4 National Titles in 19 Years - Mark Wetmore
3 National Titles in 5 Years - Dave Smith
The Colorado teams only have an advantage when racing at altitude against sea-level-based teams. Wetmore himself admitted that his teams' success at the Pac-12 meet was largely attributable to the fact that it was held near Boulder. Some people who live at altitude can do sea-level-equivalent workouts given the right facilities (i.e., a treadmill with an oxygen mask supplying air with normobaric oxygen pressure) but if CU has access to those, it's a well-guarded secret.
Coach McDonnell loved to recruit Kenyans? Check your facts. It was rare for a Kenyan to run for him. He had plenty of Irish and Canadians come through but very few Africans. Oh, and check out the rosters for the teams that won championships. You'll notice they were heavy with Americans.
Vin Lannana had 4 XC National Titles with Stanford
John McDonnell had 11 XC National Titles with Arkansas
McDonnell is the greatest ever.
Actually, six titles in nineteen years, if you count the women. Also, and this is not taking anything away from Smith, who is a fine college coach, but part of college coaching is preparing runners for the post-collegiate level. Other than Ryan Vail, what other OSU graduate has gone on to achieve success in running after college?
Gcol wrote:
4 National Titles in 19 Years - Mark Wetmore
3 National Titles in 5 Years - Dave Smith
Montesquieu wrote:
Also, and this is not taking anything away from Smith, who is a fine college coach, but part of college coaching is preparing runners for the post-collegiate level.
Is it? Says who?
No, college coaching is not about preparing athletes for the post-collegiate level. It is about winning championships and making the school look good.
Wetmore has an appointment at the university that carries with it the obligation to help in preparing his charges for post-graduate life. So, it's not a question of anyone's saying it, but a question of his responsible given his role within the university.
Mr. Obvious wrote:
Montesquieu wrote:Also, and this is not taking anything away from Smith, who is a fine college coach, but part of college coaching is preparing runners for the post-collegiate level.
Is it? Says who?
Clearly, given your moniker, you don't have an appointment at a university.
razorhead wrote:
No, college coaching is not about preparing athletes for the post-collegiate level. It is about winning championships and making the school look good.
razorhead wrote:
No, college coaching is not about preparing athletes for the post-collegiate level. It is about winning championships and making the school look good.
This is exactly right.
CU gets talent, but I tell you what, I don't think there is anyone better at turning 9:15-9:25 guys into d1 all americans than Wetmore. Far more runners of that caliber never make an NCAA championship meet let alone become all-americans.
Montesquieu wrote:
Wetmore has an appointment at the university that carries with it the obligation to help in preparing his charges for post-graduate life. So, it's not a question of anyone's saying it, but a question of his responsible given his role within the university.
Mr. Obvious wrote:Is it? Says who?
OK, so
1. Is this common among running coaches? Is is part of Dave Smith's contract/appointment at OKST?
2. If it is for post-graduate life I think that is wonderful. University personnel, including athletics personnel, absolutely should prepare and care about post graduate life. I don't equate that narrowly to post-graduate running success.
o[adnvo[ wrote:
He is the best recruiter. He finds the guys/girls his system can help enough so they win.
Beat me to it.
The Original Question deserves an honest answer:
John Wooden, UCLA.
I don't know if he's the best. He's very good. The interview the other day made him sound a bit pompous. I met him once at a track meet. He's a really nice guy who has a philosophy that's very Lydiard like. It all boils down to peaking for 1 race. I'd say he's done a very good job of doing just that.
Hingle McCringleberry wrote:
o[adnvo[ wrote:He is the best recruiter. He finds the guys/girls his system can help enough so they win.
Beat me to it.
He also seems to do a good job of recruiting kids who ran very good but not great times at altitude when they were attending East Bumfuk Nowhere High School in the Inter-Mountain West.
Or Dan Gable.
Smith and McDonnell are both awesome coaches who have developed many domestic athletes... But both have won by routinely "sprinkling" in 2-3 proven and pre-developed imported athletes year after year. Ask yourself this question, "How many titles in 19 years would Wetmore have if he did the same (if he reinforced his teams with a 2-3 Africans each year?" ....It's safe and sane to reason that the same Colorado system (plused-up by international athletes) would have yielded a more "McDonnell-esque" number of titles than 4. And, needless to say, we'd probably be counting conference (rather than NCAA crowns) that Oklahoma State has.
Montesquieu wrote:
Actually, six titles in nineteen years, if you count the women. Also, and this is not taking anything away from Smith, who is a fine college coach, but part of college coaching is preparing runners for the post-collegiate level. Other than Ryan Vail, what other OSU graduate has gone on to achieve success in running after college?
Gcol wrote:4 National Titles in 19 Years - Mark Wetmore
3 National Titles in 5 Years - Dave Smith
Wetmore is a great coach who gets his kids to run well when it counts. McDonnell did the same. The difference is McDonnell worked his scholarships into track as well so they could compete for a National Championship in XC, indoor and outdoor. He took me from a 17 year old 4:20 American kid back in the late 70's to run 13:39 andd 28:31 5 years later.