Why wouldn't the best american distance runners join the Hansons now?

Ritz is making way more than $100k a year. He got over $150k to run NY last year alone.

I think the bonus will raise the type of athlete that starts off in their program. The top guys currently go sign somewhere else because they want the guaranteed money and some of them are getting $100k + to start. So a 28:20 guy might think of joining now.

27:22.81 Abdihakim Abdirahman

27:34.72 Alan Webb

27:35.65 Dathan Ritzenhein

27:37.74 Anthony Famigletti

27:59.41 Adam Goucher

28:10.59 Brandon Leslie

28:14.43 Jorge Torres

28:17.49 Ian Dobson

28:18.74 Mebrahtom Keflezighi

28:19.32 Dan Browne

I see your point. These are the top 10 guys in the 10k last year. Every single one came out of college with better credentials than the very best guy on the Hansons squad. Have the Hansons ever had a collegian that ran sub 28:40 before entering their program? I can't think of a single one.

Kevin Hanson was seen chatting up a famous female masters runner after BAA. He was also seen in the company of a pair of well know male masters division marathoners during the long Boston weekend. Will he be branching the team out to include an elite masters program?

Pure speculation of course. He could have just "bumped" into them ;)

Think what a training table conversation would be like if his young runners could draft off the years of running experiences recounted by people in the sport 30 plus years.

Hanson was really designed for the top second tier runners that could not get support anywhere else. Remember, a 2:17 marathoner can develope into a sub 2:12 marathoner with proper support and training. The US throws away to many talented 3:40 1500 meter runners and 2:15+ marathoners.

There should be a hanson system for the many 3:40+ 1500 meter runners. Maybe in that way runners like Josh Spiker and Magness can develop into solid 3:35-3:37 runners. After college what is a talented 1500 meter runner to do. They usually go into a business venture or open up a running store, which is good. However, if you have 3:40 talent you might as well develop further, because most things in life aren't as exciting as breaking a 4 minute mile.

"Hanson was really designed for the top second tier runners that could not get support anywhere else. Remember, a 2:17 marathoner can develope into a sub 2:12 marathoner with proper support and training. The US throws away to many talented 3:40 1500 meter runners and 2:15+ marathoners.

There should be a hanson system for the many 3:40+ 1500 meter runners. Maybe in that way runners like Josh Spiker and Magness can develop into solid 3:35-3:37 runners. After college what is a talented 1500 meter runner to do. They usually go into a business venture or open up a running store, which is good. However, if you have 3:40 talent you might as well develop further, because most things in life aren't as exciting as breaking a 4 minute mile."

Very good point. It's a challenge for some runners to develope in the 4-5 years of college. There has got to be some athletes whom would be world beaters, or at least top U.S. runners who quit competing at 22 years old because they weren't elite yet. I'm all for the Hanson's, you can see some of the positive influence they've had across the U.S. too with the forming of other training groups.

The Hanson also makes the second tier runners faster thus making their more competitive with the very best. The more US runners under 2:15 the more competitive the trials will be.

At one time Josh Spiker was running down Webb in the NCAA. Surely, he can improve on his 3:40 PR and develop into a solid sub 3:36 runner like Lunn and Stember. There has to be a incentive for somebody like Spiker to continue to run.

With support maybe a solid miler like Dan Wilson could make it to the next level. To run with Lagat, Webb, Lukezic, and Myers you need at least 3:36 1500 speed. At the international (mainly African) you need sub 3:35 at the very least to compete.

wineturtle wrote:

Kevin Hanson was seen chatting up a famous female masters runner after BAA.

Kevin is a professional "chatter up." My guess is about 75% of the American elites at Boston got "chatted up." Along with many dozens of non-elites.

Spiker has a shoe contract already, isn't that the break all of you whine about day in and day out? It includes performance bonuses. What additional incentive would you suggest?

The Hanson's training group has certainly helped out US distance running in many different ways, whether directly or indirectly.

That doesn't mean that everything about them is good but this probably isn't the place to get into details of what you know about false promises or what not.

Their current offer is a good offer if someone was able to run those times and became hurt during the year or wasn't able to run at their best. Otherwise, like already mentioned, the runners will have already made the $100k (certainly if a marathoner - a bit less likely if a 10k only runner). Again, it is a great safety net.

The big question is there someone with almost for sure sub 28 talent (top NCAA Div I runner-type) that wants to run for the Hanson's? They have certainly gotten away from their true 10k training for the most part. The program used to be a cross country/10k program and now is clearly a marathon program with some 10k focus.

Several quality runners have gone there and not done too well and a small amount have done seemingly well. It really appears that most will run their best in the 5k/10k in the first year there. There could be several reasons for this but it has to raise some concern.

Mark Meenfe (sp) is their one true shining light on the track. He had ran 13:52 - 13:55 around 4 times over the 2 years before joing the program, all on 45 - 55 miles a week or less of training. So once he got in a program with some training partners and a bit more strength work he was able to improve on his 5k time by 16 seconds. A very good improvement but nothing crazy for the lack of strength he had before. His training partner, Kevin Doyle (sp), came in and didn't improve much of any under the same workout program.

Another question, is how good are the guys that they have brought in?

I would tend to think they have gotten some very very good talent. The biggest problem with people believing this is because they didn't run the times in college. Many of the guys they got were untapped gems.

Anyone that is considering should talk to the guys and ask how they feel about their track training or the ability of the coaches to train in general. It seems like an obvious question to ask but some might forget to ask when woowed by everything else. Maybe the guys do like their track training and maybe they don't.

There is such a system. It's called the "Elite Development Program". http://www.usatf.org/clubs/programs/EliteDevelopmentClubs/

That is good for Spiker then. I read about him in Lear's Alan Webb book - Sub 4. Since reading that book I have not heard much of him. I will look for his name in the 08 trials.

I've seen Spiker's training log a couple of times and it just seemed way too easy to ever become an elite. Granted these were narrow snapshots and not full cycles by any means that I saw. I just hope he can train as he wants to, w/o getting injured again.

Outsider Looking Out wrote:

Several quality runners have gone there and not done too well and a small amount have done seemingly well. It really appears that most will run their best in the 5k/10k in the first year there. There could be several reasons for this but it has to raise some concern.

I am one athlete that falls into that category. The reason that I didn't continue to progress is because of ME. I realized that even if I got down to 28:20 it wouldn't mean shit. The Olympic A standard is 27:48. I realized that not one of the guys running those times was slower than 28:30 in college. I started 30 seconds back from that and it was too much of an improvement and I was not willing to run the marathon. Any disappointment I had was because I wasn't improving as fast as I would of liked. I was improving more than other guys that I ran with in college but not at a rate that made 27:49 realistic. The training is great and the coaches know what they are doing. You better be able to handle mileage though.

At the international level I look at a 3:40 1500 the same way I look at an average major league player hitting 255-260. It is ok, but nothing to write home about. At the NCAA level that kind of time makes you a big deal. As I said before after reading Sub 4 I have not heard a thing about Spiker. He was one of many guys beating Webb in his first year at Michigan. Also it is an unusual name and hard to forget.

A 2:15-17 marathon is also probably equal to a .255+ major league hitter. It is professional time, but not world beating. Hanson is a good place for these kinds of runners to develop. Without Hansons many of these runners would not be competing.

It is nice to also see Dan Wilson still competing. He is probably the best distance runner ever to come out of UCONN. I believe he has dipped just under 4 minutes for the mile. I wish they would produce such a distance runner at Rutgers (just down the road from me).

The elite development club sounds like a good idea.

There was also the "farm team"(?) that featured such runners as Jason Lunn.

Yes, the Farm Team was an "EDC", i.e., part of the USATF Elite Development Program. Here's the most recent list of EDCs around the country: http://www.usatf.org/clubs/search/EDC.asp

uh, maybe because alot of top runners wouldn't want to TRAIN IN WISCONSON!