So we know Ruth is dirty.. but was it EPO or something stronger?

WADA should be making deals with athletes they bust. Reduce the ban if they rat others out and explain who is supplying what.

too many idiots on this thread think marathon would have waited to use EPO until after the 90s track guys moved up and testing started. Complete logical fail.

If EPO was good for marathon, the marathoners of the 90s would have partied on it. Instead they moved the WR modestly from 2:06 to 2:05, while the middle distance records were being obliterated.

By the time the middle distance guys started making their mark on marathon, starting with Tergat finally breaking 2:05, testing was in place, effective at least in and near competition, if not training.

The ABP made epo doping even harder, but that didn't stop the marathon WR's steady march through 2:03 to 2:02 before Kipchoge, and to 2:01 and 2:00 in the Kipchoge era. Someone probably thinks marathon Kipchoge is doing the same thing as early 00s Kipchoge, just because he started back then. Not likely.

It's completely implausible that a blood-booster would affect any event as much as those that approach max VO2. And the evidence backs that up.

So you think those track guys who lowered the 5k/10k stopped using EPO when they hit the roads? You think the huge increase in depth was just coincidence? I think someone is being a bit naive…..

I am completely ignorant on what EPO is. Is the EPO Boost supplement by BRL Sports what we are talking about? Is that stuff legal?

https://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=12376924

No - you give it to athletes in a nation where doping control is still run like the keystone cops with corruption, tip-offs, bribery still extremely prevalent.

Kenyans are "expendable" to these scumbag guys like Rosa, Demadonna etc etc and here is the more sinister but important thing - it's easier to keep them quiet if they do get caught because if they don't who knows what "happens" to them (car accidents, "jumping out of windows"etc).

If you dope a kid in Norway and he gets caught, you better believe you are f-ed. Not the same in Kenya, and that's why it's a hot-bed for this sort of garbage.

Are you saying all of the 29 women who have broken 2:18 are doping?

Do you also believe the true mens world record is 2:05 ish?

Sure but wasn't she busted for a masking agent? Why would you need to mask a genetic advantage? Also, in vivo gene editing is not a solved problem scientifically afaik, save a couple special cases.

Generally, YES. There was testing by then. How dense do you insist on being?

They might have kept using what little they could get away with, but they couldn't do it full throttle like in the 90s. And face it, if it would have helped marathon, the 90s marathoners would have done exactly that. They would have ran 2:03 by the year 2000, or better.

Far more plausible is that the middle distance crew "moved up" specifically because they could not longer do full-throttle EPO. They would have had to go a whole lot slower in their old events. That's what happened to Bekele who tried it. Testing threw up a brick wall from 1500 to 10,000.

Men's 1500WR is still standing. Most of those other records lasted 20 years or more. No modern PED can come close, the loss of EPO stopped them dead.

I suspect Kipyegon has some new inside deal or medical trick allowing full-throttle EPO. The sport is easily corrupt enough for a protection deal. Anyone part of a special Nike promo event, in particular. Kipchoge might have been protected too, but it would have been for something other than blood doping.

HIF stabilizers increase natural EPO and likely also capillary density in the muscles.

The biological passport is deliberately weak I believe. The primary biomarkers can be manipulated with hydration, and all the biomarkers are not the strongest in the scientific literature.

Erythropoietin was produced as a drug for cancer patients who would go on chemotherapy and have all of their red blood cells annihilated. It's the synthetic version of a natural hormone that causes your body to produce more of the precursor that leads to increased red blood cells.

So for an endurance athlete, having more red blood cells allows their bodies to transport more oxygen more quickly. Professional cyclists famously abused EPO throughout the '90s and early 2000s. There was no test for EPO until I think 2000 or 2001, so up until then, the antidoping folks would test for hematocrit content. When the EPO urine test came out, it was looking at bands within the proteins in athletes' urine samples. Naturally occurring EPO has a different-looking band than synthetic EPO. But it's not just an easy positive or negative. The antidoping scientist has to examine the sample and make a judgment call.

Anyway, there are other ways to blood dope—like using blood transfusions or certain steroids like dexamethasone. But EPO, and the newer versions of it like CERA, stimulate RBC production faster and better than the others.

Here's a USADA article on the topic:

usada.org

Blood Doping and EPO: An Anti-Doping FAQ

Hailey Horwath

Blood doping, which may include the use of erythropoietin (EPO), is among the most well-known methods of doping in sport.

Open link

This is the second time I’ve seen dexamethasone mentioned. Yes, it does increase the number of progenitor cells for erythropoietin, as well as potentially increase the sensitivity of these same cells. Most jumps of red blood cells occur at ~8 days after beginning use. The thing is, long term use of a corticosteroid this strong will absolutely destroy someone’s immune system, their skin/hair, cause extreme fluid retention, and even create muscular atrophy. That’s not even mentioning the withdrawal symptoms. For these reasons, Decadron most certainly is not used as part of a typical PED regimen. Occasionally, it is rumored to be used after extreme hard sessions and/or races for quicker recovery.

L-soylentgreenatine

Flintstone chewables?

The C-vid jab?

HWPO?

One thing I’ve wondered since this news broke is why did she test positive for a masking agent now? Presumably she was tested last year before her WR but didn’t test positive for the masking agent until the spring. Was she not using it before?

I heard a rumor from a very good source that there is/was a super drug cocktail that they have found a way to use and get around testing.

The Brits used it in the lead up to the 2012 Olympics, then hid it but it’s now widely out there.

The Brit’s literally dominated everything endurance destroying their previous marks in Track, Cycling Tri’s and rowing. Mo Farah, Bradley Wiggins, Froom and the track cycling performances. The triathlon bros. A few people got shadow banned, Alberto and team Sky executives. No one wanted a Russian doping scandal with GB.

But the method got out and now it’s running rampant through sports.

I think the drugs are the same, it’s how you fool testing. Keep in mind, Lance Armstrong never officially failed a test

Yep.

Your dates are off with respect to Bekele, at least. His career began after EPO testing was instituted in 2000, and he set the 5000 and 10000 world records in 2004 and 2005. He didn't run a marathon until 2014.