I’ll be honest, if Geordie beamish was in that race, Jakob would’ve been cooked.
Um first point Beamish is a US based Kiwi so I don’t think he would ever run the Euro Champs. Second point he is an overhyped let’s run pin up boy who isn’t fit to lace up the spikes of JI. Third point he would rather make lame podcasts than race. Final point El Bakkali would beast Beamish 100 times out of a 100.
Idk Jakob had a perfectly fine race, but I don't think it's anything special for him, nor would it be special from Hocker or Nuguse. When Nuguse ran 3:47.38i in 2023, he closed in 54/25.94.
Not saying he's not great, just saying this doesn't move the needle at all on his kick or fitness or anything. Not that that should be very surprising since he just broke the 1500m WR en route, and everyone else in this race is a level below the guys who are a level below Jakob.
Correct. I am a HUGE Jakob fan but you can watch my reaction from when I was watching this life. I thought for a brief moment in the final 200 that he might lose. Watch it here (8:42 mark):
Even if Jakob breaks the 1500m WR outdoors, I'm going to think he's vulnerable at World outdoors if Cole Hocker and / or Josh Kerr are in the same shape they were last year.
I think when people talk about Jakob having no kick, they mean it in the context of 1500 racing.
Anyway, although this race shows nothing of note coming from a runner of his calibre, I believe he does have a kick even in a moderately paced races just as the 2023WC Semi I mentioned. It's just that it in no way guarantees him a win/makes him head and shoulders above anyone else (that's why he chose to front run last year even though it didn't work out) because there're at least 3 people that could possibly do that as well (that's why he chose to front run last year even though it didn't work out).
If Mirus Yifter had run some 1500ms, would he no longer have been called the “shifter”.
I thought the "Jakob has no kick" discourse died a while back when he kept on winning the global championship 5,000 in dominant fashion over the final lap
But not when he keeps getting outkicked in championship 1500's.
this thread throws out some relevant numbers toward the kick of various guys. jacob 51x in a slower race, i wasn't aware, but the fits the model.
that hocker 12.2 100, i would call that a kick, Coe in the OG 1500 LA 1500 i think was pretty much the same in a 332. and note that Coe wasn't at his best, but was a very reasonable example of himself then again goose closed in 12.3, and was the pace setter.
this kessler might have something to say this year in a slower race,
this laros fellow, is working on strength, going all in on the 1500, but he has the 800 ability. With a basket of guys at 141 the 1500 is the better move, but i'd like to see the laros lad move down. with the aerobic foundation laid, you only need 6 or 8 weeks steady aerobic work to get it back from "muscle memory".
the muscle memory concept, you don't need a billion miles areobic after you have won the ability after several years, have a sports background and do three years steady mileage.
though we kind of knew, is from Canova, a fundamental.
Idk Jakob had a perfectly fine race, but I don't think it's anything special for him, nor would it be special from Hocker or Nuguse. When Nuguse ran 3:47.38i in 2023, he closed in 54/25.94.
Not saying he's not great, just saying this doesn't move the needle at all on his kick or fitness or anything. Not that that should be very surprising since he just broke the 1500m WR en route, and everyone else in this race is a level below the guys who are a level below Jakob.
Correct. I am a HUGE Jakob fan but you can watch my reaction from when I was watching this life. I thought for a brief moment in the final 200 that he might lose. Watch it here (8:42 mark):
Even if Jakob breaks the 1500m WR outdoors, I'm going to think he's vulnerable at World outdoors if Cole Hocker and / or Josh Kerr are in the same shape they were last year.
Nothing has really changed with Jakob and his path to winning a global 1500 once again. It was the same in Paris and it's the same now. Unless he has someone sacrificing themselves to take it out in just under 56, 1.51.5 through 800m and to 1000m in 2.19 (maybe he could become friends with Nordas and they could pull a "Team Morocco" in Tokyo)(kidding) - a race that is basically paced and run like a diamond league, he's going to put down something that rivals Bile and El G in terms of all-time brutality in the final 900/1000m on his own and that's simply not easy.
He's absolutely vulnerable (incredibly) because of that. But he's still has a path and not everyone in the field can say that.
Even if Jakob breaks the 1500m WR outdoors, I'm going to think he's vulnerable at World outdoors if Cole Hocker and / or Josh Kerr are in the same shape they were last year.
Oh for sure, they could even be in worse shape and still potentially beat Jakob. Jakob is a level above Cole/Kerr/Nuguse (at least he was last year), but the lack of pacers, and the insane pace Jakob took it out at, were more than enough to give Cole/Kerr/Yared the edge. Jakob could be in WR shape, and Cole/Kerr/Yared could be in worse shape than last year, and they could all still beat Jakob if he runs a similar race to last year. Jakob had a good run at the top without much competition (really only Wightman and Kerr ever challenged him once each in 2 years), but those days are over. Barring injury from the top 3, they're gonna give Jakob a run for his money no matter what.
I really want to see Jakob crank out a nasty last 1k or 800 similar to what he did today though (but faster). It's much harder to pass at that pace, and the other 3 guys have shown they can hang onto -- and kick nastily off of -- 3:28 pace. Hocker's kick is so good that it might not matter, but unless he's ready to solo a 3:26 low, a massive windup might be best. I'm not gonna say that's how he's gotta do it if he wants to win (bc im dumb literally what do i know), but I'd love to see him try it against his top competition. GST would be the perfect place to give it a shot, and I'm hoping he's a challenger for a race or two specifically to test that out.
I thought the "Jakob has no kick" discourse died a while back when he kept on winning the global championship 5,000 in dominant fashion over the final lap
Why can’t there be any nuance? For a 3k/5k guy Jakob has a phenomenal, potentially all time best finishing kick.
For a 1500m guy he also has a strong finishing kick. However, it is relevant to note that since it is a 1500 he’d have to close faster than that to win worlds this year, if it were to be tactical given that some of his main rivals have closed tactical races faster.
I thought the "Jakob has no kick" discourse died a while back when he kept on winning the global championship 5,000 in dominant fashion over the final lap
Why can’t there be any nuance? For a 3k/5k guy Jakob has a phenomenal, potentially all time best finishing kick.
For a 1500m guy he also has a strong finishing kick. However, it is relevant to note that since it is a 1500 he’d have to close faster than that to win worlds this year, if it were to be tactical given that some of his main rivals have closed tactical races faster.
There are now several other guys with better finishes over the 1500 than Ingebrigtsen and who can now beat him. He needs to run as Salvitore has explained. He may not be able to.
Hocker is one those 'pop up when it matters' kinda runner.
He's planting potatoes for most of the year, if you get my gist.
We’ll see. Historically he’s had a lot of winter/early spring injuries. The Ben Thomas system certainly has peaks and such but as we saw in 2021 when he was fully healthy he had sharpness three/four times and had high-level performances at both NCAAs, Trials and Tokyo.