Toughest Courses in the Northeast?

I know that, but I ranked them based on what I've ran, only because it wouldn't be accurate for me to place a course high and not have ran it, so this is based on my experience. But yes, Kutztown isn't as hard as many other courses.

I have heard about Van Cortlandt Park as well as Sunken Meadows being very hard courses. I think yes, based on other people's thoughts, it should be up there, but I only placed the courses I ran since I don't want to place a course I never ran. Darlington does stay very flat for most if not all of the course. Honestly, I would prefer a course like Greystone where the start is given to you and then toward the 2nd mile it goes uphill.

Based on hs times, Sunken Meadow > Bowdoin Park > VCP and Holmdel (but not by much) and those 2 about equal to Balboa Park in SD for reference.

Ran all these cross country courses and you’re all wimps. None of this is hard. Go run on the white mountains and stop fiddling around with these courses. This isn’t hard.

Darlington? You don't get out much do you

Belmont Plateau in Philly, although the difficulty can be dependent on how recently the grass has been cut.
Brandywine Creek State Park in Wilmington, DE is a net uphill. The original course was probably even harder, even if they started and finished at nearly the same place, you ran all the way down to the creek and then back up.

That's implied in the post.

I was at Holmdel once, it's not hard at all. It's a tough call because no one has been to all the major courses.

Example: Bowdoin Park in Wappingers Falls is a very tough course. As is VCP.

Ive run a majority of these courses that have been mentioned and this is my personal list.

1. Bowdoin Park - Honestly can be 1 or 2 but giving Bowdoin the top spot based on the lack of flat running. Pretty much climb after climb after climb and only one main downhill including another little incline right before the finish when you loop around. There's a reason why no one has gotten close to sub 15 there.

2. Sunkin Meadow - Can flip flop this with Bowdoin as well. 2 brutal hills and the 2nd hill(has a name but im blanking on it) ive seen people walk on it or hands on knees climb up it. Definitely the worst hill ive ever run up but I remember passing a good 20 people on that hill alone bc of the walkers. They do have some flat which is why I put it at 2 but the flats don't feel great bc of the hills. The course record is also relatively slow but it isn't as popular of a course.

3. VCP - This was my home course in hs and I came back once in college and it sucks if you don't run it that often but the hills are rolling and the downhills are a huge boost. The far, super straightaway finish often kills people bc they start kicking too early but I was experienced on the course so I knew when to push, make moves, etc and not go out too hard bc its very flat to start.

4. Holmdel - This course gave me my breakout race in hs so it didnt treat me as bad. The bowl wasn't the worst thing in the world and pretty sure post bowl is flat and back into the woods is all downhill til the straight finish which is the last mile. Probably the most "fair" course I ran.

5. Garrett Mountain - Liked this course a lot. Flat and fast til the last 600 meters lol. I barely got to run on flat and fast courses so this was good

Correct. Now whether MD is in the "northeast" is debatable but if so, this is the right answer.

Assuming we're talking about highschool. You must be joking if your considering VCP a hard course compared to other northeast championship courses (it is definitely the best course though!). Thetford in VT is hard and our state meet course. We have plenty of tougher courses in VT, including Harwood where I went to school. Having run everywhere I'd have to put a vote in for Derryfield in Manchester, NH being a worthy option. Consistently hosts huge meets and has had many greats run there. The uphill to the ski hill with the steeple barriers kicked my ass.

If we're including college courses the answer is West Point by a wide margin imo. I think it made Cornell's course look like a walk in the park. Fun thread.

I dont as I mentioned before. My local course is Greystone. Kutztown & Holmdel were part of the PTXC and Shore Coaches Invitationals. Darlington was ages ago as I lived in the area before.

Everyone has different thoughts on courses and I respect yours, but some people (including myself) have tougher times on certain courses. Holmdel for instance with me is the hardest, as I am horrendous with hilly parts like the Bowl, which is a steep inclined near the 2nd mile. Hence my 20:06 PR for that course. It's a hard sport. Lots of training involved with it. Plus it's HS

Knowledge of NY only

Hardest STATE or big meet level courses from my perception:

1. Monroe Woodbury

2. Sunken Meadows

3. Bowdoin

4. VCP

I only have knowledge of the 4k course at VCP. It didn't seem that bad to me. I think very strong runners can dominate that course, while incomplete, but otherwise fast runners can be very mediocre there.

Hereford is harder than all of those.

Cemetery Hill is gone?

nytimes.com

Fighting for a Hallowed and Grueling Ground (Published 2013)

By Winnie Hu

The nearly 100-year old cross-country course in Van Cortlandt Park in the Bronx, a 3.1-mile stretch of woods, hills and ankle-twisting obstacles, has been badly eroded.

Open link

The article doesn't make sense, Cemetery Hill is not part of the 5k course. It's only used in college meets.