No, he doesn't. His best 400 time was 51s at 16. He won't have improved 3 sec. Do you see Quincy Wilson improving 3sec on 44x? Or Ovett and Cruz, who both ran 47 at 17. They didn't improve 3 sec. Maybe 1 sec. Ingebrigtsen will be lucky to get below 50s.
You’ve never actually run or coached, have you? lol
Armstronglivs hasn’t been able to sleep since Hocker rolled Kerr in Paris and Zurich.
The particular claim I was responding to had assumed that Ingebrigtsen is at least 3 secs faster over the 400 than he was at 16. For any highly trained athlete - and especially an age prodigy, as Ingebrigtsen was - that is extremely unlikely. He had been training seriously and competing before puberty. I compared him to Wilson to show how unlikely it is for an athlete who has matured young to carve 3secs or more off their best sprint time in their teens (and the 400 is a sprint). Wilson won't - and neither did Ovett and Cruz, who both ran 47 at 17.
Your comparison with other teenagers isn't relevant because of the fact that - unlike most of them - Ingebrigtsen has been training like an elite since puberty. He is not a relative latecomer to the sport. In contrast with endurance, speed is the factor in an athlete that is least amenable to big improvements through training. Sprinters make only the most incremental gains once they have begun serious training, and most of it is achieved through honing their technique.
Jakob is not a naturally fast athlete. It is obvious seeing him race. He has very little acceleration to call on and no real "sprint gear". It is one of the reasons he doesn't bother with the 800, in which he is relatively mediocre - and certainly for a top md athlete. I would bet the house, the car and the dog he is nowhere near as fast over 400 as most he assume he is. As another poster above suggested - 49-low at the best.
If he was capable of 48 he would be able to run sub-1:43 for the 800. He would have shown that at some point in his career - as Cram did. I can't see it.
You can’t get through your first sentence without being dishonest. The posters claim was that Jakob is now capable of 2.3 seconds faster than he ran at 16, in a theoretical maxed-out performance that his one-off 51.03 was not necessarily. Nothing about “at least 3 seconds.” 48.7 very well may be too fast but it’s not completely outlandish, and it’s not far from 49-low. Your Quincy Wilson comparison was disingenuous and silly, and no amount of anecdotal examples of Herb Elliott or random individual posters is going to tell us whether he’s good for 48.9 or 49.5.
Your assertion that if he could run 48.99 then he would be capable of 1:42.99 is suspect speculation. Parlaying 48.99 speed into back-to-back average 51.49s is unlikely for anyone, even a Jakob type. I am someone who believes he’s capable of 1:44-something in the right 800 if he cared to.
You know, I have no problem whatsoever with guessing he has 49-low open 400 ability. That seems about right. Like you said, he would struggle with the acceleration, so maybe he’d run 49.25 in an open 4 and 48.75 on a relay.
The poster did refer to 48.7 (which is from blocks) but as that is in a 500m event you don't think that requires Jakob is able to run even faster for a 400 event, which would be 48 or 48-low? So 3 secs, or at least 2.5 better than his pr. Whatever. Either way, the chances of an athlete gaining that improvement, who had already trained like an elite athlete for years, is extremely unlikely. For some reason - but none given - you think Quincy Wilson isn't an appropriate example - but I have given others, such as Ovett and Cruz, who ran 47 at 17. They never ran any faster but there was also no likelihood they would have run 2.3secs faster (so 44-high) than their prs, as you think possible for Jakob.
Elliott ran 1:46x for 800 (the same as Jakob's best) on premodern tracks with premodern shoes and he never bettered 50sec for 400. He had a better kick than Jakob. He is a reasonable indicator of what Ingebrigtsen might be capable of over 400. With modern shoes and tracks, possibly 49-low. I made no claim that Jakob might run 48.99 - your dishonesty there - since I was clearly referring to him running 48s - like Cram. There is nothing - NOTHING - that so far suggests Jakob is capable of 1.44 or better over 800, over 2 seconds faster than he has ever run.
This post was edited 3 minutes after it was posted.
No, he doesn't. His best 400 time was 51s at 16. He won't have improved 3 sec. Do you see Quincy Wilson improving 3sec on 44x? Or Ovett and Cruz, who both ran 47 at 17. They didn't improve 3 sec. Maybe 1 sec. Ingebrigtsen will be lucky to get below 50s.
You’ve never actually run or coached, have you? lol
Armstronglivs hasn’t been able to sleep since Hocker rolled Kerr in Paris and Zurich.
No, he doesn't. His best 400 time was 51s at 16. He won't have improved 3 sec. Do you see Quincy Wilson improving 3sec on 44x? Or Ovett and Cruz, who both ran 47 at 17. They didn't improve 3 sec. Maybe 1 sec. Ingebrigtsen will be lucky to get below 50s.
You’ve never actually run or coached, have you? lol
Armstronglivs hasn’t been able to sleep since Hocker rolled Kerr in Paris and Zurich.
Maybe Hocker could give him a better run. Noah likely still wins
There is nothing - NOTHING - that so far suggests Jakob is capable of 1.44 or better over 800, over 2 seconds faster than he has ever run.
Use CAPS all you want but you are wrong. Jakob ran 1:46.44 at the age of 19, without training for the event. Had he raced two or three times more that season and, even without specific training, he might have run 1 second faster - happens all the time. Now imagine if he had spent the next 4 years training for the 800m. There is a lot suggesting that Jakob could run at least low 1:44
There is nothing - NOTHING - that so far suggests Jakob is capable of 1.44 or better over 800, over 2 seconds faster than he has ever run.
Use CAPS all you want but you are wrong. Jakob ran 1:46.44 at the age of 19, without training for the event. Had he raced two or three times more that season and, even without specific training, he might have run 1 second faster - happens all the time. Now imagine if he had spent the next 4 years training for the 800m. There is a lot suggesting that Jakob could run at least low 1:44
Jacob can split a 47 right now and keep that pace. If Lyles split that he would start falling off slowly. The farthest distance someone can sprint at their maximum pace is close to 300 meters. After that endurance slowly kicks in. 500 meters is enough to make it a tight race
The old man is so disingenuous. Elliot ran a negative split 880 under 1:50 with the second lap in 50 point (1:49.3 final time I think, anyone can go check, I don’t have the time). Of course Elliot could have run sub 50 if he’d ever have bothered to try. Old man Armstronglivs knows there’s a difference between not being able to do something vs not having attempted something. But he’ll ignore reality and engage in spine-cracking contortions of logic to attack Jakob.
I have to agree with others who claim that Armstronglivs has fallen over the edge ever since his man-crush Kerr was destroyed in Paris and Zurich.
Use CAPS all you want but you are wrong. Jakob ran 1:46.44 at the age of 19, without training for the event. Had he raced two or three times more that season and, even without specific training, he might have run 1 second faster - happens all the time. Now imagine if he had spent the next 4 years training for the 800m. There is a lot suggesting that Jakob could run at least low 1:44
The old man is so disingenuous. Elliot ran a negative split 880 under 1:50 with the second lap in 50 point (1:49.3 final time I think, anyone can go check, I don’t have the time). Of course Elliot could have run sub 50 if he’d ever have bothered to try. Old man Armstronglivs knows there’s a difference between not being able to do something vs not having attempted something. But he’ll ignore reality and engage in spine-cracking contortions of logic to attack Jakob.
I have to agree with others who claim that Armstronglivs has fallen over the edge ever since his man-crush Kerr was destroyed in Paris and Zurich.
Elliott himself said he never ran faster than 50sec. That he ran close to it in a half mile with a 58sec first lap (Cardiff '58) didn't make him faster, it spoke of his strength and endurance.
In the fantasy land that is Letsrun everyone is faster than the best they ever ran.
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