Cole Hocker training secret: Cycling for 90min-2hrs?

Hey if you can get your 14 year old freshman to run 8-10 hours/week and keep them healthy, more power to you.

so how bad did your cyclist who were running 25mpw of mainly workouts and biking 6+ suck and how much faster do you think they would be at say 50mpw and zero cycling. I have seen enough runners go from 35mpw to 20mpw +5 hours of biking and a couple of swimming to have a lot of faith transference of fitness when you aren’t training much. Would have they have been faster if they just ran for that time? Maybe. Depends on if they get injured or not.

For sure at the HS level, when kids are just starting to run, doing low mileage, often still getting injured, adding in other fitness like biking/swimming/etc is going to do nothing but improve their performances.

In HS I was running like 30mpw and still getting injured all the time. If I dropped that down enough to not be injured and added in a bunch of cross training, or just crossed trained while injured...either way I would have been a hell of a lot faster in HS. I did do some aqua jogging and a tiny bit of biking while injured in HS, but didn't take it that seriously because I didn't yet know much about the sport and fitness in general. Now, with hindsight, I woulda made stuff like aqua jogging and biking a normal part of my training routine. Though of course it's hard to add on extra stuff for a HSer just in terms of free time on top of school all day and practice and homework and family life and social life.

But yes unequivocally you get HSers to start cross training a bunch and their running fitness will improve a ton. Look at Lukas Verbizcas, he ran 3:59 in HS (along with other great times), no way he gets anywhere near that time if he had just been a runner, the fact that he was a triathlete getting in tons of extra fitness from biking and swimming made him reach that level of elite fitness.

Running is more stressful than biking -- mile per mile. You have to cycle at least 3x your run distance to get the same effect on bike.... So 10 mile run requires 30 mile bike to be same stress...

Why 4-5 workouts? We run 2 workouts and a long run per week. Everything else is easy.

When meets start to pile up, we even go to just one workouts per week.

I cycled all summer (100-200mpw) and ended up in the same running fitness as this time last year, after a summer of 50-60mpw running.

For those who say you can’t get your HR up, I found that once I got my “cycling legs” under me, it was easy to get into the 170-190bpm range. Riding/racing with a group of actual cyclists helps. Or just pick a hilly segment and send it..

If you ride enough, you can accumulate a huge amount of time in the “recovery run” HR range. We’re talking 10-14 hr/wk around 130-150bpm. I did a few 4-5hr rides averaging 140. That’s gotta be worth something.

As soon as you stop saying Lactic Acid, Boomer

ya

do 20 % of your base training cycle gym row ski skate .

absolutely.

and back off 5 weeks before competition.

In my experience in triathlon training, one can be just as easily injured cycling (or swimming) as running. The injuries are just different.

taints of steel

I've been wondering about this training approach ever since Nils van der Poel shared his training regimen after winning 10K speedskating gold. Tons of biking in the offseason, then lots of "threshold" work in season. Cool to see some runners are experimenting.

I thought Once a Runner made it clear, there is no secret to running fast, except slowly removing the rubber from your trainers one day at a time.

This sounds a bit like the Furman University stuff that was popular a few years ago, but not much with people at Hocker's level:

furman.edu

FIRST

The Furman Institute of Running and Scientific Training (FIRST®) seeks to promote running as a healthy physical activity by providing training based on

Open link

For a pro, I think the comparison would be between biking and something like an Alter G, a water treadmill like Rupp used, an elliptigo that was fashionable a while back, etc.

Running 1x week isn’t enough. You need to run 4-5x/week. What exactly those workouts are will depend on where you are but in general instead of doing say 7 workouts where 5 are zone 2, you drop say 3 if them and replace those workouts with 90mins on the bike. And you keep the zone 4/5 stuff cause it is sport specific.

Again the reality is you need the right setup as this takes time. If I had an arc trainer in my house, I could do 30-45 mins every morning. I don’t so I end up only doing it 3x/week when I am at the gym. And few HS kids are remotely that motivated.

So true.

Cycling may work for Cole. Others swimming or the arc... Cross training activities that work for one person may not be the same for all runners. Honestly, the most effective cross training is the activtiy you enjoy the most. We can agree cross training can help runners get extra volume or help then keep fit when injured. From personal experience, I ran really well from swimming as I'm sure my cardio taxed more than running. to each their own

Coach Bill Dellinger always thought there was a mileage ceiling at which no further benefit would be accrued , it was his belief cross training would be crucial to advancing marathon times along with shoe advancements.

Considerations need to be made with cross training muscle recruitment for one is different when cycling vs running (more VL dominant). Joint mechanoreceptors cycling RPM vs spm when running. HR response equivalents whatever the medium swim running, cycling, nordic skiing , roller skiing, vs running are not the same and need to be adjusted accordingly.

This does not surprise me. Look at the training of Eric Heiden ( greatest of his generation). Nordic skiiers off season training involves a multitude of different activities.

The most effective prehab for running is to monitor and correct the minor muscle imbalances that occur b4 they become bigger issues.

Great point.

Cross country skiing is the most similar with almost 100% transfer.

I actually enjoy cycling or upright bike, and elliptical is something I can either barely tolerate or hate. The benefit is not that much of a dropoff. Unless it is like Valby where you need to step off the cross trainer directly into the race, it seems ok.

I recall the key issue with FIRST was that it didn't develop your slow-twitch aerobic fitness as well because there was no true easy training, and so runners though they finished or even PR'd still bonked and struggled later in the race.

All the cross training prescribed was to be done somewhat hard in demanding intervals. Even the long run is done somewhat close to marathon pace, the slowest pace asked still being somewhat more demanding than a typical easy run. So all the training would bypass working the slow-twitch fibers, as the 2's a's and b's take over at that intensity.

For half marathons, it's probably completely fine, since you'll finish well before those fibers tap out. Beyond that it's probably best served for people running multiple marathons within a few months of each other that want to maintain fitness built and peaked during the first marathon.

FIRST still may not be a bad approach for marathons, but the cross training in-between should probably be lower intensity instead of what they recommend, and probably as running specific as you can comfortably handle (like an elliptical, arc trainer, or if available an Alter G, XC skiing, or aquajogging).